mormont Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 On 11/26/2023 at 8:49 AM, mormont said: Nice to see Pat Mills finally getting some of that Disney cheddar. And Dave Gibbons, of course, but he got paid for Watchmen. On that point: john 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derfel Cadarn Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 1 hour ago, john said: Surely not. What about James Corden resisting cyber conversion because he loves his son, or something? It was some cheesy bullshit all right but at least it was some original cheesy bullshit (well, apart from the bit where they “let it go,” Elsa did that first). it’s quite hard to put your finger on what makes a fairly standard RTD episode better than a lot of what Chibnall wrote, it doesn’t seem like that high calibre an episode in concept but watching it is somehow more enjoyable. Part of that is Tennant, certainly, but the writing in general just seems to flow better. I quite admire how direct RTD is with what he wants to get across. He needs a moment where the Doctor has to restore Donna’s time lord mind to save the situation but with tragic consequences for his best friend in the universe? Ok, so there’s a big barrier inexplicably comes down in the middle of the engine room. He’s used almost the same idea before with the weird pair of boxes that are apparently specifically designed so the Doctor needs to kill himself in order to unlatch the other box with Wolf trapped inside. The other writers (especially Moffat) might come up with some convoluted pot scenario to get to the same point but RTD is just like, nah, a big barrier comes down. It’s like with his reaction to the question of why 14th Doctor’s clothes regenerated. I read an interview where he was asked this and he seemed totally unfazed by the idea that this shouldn’t work in the lore. He just thought it would be weird and possibly offensive to show Tennant wearing Whittaker’s costume so he changed the clothes. And this kind of direct approach definitely contributes to the streamlined storytelling. Anyway, I’ll definitely watch this one again some time, which is more than I could say for most episodes of the last ten years. There was also 11 killing that alien/god the size of a sun by waving a leaf at it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 2 hours ago, john said: it’s quite hard to put your finger on what makes a fairly standard RTD episode better than a lot of what Chibnall wrote, it doesn’t seem like that high calibre an episode in concept but watching it is somehow more enjoyable. Part of that is Tennant, certainly, but the writing in general just seems to flow better. Yeah, his dialogue is just better, even when it's corny or a bit naff. But even beyond that, timing in general. Comic, dramatic, he just does it better. Like the scene where the Meep and the Doctor arrive at the house. Not even at his most chaotic would Chibnall have had the confidence to write and deliver a scene that way, or apparently trust his directors to. RTD decided to end act 1 and start act 2 that way. Also: he knows what the strengths of his actors are, and leans into them. Chibnall seemed to regularly forget, or just not have a plan to give the actors specific things to work with. Even Moffatt, though a much better writer obviously, did kind of default to one-size-fits-all type scenes and dialogue a fair bit. This episode could not have been made this way with anyone other than Tate and Tennant. john 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 Anyway I am now looking forward to the next episode, Wild Blue Yonder aka The Mysterious One. They're so keen not to reveal anything that through all the trailers so far we've got about 10 seconds of footage, and the names of the guest stars are redacted in the TV listings. Hoping RTD is on the kind of later-season form that gave us Midnight and Turn Left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceChampion Posted November 29, 2023 Share Posted November 29, 2023 IlyaP 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted December 2, 2023 Author Share Posted December 2, 2023 (edited) That was a much stronger episode. Some vibes similar to Midnight, and the goofy elements were unsettling as well as just goofy. Really awful effects at some points though, bafflingly so at times. Ha, big middle finger to everyone demanding he retcon Chibnall's retcons. Nope, RTD has leaned into them. Edited December 2, 2023 by Werthead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted December 2, 2023 Share Posted December 2, 2023 Yeah, definitely RTD pulling from the same well of ideas as Midnight came from. Also about as close as Doctor Who is ever likely to get to The Thing. Very good episode, though I don't know if it's gonna go down as Blink/Midnight type classic. On the effects, to be fair to them I think that stretching humans is a really hard effect to get right, and they just went 'whatever' coz in this context it didn't really matter if it looks a bit shit so they didn't need to wild out over it. The rest of it looked good- excellent set for the ship, considering it was just a bunch of corridors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derfel Cadarn Posted December 9, 2023 Share Posted December 9, 2023 (edited) Dr Who fans: The Timeless Child is the most controversial thing Dr Who ever did! RtD: Hold my beer! Edited December 9, 2023 by Derfel Cadarn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted December 9, 2023 Author Share Posted December 9, 2023 (edited) Due to how they split the Doctors' clothes, 14 canonically did the post-bigeneration scene commando. Lots of interesting stuff there, mentioning Amy, Clare and Bill (#fuckroryiguess), and a hint that the Toymaker was behind the Timeless Child thing? Also, I remember Twelve getting his memories of Clara back, but when did he learn that Bill's consciousness survived? "I made a puzzle of your past, Doctor. Did you like it?" I was expecting Neil Patrick Harris to be pretty predictable, but he gave a terrific performance. Really sinister in places. Also he had the chance to show off his real-life magician skills. Mel showing up was interesting but...random? Just RTD feeling bad about her being the worst-serviced OG Doctor Who companion in terms of stories? Also, new Master incoming. Edited December 9, 2023 by Werthead Ser Scot A Ellison 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted December 9, 2023 Share Posted December 9, 2023 You know, the way RTD did that kind of summed up a huge part of the difference between the way he approaches Who and the way Chibnall did. Chibnall came at the Timeless Child idea all like hey guys I have this cool idea I hope you like it oh you don't oh well hopefully something comes of it well never mind Whereas RTD just went BIGENERATION, BABY!!!! LET'S DANCE!! Anyway, a nonsensical episode but a very fun one. Can't lie, I'm hyped to see where he's going with this. And Gatwa has charisma for days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted December 9, 2023 Share Posted December 9, 2023 Anyway, trailer for the Christmas special. Looks a boatload of fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derfel Cadarn Posted December 9, 2023 Share Posted December 9, 2023 Spoiler Can 14 still regenerate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted December 9, 2023 Author Share Posted December 9, 2023 1 hour ago, Derfel Cadarn said: Hide contents Can 14 still regenerate? Spoiler I saw a suggestion that 15 has effectively been pulled from the future, so if 14 regenerated, he'd regenerate into 15 and then be pulling himself out of his body once again, to close the time loop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derfel Cadarn Posted December 10, 2023 Share Posted December 10, 2023 (edited) One thing that is weird: This episode was confirmed to be set in 2023. Donna got married early 2010. Which makes Rose 13 at the oldest?? She is said to be 15 in the Star Beast. RTD does acknowledge the issue. Not sure why he didnt just set the episodes in 2025, whixh would also explain why 14 isn’t helping out in any contemporary 2024 stories Edited December 10, 2023 by Derfel Cadarn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted December 10, 2023 Author Share Posted December 10, 2023 10 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said: One thing that is weird: This episode was confirmed to be set in 2023. Donna got married early 2010. Which makes Rose 13 at the oldest?? She is said to be 15 in the Star Beast. RTD does acknowledge the issue. Not sure why he didnt just set the episodes in 2025, whixh would also explain why 14 isn’t helping out in any contemporary 2024 stories They ran into this problem before. Rose takes place in 2005, but the Doctor then returns her to London one year later in Aliens of London, so the show is now taking place at +1 year from real time. Sometimes they remember that, quite a lot of the time they don't. I think based on the timeline Donna should leave the Doctor in 2011, so these episodes should take place in 2026 or even 2027. My guess is that the weird reset of the timeline that took place between Ten and Eleven, then the universe being rebooted, then the Flux or whatever else simply revamped the timeline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derfel Cadarn Posted December 10, 2023 Share Posted December 10, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Werthead said: They ran into this problem before. Rose takes place in 2005, but the Doctor then returns her to London one year later in Aliens of London, so the show is now taking place at +1 year from real time. Sometimes they remember that, quite a lot of the time they don't. I think based on the timeline Donna should leave the Doctor in 2011, so these episodes should take place in 2026 or even 2027. My guess is that the weird reset of the timeline that took place between Ten and Eleven, then the universe being rebooted, then the Flux or whatever else simply revamped the timeline. It can sort of be reconciled if one has the Easter special Planet of the Dead happen after the events of the End of Time. The seer on the bus does tell thr Doctor his death is coming, but that still works since it’s relativr to his future. edit: One explanation I like for everyone forgetting all the invasions is that shortly after, UNIT puts retcon pills in the water supplies. Can’t temember where this was mentioned, a book or audio probably Edited December 10, 2023 by Derfel Cadarn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted December 10, 2023 Share Posted December 10, 2023 5 minutes ago, Werthead said: My guess is that the weird reset of the timeline that took place between Ten and Eleven, then the universe being rebooted, then the Flux or whatever else simply revamped the timeline. I feel like the line 'I made a jigsaw of your history' in the card-game scene was added specifically to allow handwaving of any and all continuity and timeline errors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Posted December 10, 2023 Share Posted December 10, 2023 Outrageous! I speak of course about Tennant’s potential salary demands for the inevitable 14th Doctor Disney Plus spinoff. I find the bigeneration a lot less annoying than the Timeless Child. Although it’s quite funny how much RTD likes to have his cake and gobble it down too. Tennant could do a three doctors special all by himself now. It didn’t even have to be an ancient Gallifreyan myth, it could have just been something the Toymaker did. There was a higher chance of him winning the catching game when it’s 2 versus 1. But it does have the unfortunate effect of making Gatwa seem like a offshoot Doctor flying off in a copy of the Tardis. Derfel Cadarn 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denvek Posted December 10, 2023 Share Posted December 10, 2023 It's Doctor Who - if they say 15 years happened between 2010 and 2023, then I'll just assume some kind of weird space-magic phenomena happened and Earth decided to repeat a couple of years. Ser Lany 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltaran Posted December 10, 2023 Share Posted December 10, 2023 It’s all just a big ball of wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey stuff Ser Lany 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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