Football: Guirassy-ing to victory

[Wilbur]

4 hours ago, BigFatCoward said:

They've just played the full audio for the var decision v arsenal on sky sports. 

Interesting to hear their rationale. 

So I watched this footage.  I don't know the answer to this question, so I am being sincere when I ask, "Did the people who are in charge of VAR ever actually play the game?"

Because they are making decisions about individual components of the complex play, but they are ignoring or giving only cursory attention to pretty obvious issues, such as the foul.  It surely does sound like people who didn't actually ever play.

Lots of time and energy spent on where the ball hits Joelinton, and almost nothing on the two-handed push from behind.  Also, in any match I ever played, the ref would have pointed out that having both arms extended into the back of my opponent is unlikely to be a "natural position".  So much focus on secondary and tertiary minutiae that isn't germane to actual game play.

And the discussion around the ball going out over the end line was weird, since they talk about it "going back in play" or something like that.  The lack of standard terminology just highlights the amateurishness of the endeavor.

Also, I remain amazed that the VAR officials don't have access to move the film back and forth themselves, but have to ask for it to be done for them.  Why add the extra discussion, frustration, and heightened frustration through the lack of control over the views of the video?  Talking over each other, lack of clear authority, unclear communications and cross talk.  Such a poor implementation of the process as a whole.

Anyone in charge of this effort and the failure last month in the Liverpool match surely has to see how easily improved this process could be, right?

• Set standards for communication and terms.
• Give control over the video to the video referee.
• Give unitary authority to one of the video referees, and tell the rest to keep it zipped unless they have something useful or productive to say.
• Allow the audience in the stadium / at home to listen to the discussion to enhance transparency.
• Establish better camera angles - the technology exists.
• Use officials who have a sense of how the game works on the field.

Edited November 15, 2023 by Wilbur
added links

[BigFatCoward]

They covered the foul. They said hands on back but no obvious push forward. I'm not sure that I agree (the foul was the only issue people can reasonably actually moan about in my opinion). 

The system is stupid, I never wanted it and nothing that's happened since has done anything but confirm what I thought would be the issues. 

[A Horse Named Stranger]

Meanwhile in the Bundesliga. Fischer has left his post at Union Berlin by mutual consent.

[Consigliere]

Looks like Richard Arnold is going to be the first casualty once Ratcliffe takes over football operations. Reports that Arnold will be leaving before the year's end and United will be making an announcement soon. There's been some rumours for a while that Ratcliffe wants Jean-Claude Blanc to take over as CEO (he's already the CEO of INEOS Sport) and Paul Mitchell to come in as Sporting Director.

[Corvinus85]

https://www.espn.com/soccer/story/_/id/38841805/uswnt-appoints-chelsea-emma-hayes-coach-record-deal

Quote

Chelsea women's manager Emma Hayes has been confirmed as the new head coach of the United States women's national team on a contract through 2027, the U.S. Soccer Federation announced Tuesday.

U.S. Soccer said in its announcement that Hayes will become the highest-paid women's soccer coach in the world.

The rumor mill claims her salary will be close to the men's team coach.

[Consigliere]

Luke Edwards reporting that Callum Wilson is expected to be out for up to 6 weeks with a hamstring injury. Botman's knee injury is apparently worse than first thought - the club's medical staff have been attempting to resolve the injury with rest and non-invasive repair work but there's been little improvement and he might have to undergo surgery, in which case he won't be back until February at the earliest.

Isak is expected to return for the Chelsea game but Sean Longstaff is a doubt. Barnes not expected to be back for another month; same for Elliot Anderson. Dan Burn, Jacob Murphy and Matt Targett expected back around mid-January. Also reporting that Newcastle are considering a January move for Kalvin Phillips.

 

On United's injury front: looks like Hojlund's injury was a muscle strain rather than a torn hamstring so he's expected to be back after the international break; same for Casimiro. Eriksen is expected to be out for another month with a knee injury.

[Consigliere]

Chelsea could be in a spot of bother.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/nov/15/chelsea-fc-face-new-questions-over-how-roman-abramovich-funded-success

[Rorshach]

Well, I'm opening the article and finding the sentence "secret payments that may have breached football’s strict ‘financial fair play’ rules" and I thought to myself "mhm".

But they're welcome to join us on 12 points less than currently displayed.

[Corvinus85]

What the hell happened to Sweden? 3-0 loss to Azerbaijan who even went down to 10 men in the 2nd half. Did they send the U19 team or something? Granted they already were too far away from Austria and Belgium, but still.

And wow Luxembourg has had its best qualification campaign yet. If Slovakia hadn't won today, they would have had a theoretical shot at getting the 2nd spot. The loss to Slovakia in October really killed their chances in the end.

Edited November 18, 2023 by Corvinus85

[AncalagonTheBlack]

So I read that Luiz Diaz scored both goals in the win over Brazil in the World Cup qualifier.

I'm just a pit pissed this happened with Alisson in goal instead of Ederson. 

Since we've been linked to Andre ,would like to know how he performed.

Uruguay beat Argentina with Nunez scoring! Nice 

Edited November 17, 2023 by AncalagonTheBlack

[Consigliere]

 

 

FA to punish clubs over managers attacking referees after Mikel Arteta charged.

Quote

The Football Association will seek tough punishment for clubs who criticise referees, after charging Mikel Arteta for his rant in the wake of Arsenal’s defeat at Newcastle United. 

The FA is understood to be hugely concerned by Arteta’s comments and the statement of support by Arsenal, who strongly backed their manager after Anthony Gordon’s controversial winning goal was allowed to stand this month. 

Telegraph Sport understands the FA will meet with representatives of the leagues and the managers association to warn that regulatory action will be taken against clubs if they support managers who criticise referees. The governing body is worried by the rising tide of disrespect towards officials and will now draw a line in the sand following the incendiary episode with Arsenal. 

It is understood that any statements similar to the one produced by Arsenal, in which the club said they “wholeheartedly support” Arteta’s comments, would therefore face a strong response. 

 

[Consigliere]

Everton have received a 10-point deduction for breaching the Premier League's Profit and Sustainability guidelines. The club will be appealing the sanction.

[BigFatCoward]

13 minutes ago, Consigliere said:

Everton have received a 10-point deduction for breaching the Premier League's Profit and Sustainability guidelines. The club will be appealing the sanction.

I wonder if they will sell out their new stadium in the championship? 

Makes you wonder what City will get. 

Edited November 17, 2023 by BigFatCoward

[BigFatCoward]

1 hour ago, Consigliere said:

 

 

FA to punish clubs over managers attacking referees after Mikel Arteta charged.

 

I can sort of understand in the heat of battle. But a carefully considered statement like they did should attract major penalties, refs are treated appalingly. 

[Consigliere]

9 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said:

I wonder if they will sell out their new stadium in the championship? 

Think Everton still have a very good chance of staying up even with the points deduction. The relegation candidates this season look really weak.

[Mexal]

16 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said:

I wonder if they will sell out their new stadium in the championship? 

Makes you wonder what City will get. 

Nothing. About as much as Chelsea will get.

[BigFatCoward]

7 minutes ago, Consigliere said:

Think Everton still have a very good chance of staying up even with the points deduction. The relegation candidates this season look really weak.

yeah, not being bottom after this few games with a 10 point deduction shows how weak it is down there, one win and they are out of the bottom 3. 

We should just risk it, spend a million bazillion quid in Jan, our squad is ruined, take the 10 point deduction and then crack on as if nothing had happened with a really strong and deep squad. 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

39 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said:

I can sort of understand in the heat of battle. But a carefully considered statement like they did should attract major penalties, refs are treated appalingly. 

Refs across sports have been shit for many years now. That shouldn't be accepted in the first place and it's completely unacceptable now with the prevalence of legal gambling. They need to do better and are not above reproach. It's always gross when a league defends their actions when it's clear to everyone they fucked up. 

[BigFatCoward]

2 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Refs across sports have been shit for many years now. That shouldn't be accepted in the first place and it's completely unacceptable now with the prevalence of legal gambling. They need to do better and are not above reproach. It's always gross when a league defends their actions when it's clear to everyone they fucked up. 

Refs aren't shit, people are shit, the notion that you or anyone else could do any better is laughable. 

They should be trained better or fired, not subject to abuse in the press and online, which is what this behavior from clubs inevitably results in. 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

12 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said:

Refs aren't shit, people are shit, the notion that you or anyone else could do any better is laughable. 

They should be trained better or fired, not subject to abuse in the press and online, which is what this behavior from clubs inevitably results in. 

Nah, refs suck. Tennis is the only major sport that has largely gotten it right. There was an NHL game a few years ago where the ref was caught on a mic saying he wanted to give one team a penalty early just because. An NFL ref was caught telling Cam Newton he hadn't earned the right to get a roughing call despite him winning the MVP that season. Umps in baseball make terrible calls all the time. It happens even more in basketball. And with soccer it's totally inconsistent as well.

Refs need to be better and deserve to be criticized when they suck at their jobs.