NBA the slenderman cometh.

[Proudfeet]

30 minutes ago, baxus said:

You think the leagues had no connections to gambling before? And even if they had none, they had a clear interest in protecting star players, by calling fouls against them more eagerly than the other way around, among other things.

Sports betting was formally legalised a few years back and they are now present in the broadcasts as official partners with their logos on some equipment and broadcasters reading advertisements for them.

Not sure what the before and after difference is for betters and sportsbooks though.

[Slurktan]

2 hours ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

Can't be the norm anymore when leagues are in bed with gambling now. 

Gambling is not relevant to it. TV contracts are where the NBA makes its money and places like Minneapolis or Salt Lake City or New Orleans are never going to really get preferential calls unless they happen to land Jordan or Lebron. It's even worse for Toronto as Canadian ratings do not even count in the tv deals.

[Tywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Maithanet said:

Why not?  Gamblers adjust to the way the game is actually called, just like they always do. 

Only if you're doing in game betting.

1 hour ago, Slurktan said:

Gambling is not relevant to it. TV contracts are where the NBA makes its money and places like Minneapolis or Salt Lake City or New Orleans are never going to really get preferential calls unless they happen to land Jordan or Lebron. It's even worse for Toronto as Canadian ratings do not even count in the tv deals.

TV deals might get shaky in the future. Only the NFL in North America is immune from this. Gambling is a giant new well. 

[Maithanet]

40 minutes ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

Only if you're doing in game betting.

No.  Gamblers know that Lebron and Tatum and Doncic get more calls than regular NBA players.  I don't see the issue.   

[Tywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Maithanet said:

No.  Gamblers know that Lebron and Tatum and Doncic get more calls than regular NBA players.  I don't see the issue.   

The issue is it shouldn't ever be that way, especially when certain players are known to hunt fouls. The Sixers with Harden and Embiid were unwatchable. 

[Maithanet]

41 minutes ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

The issue is it shouldn't ever be that way, especially when certain players are known to hunt fouls. The Sixers with Harden and Embiid were unwatchable. 

Sure, I wish stars didn't get the benefit of calls, but they always have, going back to at least Magic and Bird, and probably earlier than that.  I don't see how gambling increasing in importance changes that at all.  They seem completely unrelated. 

[Arakasi]

It’s not that quite cut and dried. James went through a 1-2 year period in 21/22 where if you compare the number of drives he was taking vs the number of FTA he was getting it looked like he was not getting the benefit of star calls.

[Tywin et al.]

3 hours ago, Maithanet said:

Sure, I wish stars didn't get the benefit of calls, but they always have, going back to at least Magic and Bird, and probably earlier than that.  I don't see how gambling increasing in importance changes that at all.  They seem completely unrelated. 

We know this always has happened, but the massive amount of gambling money should change things. Just recall when Cam Newton was told by a ref when he got drilled in the head that he hadn't earned that kind of roughing call, but breath on Brady and he'd get one. 

Or when the NHL ref was caught on a hot mic saying he was going to give one team a penalty just because at the start of the game. 

Or even more, just the entire history of boxing.

 

[DMC]

Gotta say I agree with Maith that legalized gambling is pretty orthoganal to shitty refereeing.  Shitty refereeing, at least in the form of star players and big market teams getting preferable calls, will always exist and always has.

This is of course extremely frustrating as a fan of a small market team like the Magic.  If Paolo Banchero was in a big market he'd probably average five more points a game just by getting to the line and/or the downstream effect of defenses laying off him on drives to avoid whistles.  But that's just they way it is.

Edited January 12 by DMC
Spelling refereeing is hard!

[BigFatCoward]

How the fuck can a proffesional basketball team get outscored nearly 2-1. 

I know OKC are hot but come on, that's down to lack of effort, which is inexcusable. 

[Tywin et al.]

20 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said:

How the fuck can a proffesional basketball team get outscored nearly 2-1. 

I know OKC are hot but come on, that's down to lack of effort, which is inexcusable. 

They ripped Portland to pieces without playing their starters much. SGA, Chet and Giddy just played around 20 minutes with hilarious stats. That's crazy. The +/- numbers are comedy. And like I said before, Scoot is not the prospect many were expecting. 

[Tywin et al.]

Also, SGA is getting into that top 5 category. I find his game to be boring, but he's becoming a monster. 

[DMC]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

And like I said before, Scoot is not the prospect many were expecting. 

Yeah.  I really don't like knee-jerk reactions cuz they can often be way wrong (look at Suggs!), but I'm really surprised Scoot didn't come out guns a blazing.  Still plenty of time though.  

[Tywin et al.]

3 minutes ago, DMC said:

Yeah.  I really don't like knee-jerk reactions cuz they can often be way wrong (look at Suggs!), but I'm really surprised Scoot didn't come out guns a blazing.  Still plenty of time though.  

Has Suggs been good? Like I said I haven't watched many Magic games, but his stats are really weird. Idk what to make of them and he's someone (hometown bias) that I wanted to shine.

And you're right, you can't judge a player too quickly, just that Scoot was talked about like this slam dunk star of the next wave. But then again Wemby was even more so and that's not going as expected. 

[DMC]

1 minute ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

Has Suggs been good? Like I said I haven't watched many Magic games, but his stats are really weird. Idk what to make of them and he's someone (hometown bias) that I wanted to shine.

Well, his offense isn't great or anything, but he's improved his 3 point percentage to 40 percent -- and at a high volume.  That will probably regress a bit (he's been on fire the last few games), but he's figured out how to be a complementary player on offense rather than driving around with his head cut off and taking low percentage shots.

Then there's the D.  There's plenty of press on Suggs' defense this season, just google.  But the best thing to do is simply youtube, dude is relentless.  Never seen anything quite like it when he's on.  Right now, any observer worth their salt would put him on the first team All Defense team.  And the advanced metrics - as skeptical as I am of them when it comes to basketball - back that up.

Most importantly though, he's just been able to stay (relatively) healthy.  The funny thing about watching every Magic game is dude gimps around like he's injured about 90 percent of the time.  And then he turns it on zero to sixty.  He's quite the character and he wears his heart on his sleeve.  Love rooting for him.

10 minutes ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

just that Scoot was talked about like this slam dunk star of the next wave.

Agreed, he certainly "is not who we thought he was" in terms of immediate results.  Just saying he's still 19 until February.

[Tywin et al.]

Also @DMC, Boston lost by over 30 tonight with their main lineup. It's going to be a random year. 

[DMC]

1 minute ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

Also @DMC, Boston lost by over 30 tonight with their main lineup. It's going to be a random year. 

Yeah, my brother especially enjoyed that.  Context though - about as tough a back-to-back as you can get.

[Tywin et al.]

3 minutes ago, DMC said:

Yeah, my brother especially enjoyed that.  Context though - about as tough a back-to-back as you can get.

Well they did play the Wolves without two starters (KP also didn't play), but the team overall seems like a glass cannon. Even if fully healthy Idk how they make a deep run. They need to add something and shouldn't worry about trading a bunch of picks to do so. 

[Tywin et al.]

Also with Suggs I still think his best attribute is being a natural leader. Normally I find that kind of comment to be useless, but he represents it to a T. With his size and improved shooting he will be a solid piece. 

[DMC]

14 minutes ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

but the team overall seems like a glass cannon.

Right.  Like I said in the email, it's entirely precarious -- of course especially with KP.  About trading the picks, I dunno how much value the Celtics' pick have.  It's not like other teams don't know those are unlikely to be anything but 20-30 for the foreseeable future.

11 minutes ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

With his size and improved shooting he will be a solid piece.

Yeah I really love how he's essentially established himself as the third cornerstone with Paolo and Wagner.  And you're right about his leadership - his 120% effort is infectious.  Plus Paolo is becoming everything you could hope for.  If he was on a big market team his run since the start of December would be all the NBA media would be talking about.  Wagner too continues on a solid trajectory -- except his three point percentage eats dick this year.

Not much to complain about.  The tricky thing now is surrounding them with the proper players.  The Athletic had a statistical analysis recently that had the Magic as the worst shooting team in the league.  If you watch the games, didn't need a statistical analysis to know that. 

Figuring out how to turn all their other assets into something that can become a championship caliber team is going to be very interesting.  And it has to happen in the coming months -- they're running out of time before they have to pay those three.