The BlackBear

The Walking Dead Season 7 (Comic Spoilers) What? Was the joke that bad?

440 posts in this topic

28 minutes ago, PetyrPunkinhead said:

I concur with all of those statements. (Fucking Daryl!) Glenn's eye popping out was just chill inducing. Even when they showed behind the scenes clips of it during Talking Dead I got skeeved out. 

This show now only has four cast members left from the first season: Carol, Daryl, Carl, and Rick. That's less than even GoT, right?

And Morgan.

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35 minutes ago, PetyrPunkinhead said:

I concur with all of those statements. (Fucking Daryl!) Glenn's eye popping out was just chill inducing. Even when they showed behind the scenes clips of it during Talking Dead I got skeeved out. 

This show now only has four cast members left from the first season: Carol, Daryl, Carl, and Rick. That's less than even GoT, right?

You forgot Morgan. 

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To be honest, I had to remind myself how last season ended before watching this one. I wasn't expecting two deaths, but those are the two who were expected. I like the idea posted upthread from that article - kill Abraham last season, then Glenn in this one.

This episode was good. Uncomfortable as hell, but the tension was there. Not a fan of the excess gore, but then again this is one of the show's hallmarks, so meh. Andrew Lincoln was great, I thought. I don't even know what kind of sounds he was making at the end there, he just didn't even sound human. So yeah, good job on that. This is about where I dropped out of the comics, so I know a little (Ezekiel and his tiger) but not much more than that. Can't say I'm all that interested. It's something to watch at this point when I have time. It's certainly not something I look forward to. Is it too much to hope for that after they take care of Negan (I assume they do), they find other, bigger, more caring communities and start to actually make a world worth living in again? Maybe some people who know something about the god-damned virus? Maybe a secret underground lab working on curing the damn thing? Just something other than unending bleakness please and thank you. Why do I watch this again?

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On 10/23/2016 at 10:12 PM, kairparavel said:

Well,  I suspected Abraham would get it and then Glenn because of some reaction by someone. And ayup. 

I totally love JDM. Just not sure about how this season goes. I was turned off at the comic at this point. 

Glenn was almost certainly dead given some production stuff  (and obviously comic precedent)that came out. It was a question of who else was going. 

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6 hours ago, red snow said:

Is it bad of me that I couldn't help think "you all slit a bunch of people's throats in their sleep not so long ago"? Granted Negan revels in the torture and that separates them but there could have been people in his crowd loved those folk (p)rick and co killed. Love Rick's new nickname too :)

 

What do you think was going to happen if those people had found Alexandria?

Edited by Castel

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22 minutes ago, Castel said:

 

What do you think was going to happen if those people had found Alexandria?

See that's the thing, we know what would have happened.  They would have killed one person and forced the others to a shitty deal.  They explicitly said that in the episode where Jesus "hired" Rick and Crew to kill them. (The Rick and Crew did the exact same thing to Jesus's people which was amusing)

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6 minutes ago, Slurktan said:

See that's the thing, we know what would have happened.  They would have killed one person and forced the others to a shitty deal.  They explicitly said that in the episode where Jesus "hired" Rick and Crew to kill them. (The Rick and Crew did the exact same thing to Jesus's people which was amusing)

Which is exactly the problem with acting like Rick and co. slaughtered innocent lambs (which is a weirdly pervasive response). Like, the entire point of the whole of the Hilltop episode is that you simply can't coexist with Negan except as his client.

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3 hours ago, Castel said:

 

What do you think was going to happen if those people had found Alexandria?

 

2 hours ago, Slurktan said:

See that's the thing, we know what would have happened.  They would have killed one person and forced the others to a shitty deal.  They explicitly said that in the episode where Jesus "hired" Rick and Crew to kill them. (The Rick and Crew did the exact same thing to Jesus's people which was amusing)

I think it shows how in the world the Walking Dead has created it's "survival of the meanest". Team Rick walked over the Alexandrians because they were tougher. Now Negan and his crew are walking over all of them.

2 hours ago, Castel said:

Which is exactly the problem with acting like Rick and co. slaughtered innocent lambs (which is a weirdly pervasive response). Like, the entire point of the whole of the Hilltop episode is that you simply can't coexist with Negan except as his client.

It would have been a good plan if they'd done some recon first and realised they were only taking an outpost out. Although maybe the alexandrians and Jesus' are the ones who should have had more intel.

Harsh but effective. That's what Negan does too. He needs farmers and to show who's boss. Like I said the main difference is that none of Rick's gang enjoyed what they did. Negan seems to relish it.

We also can't call Abraham and Glenn innocenct lambs either. We just knew them better.

I also noticed one of the Westworld hosts is in Negan's gang. The dude with the marker pen was the villain who drinks milk, right?

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22 minutes ago, red snow said:

 

It would have been a good plan if they'd done some recon first and realised they were only taking an outpost out. Although maybe the alexandrians and Jesus' are the ones who should have had more intel.

Well, that's the bottomline, isn't it. It's not that the Show has depicted Rick's gang as too harsh, or not harsh enough. It's that they have been depicted as incompetent, whichever level of harshness they might be operating at. The way in which Season 6 turned into a disaster for Rick's bunch was a case study in incompetence. From woodsman Darryl getting surprised by Dwight and others multiple times, to Rick leading his gang blindly into danger, without any notable scouting, strategic skill or anything that would justify them being the survivors of 6 Seasons of conflict, combat and survival of the fittest.

It was laughable.

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Very tense episode indeed. I already knew Glennwas going to bite the dust due to previous rumours, but Abraham's came as a total surprise. Then we had that tense moment when Carl was on the ground and Rick had to chop off his hand.

As someone who has not read the comics, can someone tell me to what extent the show deviates from it.

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8 hours ago, Gertrude said:

To be honest, I had to remind myself how last season ended before watching this one. I wasn't expecting two deaths, but those are the two who were expected. I like the idea posted upthread from that article - kill Abraham last season, then Glenn in this one.

This episode was good. Uncomfortable as hell, but the tension was there. Not a fan of the excess gore, but then again this is one of the show's hallmarks, so meh. Andrew Lincoln was great, I thought. I don't even know what kind of sounds he was making at the end there, he just didn't even sound human. So yeah, good job on that. This is about where I dropped out of the comics, so I know a little (Ezekiel and his tiger) but not much more than that. Can't say I'm all that interested. It's something to watch at this point when I have time. It's certainly not something I look forward to. Is it too much to hope for that after they take care of Negan (I assume they do), they find other, bigger, more caring communities and start to actually make a world worth living in again? Maybe some people who know something about the god-damned virus? Maybe a secret underground lab working on curing the damn thing? Just something other than unending bleakness please and thank you. Why do I watch this again?

Yeah, I wonder about that too. Is the show ever going to move towards some sort of resolution, or will it simply be Rick and his merry band of followers braving the apocalypse and dealing with one group after another of shitty and shittier people, and becoming progressively shittier themselves in the bargain?

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38 minutes ago, Pecan said:

Yeah, I wonder about that too. Is the show ever going to move towards some sort of resolution, or will it simply be Rick and his merry band of followers braving the apocalypse and dealing with one group after another of shitty and shittier people, and becoming progressively shittier themselves in the bargain?

I just wonder how many of the starting group from Season 1 will remain at the end of the series? I suspect it will only be Rick and Carl. With Rick maybe dying in the last episode, leaving Carl as his legacy for the new world that he helped create.

Edited by Free Northman Reborn

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5 hours ago, red snow said:

 

I think it shows how in the world the Walking Dead has created it's "survival of the meanest". Team Rick walked over the Alexandrians because they were tougher. Now Negan and his crew are walking over all of them.

It would have been a good plan if they'd done some recon first and realised they were only taking an outpost out. Although maybe the alexandrians and Jesus' are the ones who should have had more intel.

Harsh but effective. That's what Negan does too. He needs farmers and to show who's boss. Like I said the main difference is that none of Rick's gang enjoyed what they did. Negan seems to relish it.

We also can't call Abraham and Glenn innocenct lambs either. We just knew them better.

I also noticed one of the Westworld hosts is in Negan's gang. The dude with the marker pen was the villain who drinks milk, right?

Maybe, but that's a different discussion than "I don't feel bad for you cause you murdered some people and thus deserve it". Them possibly being incompetent is something else, especially since the upshot might have been killing MORE people (or less or the right people).

And I can't think of anything Glenn has done that puts him in the same category as Negan's and his operation? 

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5 hours ago, Pecan said:

Yeah, I wonder about that too. Is the show ever going to move towards some sort of resolution, or will it simply be Rick and his merry band of followers braving the apocalypse and dealing with one group after another of shitty and shittier people, and becoming progressively shittier themselves in the bargain?

I figure it will just be shitty people after shitty people until they figure the cow has run dry. I expect a pretty shallow arc in the very last season that ends on an upswing. I guess I'm not the perfect target audience for this show because I'd rather explore the rebuilding and mystery of how things happened then just jump from one danger to the next. This was why I couldn't care less about Fear the Walking Dead. I know it's been discussed to death, but they had that chance to explore the fall of civilization and they did it with a time gap. Fuck them.

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Curing the virus or finding out how it happened has never been a part of this show nor the comics.  If someone cures it, it won't be Rick's group, and curing it won't solve the problem of a fallen world.  Groups like Negan's would still exist.  So Rick's group's end goal has to be about rebuilding a society that can protect everyone from people like Negan and his successors.  I'd guess this episode and this season will mark the half way point.  From now on, it will be about allying with other groups, forming larger alliances and rebuilding society, but each stage of that will involve a whole mess of mistakes.

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A quick look on the comic book wikipedia page tells me that after the Negan arc the story is moving towards a greater attempt to rebuild civilization, but with more cycles of violence interrupting the process. So this whole thing is an incredibly slow developing story about humanity (or a part of it) returning to civilization. Of course, the show might just milk the cycle of violence plot until they decide to call it quits. So, yes, at this point I'm not sure I want to continue watching. Maybe if just to see how they deal with Negan.

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2 hours ago, SpaceChampion said:

Curing the virus or finding out how it happened has never been a part of this show nor the comics.  If someone cures it, it won't be Rick's group, and curing it won't solve the problem of a fallen world.  Groups like Negan's would still exist.  So Rick's group's end goal has to be about rebuilding a society that can protect everyone from people like Negan and his successors.  I'd guess this episode and this season will mark the half way point.  From now on, it will be about allying with other groups, forming larger alliances and rebuilding society, but each stage of that will involve a whole mess of mistakes.

I know it's not part of the comics (at least as far as I've gotten), but the show did include a brief stop with the CDC guy. I can't even remember what he told him - maybe just that they were all infected? The show has veered off comic script before, so hoping it would in this way is not completely out of the realm of possibility. I don't expect Rick's group to do anything about it, but someone, somewhere might. And it would be really cool for Rick's group to interact with that group, even if only for a little bit.

Anyway, my point was that if this was the kind of show that actually addressed how it got this way or try to solve the zombie problem instead of dealing with them individually, I'd be more interested, but it's not, so I'm not. I liked the man v man nature of it for a while, but it's too much for me now. Their forward progression is waaay too little in relation to their brutal set-backs for my tastes.

Edited by Gertrude

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9 hours ago, Castel said:

Maybe, but that's a different discussion than "I don't feel bad for you cause you murdered some people and thus deserve it". Them possibly being incompetent is something else, especially since the upshot might have been killing MORE people (or less or the right people).

And I can't think of anything Glenn has done that puts him in the same category as Negan's and his operation? 

A totally different conversation as I never said I didn't feel bad for team Rick - I just pointed out that they do questionably things and those actions had direct consequences.

I'm pretty sure it was Glen who was popping knives into the ears of people at the outpost? Or am i misrembering. Killing people in their sleep, irrespective of how evil they might be isn't exactly heroic. He still didn't deserve to go out the way he did.

3 hours ago, Corvinus said:

A quick look on the comic book wikipedia page tells me that after the Negan arc the story is moving towards a greater attempt to rebuild civilization, but with more cycles of violence interrupting the process. So this whole thing is an incredibly slow developing story about humanity (or a part of it) returning to civilization. Of course, the show might just milk the cycle of violence plot until they decide to call it quits. So, yes, at this point I'm not sure I want to continue watching. Maybe if just to see how they deal with Negan.

This is the comic spoiler thread so I'll go ahead and make general comments but assuming they follow a similar trajectory, the season will be a bit Flash Gordon in trying to convince all the small kingdoms that with their combined efforts they can take down an enemy that's unstoppable if they try separately. It's a nice notion but I'd prefer what tends to happen in history where factions join to overcome the enemy only to realise the truce was always an uneasy one and one of the victors essentially fills the void.

I'll spoiler the next bit as it's quite specific to the comics

there's a hint that Negan is almost a necessary evil within a "better" society. The wild dog you let loose on your enemies as long as you always have him on a leash. The idea has some merit and there's a certain level of retconning of Negan in terms of how he always tries to maintain he had to rule that way or no way - but has a certain respect for Rick being able to do so in a more peaceful manner. I'm up to date on the trades (not single issues) but I think there's a good chance Negan could become Rick's "black-ops" man and advisor. The only problem is the TV show reminded me of how what he did to Glenn was unforgiveable. Societies can forgive or deal out "fair" judgement but as the show pointed out Glen was Family and it doesn't sit well with me that Rick would put society above family.

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12 minutes ago, red snow said:

A totally different conversation as I never said I didn't feel bad for team Rick - I just pointed out that they do questionably things and those actions had direct consequences.

I'm pretty sure it was Glen who was popping knives into the ears of people at the outpost? Or am i misrembering. Killing people in their sleep, irrespective of how evil they might be isn't exactly heroic. He still didn't deserve to go out the way he did

Sure, the bolded is a fair clarification. I read your post as sort of implying that, if they didn't morally have it coming it was a sort of comeuppance. 

As for Glenn being "heroic"...that's a high standard isn't it?  It may not have been heroic, but was it evil? If they hadn't tried to kill Sasha, Abraham and Gregory after killing a whole bunch of other people and repeatedly stating their intention to run an apocalyptic protection racket they'd still be alive. Whether they died in their sleep or standing up seems secondary. 

I just don't think there's much overlap. Rick and his group have flirted with some shady  shit, but they've always pulled back from it. They're harsh, arrogant and dangerous and maybe did something tactically unwise, it's not even close and it's not cause "we know Rick's group better".

 

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11 hours ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

I just wonder how many of the starting group from Season 1 will remain at the end of the series? I suspect it will only be Rick and Carl. With Rick maybe dying in the last episode, leaving Carl as his legacy for the new world that he helped create.

I always thought that Rick and Carl have plot armour, at least until the end of the show.

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