Hobbit: Desolation of Smaug spoiler thread

[Centrist Simon Steele]

I kind of don't want to see this movie just because they insist on calling it the Desolation of Smowwwg. I don't know how you pronounce it, but every time I've ever heard the dragon's name said it was Smog. All this Peter Jackson shit of being smarter than the rest of us is annoying. And the first Hobbit movie sucked.

I'm just going to go read the book again. It was pretty good and fun if I remember.

[Stannis Eats No Peaches]

I kind of don't want to see this movie just because they insist on calling it the Desolation of Smowwwg. I don't know how you pronounce it, but every time I've ever heard the dragon's name said it was Smog. All this Peter Jackson shit of being smarter than the rest of us is annoying. And the first Hobbit movie sucked.

I'm just going to go read the book again. It was pretty good and fun if I remember.

I don't think you can blame them from using the correct pronunciation. Anyway, I've never thought that Smaug (with the diphthong pronounced as "aw" rather than the correct "ow") and "smog" sound that similar. Is this an accent thing?

[Ghjhero]

I kind of don't want to see this movie just because they insist on calling it the Desolation of Smowwwg. I don't know how you pronounce it, but every time I've ever heard the dragon's name said it was Smog. All this Peter Jackson shit of being smarter than the rest of us is annoying. And the first Hobbit movie sucked.

I'm just going to go read the book again. It was pretty good and fun if I remember.

I know what you mean. It annoys me too how they say Smaug, it just sounds wrong.

[Corvinus85]

I kind of don't want to see this movie just because they insist on calling it the Desolation of Smowwwg. I don't know how you pronounce it, but every time I've ever heard the dragon's name said it was Smog. All this Peter Jackson shit of being smarter than the rest of us is annoying. And the first Hobbit movie sucked.

I'm just going to go read the book again. It was pretty good and fun if I remember.

You English speaking people with your inability to pronounce words phonetically. I laugh at you. ;)

[Centrist Simon Steele]

I don't think you can blame them from using the correct pronunciation. Anyway, I've never thought that Smaug (with the diphthong pronounced as "aw" rather than the correct "ow") and "smog" sound that similar. Is this an accent thing?

Is it correct though? Show me where you can prove that as it turns out, through my quick google, that it is FAR from settled on how to pronounce it, and that some snobby nerds made up the whole Smowwwwwg bullshit.

This is from an appendix: All these diphthongs [in the books] were falling diphthongs, that is stressed on the first element, and composed of the simple vowels run together. Thus ai, ei, oi, ui are intended to be pronounced respectively as the vowels in English rye (not ray), grey, boy, ruin: and au (aw) as in loud, how and not as in laud, haw.

But that just doesn't prove it to me. Smowg. So dumb. It's like when the new Conan came out and the guys who made it were like "you've all been saying it wrong idiots! It's not Co Nan, it's Conan, like Conan O'Brien." Yeah, fuck off to them too.

Here is a good article on why all you smooowwwgers are wrong: http://middle-earth.xenite.org/2012/10/24/what-is-the-correct-pronunciation-for-smaugs-name/

[Ghjhero]

I haven't read the Hobbit in a while so can someone please clear this up for me? In DOS Bard mentions that Girion was his ancestor that tried to kill Smaug. I don't remember this person at all from my readings, was he an actual resident of Dale created by Tolkien or more bs made up by PJ?

[The Grey Wolf]

Girion is an ancestor of Bard and was created by Tolkien himself. The fact he tried to kill Smaug isn't from the book though.

[The Marquis de Leech]

I've always pronounced it Smawg. It sounds better than Smowg or Smohg (the latter being how Smog sounds to my ear).

At least I get Cirdan and Celeborn right.

[Buckwheat]

"Smog" to me just means something else. I first heard it pronounced "SmAUg", from the movie, and I think it makes sense that way, funny English phonetical rules aside. :P

[protar]

I always pronounced it Smorg. Smaawg just sounds weird.

[Koi No Yokan]

I've always pronounced it Smawg. It sounds better than Smowg or Smohg (the latter being how Smog sounds to my ear).

At least I get Cirdan and Celeborn right.

Yeah, same. At least it rolls off the tongue well for the characters!

[red snow]

You English speaking people with your inability to pronounce words phonetically. I laugh at you. ;)

Pretty much. For every rule for how a collection of letters should sound there's a dozen others that shit on the rule. Tolkien was a linguist so I'm assuming he did know how the name was pronounced - I'm sure he probably has it written down somewhere in one of the books or appendices. If it differs from that then I can see how people could get pissy. As it is the film says it the way I would so I'm cool with it.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

FANTASY WORK PROUNCIATION FIGHT... go!

;)

[Stannis Eats No Peaches]

Is it correct though? Show me where you can prove that as it turns out, through my quick google, that it is FAR from settled on how to pronounce it, and that some snobby nerds made up the whole Smowwwwwg bullshit.

This is from an appendix: All these diphthongs [in the books] were falling diphthongs, that is stressed on the first element, and composed of the simple vowels run together. Thus ai, ei, oi, ui are intended to be pronounced respectively as the vowels in English rye (not ray), grey, boy, ruin: and au (aw) as in loud, how and not as in laud, haw.

But that just doesn't prove it to me. Smowg. So dumb. It's like when the new Conan came out and the guys who made it were like "you've all been saying it wrong idiots! It's not Co Nan, it's Conan, like Conan O'Brien." Yeah, fuck off to them too.

Here is a good article on why all you smooowwwgers are wrong: http://middle-earth.xenite.org/2012/10/24/what-is-the-correct-pronunciation-for-smaugs-name/

That article is quite interesting actually. Before I saw the first Hobbit film, I always pronounced it Smawg. Then they pronounced it Smowg in the film which surprised me. So, when I got home, I looked up the pronunciation page in the Silmarillion like a good little nerd and it did say "au" should be pronounced "ow". That article has certainly made things less clear cut for me, so thank you, but I can only assume that the film crew have done their research. Maybe we can get Christopher Tolkein to record himself saying it?

I'm a bit confused by Rauros as well, the waterfall on the Anduin where the company stops and Boromir dies in FotR. The pronunciation notes say it should be row-ros, but raw-ros sounds better to me, because waterfalls make a roaring sound... :dunno:

I've always pronounced it Smawg. It sounds better than Smowg or Smohg (the latter being how Smog sounds to my ear).

At least I get Cirdan and Celeborn right.

Are they pronounced Keerdan and Keleborn?

I always pronounced it Smorg. Smaawg just sounds weird.

Those two sound the same to me... :dunno:

[naz]

The weird thing about the Smaug pronunciation is that THIS is where Peter Jackson feels it's important to stick to canon. No one but the nerdiest nerdboy would've complained if they decided to pronounce it "smawg". Yet they decide to change everfuckingthing else.

[naz]

double post

[protar]

Those two sound the same to me... :dunno:

Maybe I'm writing it wrong. But the film pronunciation of "smowg" sounds weird to me. I pronounce it Smorg. No "w".

[naz]

triple post. grrr.

[Corvinus85]

The weird thing about the Smaug pronunciation is that THIS is where Peter Jackson feels it's important to stick to canon. No one but the nerdiest nerdboy would've complained if they decided to pronounce it "smawg". Yet they decide to change everfuckingthing else.

Ok, we get it.

[Gaston de Foix]

Re the dwarf-elf love thing, it's important to remember that dwarves are the one race not created by Illuvatar but rather by Aule the Valar, and Tolkein makes a point of stressing that they are made differently physically.

Ugh, the whole thing is just such an abomination. I will just point out that the film is not only badly made (poor CGI etc etc) but also internally inconsistent in terms of plot. In the first movie, Galadriel promises Gandalf aid against Dol Goldur, but in the second movie, Gandalf wanders in and gets himself captured anyway with nary a hand from Galadriel. No doubt a butterfly will flit by Gandalf in the third movie, and Galadriel will come to his rescue on a giant eagle or some such rehash of LOTR movies and crap film-making.

I still can't shake the feeling, from the first movie, that I am having a nightmare in which I watch a bad parody of the Hobbit movies and I will wake up soon. It's almost as bad as seeing the Hobbit in bookstores and seeing those hyper-offensive words; now a major motion picture. O Tempora, O Mores.