Only Two More Books, Really?

[John Suburbs]

It seems there are a lot of stories to wrap up on just two books. We have:

Dany, who must make her way to Westeros, with her army and all her followers, and then somehow wrap things up with Tyrion, Vic, Ser Jorah, etc., including, apparently, Khal Pono

The Iron invasion of the south

The Northern machinations with Stannis, Bolton, etc.

Jon and Mel at the Wall

Brandon et all in the cave

The conflict at King's Landing with Cersei, the High Sparrow, Margaery and the Tyrells

Arya

Sansa and Littlefinger in the Vale

Jaime, Brienne and Lady Stoneheart

Aegon and the Golden Company

Sam and Maester whosit at the Citadel

Now, it's possible (actually, almost certain) that many of these threads will merge and then subsumed entirely into the Fire and Ice finale, but it seems like there is a lot to get done in relatively few pages (1200 per book is my top estimate) and I can't see how it will come off without seeming forced.

I recall there was a scifi/fantasy writer in the 80s (can't remember his name) who promised a three-book series, which turned into five, then seven, then 12 and by then most of his fans had left him. I hope GRRM has it all worked out so that all main threads get closure. But based on the books so far, I expect the next two to feature a number of sudden deaths that will leave story arcs unfulfilled.

[Hippocras]

I think once the hidden connections are revealed the impossible will suddenly seem more possible. Things are not as unrelated as they seem.

[Shadrich]

Yeah I find it hard to believe he will fit everything in two books.

However, if both books will be similar to ASoS, in terms of how fast the story advances, I think he could fit in 2 books. I think TWoW will be to ASoS, what ASoS is to AFFC, if you know what I mean :P But I wouldn't be at all surprised if there were three more books.

[Lord Spark of House Spark]

Davos needs to find Rickon as well.

[Ilúvatar]

Two more books actually seems about right to me. As you said, there's going to be a lot of sudden deaths and characters failing to complete their goals.

I recall seeing at least one interview where GRRM talks about the number of books of he aims to write, and while he likes the idea of finishing on 7 (seven kingdoms, faith of the seven), he won't force it. If he needs to write more books to tell the story properly, he will.

[Fragile Bird]

I believe that GRRM is going to reduce the number of POVs, which means more character deaths as well, and likely a faster told story.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

I suppose they will be huge books.

[Graven]

I recall reading that, if he didn't manage to wrap things the way he wants, there is the possibility of an 8th book, which would be something i would look foward, if it wasn't for George Martin's writing speed, not to say that if that was the case, the show would finish way way earlier than the books.

[Roddy the Ruin]

I think we could possibly have 8 books

[Stannis Eats No Peaches]

It can be done in two, yet three seems just as possible a scenario.

[Victor227]

Nothing ever ends. At some point along the line, the curtain is going to close. We don't need to reach the end of Westerosi history to do it, or tie up every loose end for everyone on the planet.

[The Mad Wolf]

Two more books will probably take ten years to come out

[White Ravens]

GRRM said:

“I think there are two types of writers, the architects and the gardeners. The architects plan everything ahead of time, like an architect building a house. They know how many rooms are going to be in the house, what kind of roof they're going to have, where the wires are going to run, what kind of plumbing there's going to be. They have the whole thing designed and blueprinted out before they even nail the first board up. The gardeners dig a hole, drop in a seed and water it. They kind of know what seed it is, they know if planted a fantasy seed or mystery seed or whatever. But as the plant comes up and they water it, they don't know how many branches it's going to have, they find out as it grows. And I'm much more a gardener than an architect.”

The man is loving the process of writing these books and I and I think three more books is more likely than two, regardless of the "official" word from him and his editors.

[Littlefinger's dagger]

Also to be considered: he may reach a point where there are still loose plot threads, but he's tired of writing in this world under all this pressure. He may do as L Frank Baum did and allow others to run loosely supervised in his universe.

If Bantam approached him with a deal to let the HBO showrunners, and only them, write follow-on novels that take place before and after the events in ASoIaF, so long as he had some say and the requisite dump truck of cash was provided, I think he might consider it.

[Lady of Dragonstone]

I think once the hidden connections are revealed the impossible will suddenly seem more possible. Things are not as unrelated as they seem.

I agree. Once some of the past storylines get resolved, most of the remaining characters' arcs will converge into groupings, and we are already seeing that. It's possible for a third book and some may say it's necessary but if you've checked out the sample chapters then you'll see that the story is moving along and convergence is taking place already.

We've already got Dany, Tyrion, Victarion, Jorah, and Barristan together in near places. (Three storylines -- Dany, Ironborn, Jorah/Tyrion.)

Justin Massey, the Iron Bank, and Arya in Braavos. (Three storylines here) ETA: I forgot Asha and Theon here.

Stannis, Boltons, Northern lords, Jon Snow, Mel, Mance and wildlings and possibly Rickon all together. (Multiple storylines)

In the far south we've got Arianne, Doran, Aegon, JonCon, Sam, Alleras, Jaqen, the Citadel in general. (Multiples yet again.)

In the Crownlands the Tyrells, the Lannisters, the Faith, and some of the Martells already poised for war. Nearby, LF and Sansa in the Vale.

So if you look at it by region alone, many seemingly unrelated or far-off plotlines are coming together, and I think we will see many POVs eliminated that way. And if you want an example, the Lannister family was pretty much knocked out in one fell swoop, it seemed like to me (with Tywin, then Kevan dying, Lancel rebelling, and Cersei falling from grace, all of which happened in a short period of time -- or at least, it seemed like it to me).

[40 Thousand Skeletons]

Also to be considered: he may reach a point where there are still loose plot threads, but he's tired of writing in this world under all this pressure. He may do as L Frank Baum did and allow others to run loosely supervised in his universe.

If Bantam approached him with a deal to let the HBO showrunners, and only them, write follow-on novels that take place before and after the events in ASoIaF, so long as he had some say and the requisite dump truck of cash was provided, I think he might consider it.

This will never happen. This series is GM's biggest literary work of his life. He has already made it clear that he doesn't like fan fiction, and the HBO showrunners aren't novelists for that matter. Whatever they write would lack all of the GM style. Though I could see him giving permission for say, a show about RR to be made or something TV related.

And I could totally see 8 books happening, but I want to have faith that he really is determined not to let the TV show overtake him and finish the next 2 books quickly. If the show passes the books, I won't know what to do with my life, and these forums will be divided between show-watchers and non-watchers.

[Sylva Santagar]

If Bantam approached him with a deal to let the HBO showrunners, and only them, write follow-on novels that take place before and after the events in ASoIaF, so long as he had some say and the requisite dump truck of cash was provided, I think he might consider it.

Gods be good...... What a horrible thought.....

This will never happen. This series is GM's biggest literary work of his life. He has already made it clear that he doesn't like fan fiction, and the HBO showrunners aren't novelists for that matter. Whatever they write would lack all of the GM style.

:agree:

[DavidJC]

I think however the 6th book ends will determine if there will be a possible 8th. If Winds efficiently moves the story well along and sets up a final act, then it will stay at 7, however, if Winds just moves the story along like Dance did then the series will have an 8th. The books just haven't found the right stride since aSoS, and if Winds doesn't get it back... Who knows how many books we get.

[DavidJC]

We also still have to go places:

Valyria

Casterly Rock

Asshai

The far North

[Ser Creighton]

Only 2 more books, and I doubt Martin has any desire for 8. Dance was used to get his ducks in a row, to start converging the plot lines after he broke them apart. Let the deaths begin, time to ditch some unwanted POV's and get back to the Originals or what's left of them. That's all he really wanted to begin with the original POV's from thrones.