Ruhail Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 The Costumes, camera work and cinematography are second to nothing on TV IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martell Spy Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 Up to eps 3 and 4. Still enjoying it greatly. Fantastic set work in Acre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 The scope of it is very nice to see in such an entertainment. The Vatican as well as the Venetians are so concerned about the Mongols (for good reasons). The Khan, certain that he will be superior to the pope, concerned about crusades, for good reasons. The Euros who show up exhibit the same hubris and ignorance that got their a$$e$ kicked out of the Middle East, era after era, and quite reflecting the present. The pride of Asian princes not given the deference their entitlement requires from the Euros. Everyone knows their superior rank over everyone else who is not the same as they are. So human. So tragic. Watched more. Yah, like it a lot. Quote The Costumes, camera work and cinematography are second to nothing on TV IMO Well, Outlander is at least the same quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvinus85 Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Just finished. Really enjoyed it. There were a few small plots that served as distractions, but the main plot was great. Benedict Wong was phenomenal. In fact I think the majority of the characters developed well. The Hundred Eyes - Lotus plot was one such distraction, but I hope it develops. Also the Prester John thing was weird. Looked like something is being setup for next season, but I'm not sure how wise it would be to bring a more mythological element into this. But the involvement of the Christian powers served to show that there were connections between the East and the West then, despite what many modern people may believe. While I liked Kublai's tactic with the horses, I was once again disappointed by the Hollywoodian style battle - main characters fighting individually, cutting down men by the dozens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 According to contemporary historians who have traced the origins of the Prester John legend, it was indeed the Vatican who invented him to help with exciting European monarchs and warriors to crusade against the East. I loved having Pope Gregory in Acre. Historically he was in Acre on crusade when hearing of the death of the previous pope and his election. But he wasn't pope yet. It took three more years for him to get back to Rome and be invested. It's a complex legend, all right. Prester John's (imaginary) kingdom was also supposedly somewhere in Africa, according to those who took up the legend after the medieval era, when the Renaissance Age of Exploration got going. The African Prester John was a great material for late 19th, pre-WWI Lost Kingdom adventure writers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerHaHa Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Zorral, pretty good explanation of the PJ legend. It sounds like based on the dialogue in the show that if there is a third season Prestor John could be an actual character, an interesting idea IMO, this is more of a historical adaptation after all (it's far reaching to think a monk could kill 25 mongol warriors single handed, much less do it again blind). Corvinus, your final point - as much as I can't stand the whole thing of a120lb girl killing dozens of armed opponents with her hands/sword/non projectile weapon, it's only a bit less ridiculous when a 200lb man does it - 2 on 1, ok, even being fortunate in a 3 on 1 if you took all 3 by complete surprise, but this whole deal of having the hero/protagonist in stories with violence be able to wipe dozens of enemies off the map without so much as a scratch, is ridiculous. Particularly when it occurs over and over. Audie Murphy pulled his stunt only once and got away with it - every dog has his day and all, but to think if he acted similarly in a dozen separate actions - posthumous medals apply then. I'm doing a rewatch now - it's actually an improvement over season 1 IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvinus85 Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 3 hours ago, Zorral said: According to contemporary historians who have traced the origins of the Prester John legend, it was indeed the Vatican who invented him to help with exciting European monarchs and warriors to crusade against the East. I loved having Pope Gregory in Acre. Historically he was in Acre on crusade when hearing of the death of the previous pope and his election. But he wasn't pope yet. It took three more years for him to get back to Rome and be invested. It's a complex legend, all right. Prester John's (imaginary) kingdom was also supposedly somewhere in Africa, according to those who took up the legend after the medieval era, when the Renaissance Age of Exploration got going. The African Prester John was a great material for late 19th, pre-WWI Lost Kingdom adventure writers. From what I read, Prester John was connected more with Genghis than Kublai, and historians believe that there might have been a Nestorian Christian kingdom that was defeated by Genghis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martell Spy Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Just got up to ep 7. Yeah this show definitely has found it's legs this year and this is a big step up, although I liked last season too. Ep 5 was kinda weird and was the likely the season low point, but it had it's good moments. Ep 6 was great and 7 just fantastic. I'm really looking forward to see how this all wraps up. The writing and plotting was very crisp. The show already had a lot of good characters, but the writing really allowed them to shine more this season. I'm one of those that has been critical of 100 eyes as a character, but after ep 7 I think they did a good of rehabilitating him. I'll respect him as a character now and even go watch his special after I finish this season up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 1 hour ago, Corvinus said: From what I read, Prester John was connected more with Genghis than Kublai, and historians believe that there might have been a Nestorian Christian kingdom that was defeated by Genghis. That's when I first heard of it too. Genghis was knocking the Muslim world out of it's golden age at a time when Europe was a bit of a backwater by comparison. BBC4 had a good radio show about Prestor John that whizzed through the various iterations. Apparently there's a manga about him too. Pleased to hear it's a step up. It's a while since I've made use of my netflix subscription so I'll give this a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 1 hour ago, Corvinus said: From what I read, Prester John was connected more with Genghis than Kublai, and historians believe that there might have been a Nestorian Christian kingdom that was defeated by Genghis. Genghis definitely scared Rome and Venice at least, to frackin' death. Mongols were fighting Egyptian Mamluks in the 13th - 14th century, so they were no short-term terror at all. See the Battle of Ayn Jalut 1260. Worse, they were succeeded by Islamic converted Tartars, etc., and then the Turks, threats and conquerers of the Russias, the Balkans, Poland, Hungary -- and of course terrorizing the Austro Hungarian / Holy Roman Empire. They'd scare me to death too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 4 minutes ago, Zorral said: Genghis definitely scared Rome and Venice at least, to frackin' death. Mongols were fighting Egyptian Mamluks in the 13th - 14th century, so they were no short-term terror at all. See the Battle of Ayn Jalut 1260. Worse, they were succeeded by Islamic converted Tartars, etc., and then the Turks, threats and conquerers of the Russias, the Balkans, Poland, Hungary -- and of course terrorizing the Austro Hungarian / Holy Roman Empire. The Ottomans, who managed to conquer the boot of Italy and inhabit it for a while, and which outright announced its plans to conquer and enslave Europe were a very real terror. This terror explains many of Queen Isabella's actions during her reign and the reconquista. They'd scare me to death too. The Church's own encyclopedia entry to the legend of Prester John can be read here, in which it is called an "exceedingly complicated fiction." That this kind of adventure fiction content is included in this season probably explains why there's less of Marco (among other reasons). It makes for pretty good storytelling -- heck it made for great fiction / story telling in Polo's own day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Many apologies. When I was editing to add a couple of things I'd forgotten in the first comment, somehow a second comment got put up instead of editing the first one. However, the other comments about the history of Nestorian Christianity (which came out of the eastern - Greek Church, not the Roman one), the Pope and the legend of Prester John and its use in this series are so interesting that I couldn't help adding some things myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted July 5, 2016 Share Posted July 5, 2016 Finished all 10 episodes... @Zorral, thanks for the info... This season was more compact, it felt more like one story than the last one. Kublai and Chabi remain my favorites... The understanding in the last episode was so great. And Marco stopped being such a lost lamb he was last season... The actor was far more tolerable this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castel Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 Quote The power, locally political and geopolitical maneuvering, the backstabbing and plotting make Got look a piker -- but that's shooting fish in a barrel. Does it though? Anyway, enjoyed this season more. It may have had something to do with me just totally skipping over anything to do with Kokochin and the kung fu being minimized. So nice of them to untangle that from any important plotlines though I expect the consequences will be around next season, given the finale. As far as I know the show has completely gone off the rails historically but w/e. It was always taking a "Vikings approach" on some stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 It's an historical adventure fantasy, not historical fiction, per ser. But historical fiction is generally off the rails too. It's certainly not a documentary. What it is, is gorgeous and thoroughly engrossing and entertaining. Which isn't true about much historical fictions on screen. What was that Season of the Witch thing with Nick Cage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martini Sigil Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 I can't believe that I almost bailed on S2.... They really stepped it up... as much as any show I've seen from an inauspicious S1... kind of like a reverse Homeland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martell Spy Posted July 8, 2016 Share Posted July 8, 2016 Really great final episodes. I loved the game board speech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martini Sigil Posted July 8, 2016 Share Posted July 8, 2016 Claudia Kim/Khutulun --my favorite character on the show--was driving me nuts as to where I knew her from... Will....Thor be there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martell Spy Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 Quote Claudia Kim/Khutulun --my favorite character on the show--was driving me nuts as to where I knew her from.. Interesting. According to Wikapedia she is in the Dark Tower movie as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voodooqueen126 Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 I don't understand Chabi. It would've been normal for her to blame Khutulun, not her own son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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