Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Ran

[Book Spoilers] EP509 Discussion

Recommended Posts

Not only that. Benioff strongly implies that Stannis will be responsible in the books as well.

That was the implication, yes, but you have to think it will be for something more than less inclement weather. I mean, all that lead up for that? What about waking dragons from stone? And all those dreams Shireen has of a dragon eating her?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"This" is kind of ambiguous as to whether "this" means Shireen being burned or Stannis doing it, if GRRM does it in the books I will say it sucks also and is a betrayal of the character he has written up to an including the released Winds chapter.

It's clear enough to me. Shireen's going to die. What way will she die? An attack by Others? It has to be linked to Stannis. From a literary perspective, he needs to be definitively wrangled into the "bad guy" tent. Honestly, it's long overdue.

I just wish they'd cut down the screams. Maybe focused on him and dulled the noises, then had the reaction from Selyse.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you guys have so much trouble with the women on this show not always being the ones to save themselves, go ahead and watch madmax on loop. They haven't shown anything in the show so far to suggest that Dany & Missandei would be running around with daggers stabbing golden masked men -- that level of fanfiction would truly kill the show twice as hard.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Relevant quote from David Benioff from the Inside the Episode, and I'm bolding it so that you all read it:

You all need to take a seat when talking about D&D going off-book with Shireen's sacrifice. It's coming straight from GRRM.

My daughter and I watched that whole thing, and we're not seeing where they are talkign about anything expect their scene and their writing. It's them hemming and hawwing and talking bs, not very clearly, either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They went all HOLLYWOOD this episode really cheesy. Is there any character left to root for other than Jon? Danerys?

Unfortunately not for long it would seem. They will probably butcher the hell out of Jons FTW moment as well. I can't believe how fucked up this season has been. It really doesn't feel like the same highly consistent show I've been watching for five years. Here's hoping for an unlikely spectacular finale, but to be honest I don't know what they could do to make me like it.

Edited by The Man from Nowhere

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pretty gripping episode. Sad to see Shireen get offed the way she did but I suppose it was one way that Team Baratheon was not destined back to the crown afterall, especially when you lose devotion from your followers. I seriously doubt Davos will continue following him after he finds out.

Arya is back to making mistakes again... Wonder why Jaqar didnt act once he saw past that lie...

Really felt for Dany and the arena, although they did make this into her into being a damsel she showed great strength to charge up on her dragon and escape to her true calling.

The Dorne plot, i was hoping they would have revealed their 'real' intentions this time around like in the book but i guess they are stretching to make more of a story for KL and the Dorne side of things.

Overall not as good as Hardhome but still the next best episode this season. I cannot wait for the finale.

I agree. Lots of sturm and drang here, but I enjoyed it. And, yes, I've read all the books and prequels.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hizdaar dying was kinda of shock too.

yes him not being head harpy was interesting

thank you for this and all book readers (of which i am one) should see that grrm was going to do this himself all along

Yo know what? I can cope with HBO/DD believing we the audience are dumb. I cannot, whatsoever, accept that people here believe we readers are plain stupid.

We DO KNOW that Shireen will likely die. That's because Martin is not an OMG WHAT A SHOCK! author as HBO make believe. There is a big chance she will die and get burn (which it has been kinda confirmed already, not spoiled). We aren't mad at that. We are mad at the fact that, for whatever reason, maybe to make the whole thing "different", they put Stannis to make it. Because Stannis is a character that WOULD NOT do that. Stannis is not real. But he's a character from a book that has been outlined in a way. This goes against that way. COmpletely.

i believe stannis has already decided it in the books which is why, perhaps he sent the pink letter as a signal to red witch to do it....else why didn't he leave her at dragon stone

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah right, Martin told them Stannis burns Shireen in the books, so they are spoiling the books now?

And George writing Stannis like... i have a duty to my daughter... no more burnings... if i die you will put my daughter on the throne... and all of a sudden he rides fast to Castle Black and shouts BURN HER, MUST BE DONE...

That's going to be quite a challenge to make sense and top some fan fiction stories i've read

you didnt think the books were going to get spoiled at all? Are you serious?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stannis burning Shireen in the books is ludicrous. In order to do so has to win the Battle of Winterfell, and once he does his plan is to push South. I suppose something could force him to march back to Castle Black for the purpose of burning Shireen, but that would necessitate a threat at the Wall her burning would counteract. In which case Mel and Selyse would almost certainly do it before he gets there. Its logistically difficult if not impossible.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People are really believing that Stannis will kill Shireen on the books?
I'll seriously chop off one of my fingers if they don't make it MELISANDRE alone the burner in the books. It really has no fucking sense if it's Stannis who does it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And the book scene is not? Cme on, criticize D&D for bad choices but Drogon showing up at the nick of time is taken directly from the books.

No, I agree. The book scene has that problem, too. My point is that the scene was already cheezy enough in the books, but they seriously upped the ante with that portrayal of it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Especially not for a camp fire and hungry, cold men. The Others taking over the realm and breaching the Wall? Yes, he would but for cold, hungry men? Fuck that!!!!

What I was thinking as well. I can see them burning Shireen if there is a bigger obstacle to overcome. But Winterfell does not equal winning the 7 Kingdoms. It doesn't equal beating the White Walkers either. It's freaking Winterfell. No offense, but the Starks and the North are done. Only the Boltons are strong. Stannis burned his daughter to win some old warriors (all the good ones died in the South) and wastelands? Please.... The show burned her way to early.

I can also understanding Mel doing it on her own.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For the people that are wondering how/why Stannis would burn Shireen in the books, are you familiar with the Stannis Night's King Theory?


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's obviously it doesn't happen like that in the books.



This happened so Shireen can help them to win Winterfell. Stannis is already going there in the books and Shireen is alive.



Will she be burnt? Yes. Not by Stannis.



Stannis in the books 6 has said, as SeƱor de la Tormenta has just quoted: IF I DIE, PLEASE, AVENGE ME AND PUT MY DAUGHTER IN THE THRONE.



Really, why would Stannis burn his own fucking heir? What's the point of trying to carry on a dynasty if you kill your own child and chance of surviving?? This is just like Doran sending Trystene to KL. Really, why? He has no more children. What is happening after Doran dies? Who rules Dorne? Will be revealed that Arianne and Quentyn went to Summer Island Camp?



This show makes. no. sense. It doesn't matter how much DD try to say "but we were told by George!". This one scene goes against what HAS BEEN ALREADY WRITTEN.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you guys have so much trouble with the women on this show not always being the ones to save themselves, go ahead and watch madmax on loop. They haven't shown anything in the show so far to suggest that Dany & Missandei would be running around with daggers stabbing golden masked men -- that level of fanfiction would truly kill the show twice as hard.

^This.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If Jon is somehow revived through Shireens sacrifice or through the red god I truly think I will be done with the show and book. The only truly good character left cannot be affiliated with the red God or Mel, evil bastards. The others look like the only reasonable characters in this whole show now. I'm now hoping the last scene is Jon awakening to reveal blue eyes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I honestly thought the stag figurine was gonna save her somehow.

Why did the harpies stand around making grunting noises instead of rushing Lil Dany and crew?

Dorne is still painful, extremely painful.

Jorahs spear throw was cheesy.

"Find out the truth then hang them" was awesome.

Another Meh episode.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you guys have so much trouble with the women on this show not always being the ones to save themselves, go ahead and watch madmax on loop. They haven't shown anything in the show so far to suggest that Dany & Missandei would be running around with daggers stabbing golden masked men -- that level of fanfiction would truly kill the show twice as hard.

^This.

This what? The assumption that we believe that women being strong means they have to fight?

Please, we're smarter than that.

Also, Dany SAVED HERSELF during the Pit scene in the books. She, herself, "threw aside" her bunny ears. She didn't need some havoc happening around. That happened after she realised she was in the wrong place. Drogon was there to help her become something else, not to save her from the evil men who wanted to hurt him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stannis burning Shireen in the books is ludicrous. In order to do so has to win the Battle of Winterfell, and once he does his plan is to push South. I suppose something could force him to march back to Castle Black for the purpose of burning Shireen, but that would necessitate a threat at the Wall her burning would counteract. In which case Mel and Selyse would almost certainly do it before he gets there. Its logistically difficult if not impossible.

The Northern lords will never back Stannis and most of his army is currently made up of northerners. He has very few of his own men with him in the books and they are dropping like flies. Stannis may win the battle of Winterfell, but he is going to lose the war. Jon's "death" may also change what happens when Shireen and Massey get to the Wall. Stannis and his daughter could meet up once again. Also, bookStannis has no relationship with his daughter and it isn't like he's been unwilling at other times to kill relatives for his own gain.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×