[Spoilers] Rant & Rave without Repercussions - First We Take King's Landing Edition

[Landru]

11 minutes ago, imaginepageant said:

No White Walkers in an episode titled The Winds of Winter? They are the LITERAL WINDS OF WINTER. They should've at least had a damned cameo.

And what was the point of the new red priestess in Meereen? I remember there being all this hype about her before the season started, like she was going to make some important connection between Dany as Azor Ahai and the War for the Dawn, or hell, maybe even cure Jorah of greyscale. But then she was just like "Hey!" and then we never saw her again. What?!

And about the Varys teleportation thing, do you guys not realize that we don't witness every single minute of time that passes in the show? No, he didn't suddenly get from Dorne to Meereen in a day. Obviously there was some span of time that passed for him to sail over there with the Martell and Tyrell ships, but we shouldn't need to see him getting seasick and playing cyvasse for a couple of weeks to get the idea. Shut up about the whole teleportation thing already.

There are two massive problems with the teleportation thing:

1) Viewers not only have no idea when time passes or how much, they have no idea that time has passed until something jarring like Varys on deck happens. Having time pass quickly is not a unique problem to GoT, it happens in many shows and movies and there are plenty of techniques to deal with it (e.g. exposition, a montage, or even showing a marked change in appearance of characters). This show doesn't even try.

2) Even more problematic, there are no consequences in other areas of the world for time passing. In the example of Dany's armada, not only did Varys sail from Dorne to Slaver's Bay, he apparently gathered ships from Dorne and Highgarden. Dany would have also have had to gather provisions, load them and 50,000 horses onto ships using the pathetic Meereen docks that we've seen, wait for all the ships to be loaded for t0he armada to form then set out. Realistically, a year or more could have passed. Meanwhile, we've been told that the only reason that KL isn't starving is because of food shipments from Highgarden. So what's happened in the capital? What about the White Walkers? Can Little Sam finally walk?

[Le Cygne]

1 minute ago, Cas Stark said:

Yeah, what's the Hound going to see in her when he finally meets her again?  A traitorous, deceitful Boss.Ass. who lies to her friends and family for no good reason...or, maybe he will get lucky and "good Sansa" will be the dominant personality for that meet up.  LOL.  

Probably the latter. I can't see him putting up with boss ass bullshit. Maybe she helps Littlefinger mess with Jon, because she's so stupid, then Sandor says WTF are you doing, he killed Ned.

I think he's going to be a straight talker, he's the anti-LF for her in the books, she contrasts the two in her thoughts and Sandor always wins. So he's a breath of fresh air for her.

[OldGimletEye]

10 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

Yeah, what's the Hound going to see in her when he finally meets her again?  A traitorous, deceitful Boss.Ass. who lies to her friends and family for no good reason...or, maybe he will get lucky and "good Sansa" will be the dominant personality for that meet up.  LOL.  

Probably very confused, I'd imagine, when on one day, she's the meek wall flower, but on the next day she's the Boss Ass Individual. LOL.

[Le Cygne]

15 minutes ago, OldGimletEye said:

I know book Sansa has no intention of ever going back to KL. I'm pretty sure show Sansa doesn't care about the Iron Throne either. And it's hard to say where D & D are headed, given consistency isn't exactly D &D's strong suit. 

Yeah, I don't think "pretty picture" was from her perspective, but from LF's perspective. She was snarking at him.

(It's a classic snark, wouldn't it be pretty to think so, it's condescending...)

[OldGimletEye]

Just now, Le Cygne said:

Yeah, I don't think "pretty picture" was from her perspective, but from LF's perspective. She's was snarking at him.

Yep. I interpreted it exactly the way you did. Agree she was being snarky there.

[sweetsunray]

An idea that struck me for the finale, for those thinking Stannis wins against the Boltons - Glovers, Mormonts, Manderly, Cerwyns etc survive right? Glovers, Mormonts and Cerwyns fight in Stannis's army in the books, right? Just, like Stannis cannot burn Shireen himself without winning WF, he can't have lost a battle when half his army survives it... unless they'd suddenly fight for Boltons, which ain't happening. The Cerwyns in Stannis's army are survivors of Ramsay routing them when Rodrik attempts to besiege WF when Theon holds it. Manderly cooks Frey pies and has Davos looking for Rickon at Skagos, and he declared emotionally for Stark. Mormonts seem to know enough and had their mother and heiress butchered at the RW. Glovers are either with Manderly and know Roose betrayed them (sent them to Maidenpool) and it weren't the Boltons that saved their home from Ironborn.

And while I do give credit to GNC - none of these lords would stab Stannis in the back while Boltons are alive, and while they have no Rickon yet, and only a fake Arya.

So, for all those claiming "show does what is to happen in the books with Stannis"... All those houses declaring for Jon and being alive and well, when they are in the middle of the battle in the books + Boltons gone + Stannis's army butchered... None of that adds up.

[Tijgy]

Is it now established on the show R+L=J or was it just giving more clues? Technically they only showed Lyanna has a child => Jon - so is that enough to say baby = Jon?

 

[a black swan]

So what will happen to Melisandre? Jon sent her South... will she end up serving Dany? Filling her in on the WW threat? 

[Le Cygne]

1 minute ago, Tijgy said:

Is it now established on the show R+L=J or was it just giving more clues? Technically they only showed Lyanna has a child => Jon - so is that enough to say baby = Jon?

Hibberd at EW, who gets the scoops from D&D&C, came right out with it. No spoiler tags or anything. He's acting like the show established this.

[sweetsunray]

2 minutes ago, Tijgy said:

Is it now established on the show R+L=J or was it just giving more clues? Technically they only showed Lyanna has a child => Jon - so is that enough to say baby = Jon?

 

She audibly whispered that Robert would kill "him" [baby] if Robert knew and that Ned had to protect him from that. So, yeah, R+L=J

[SuperMario]

4 minutes ago, Tijgy said:

Is it now established on the show R+L=J or was it just giving more clues? Technically they only showed Lyanna has a child => Jon - so is that enough to say baby = Jon?

 

I'm sure R+L=J is true on the show, but R is irrelevant in their eyes. Basically, in their version, Jon is a Targaryen bastard. Unless they show more of it next season with little backstory, which seems odd, they did this as a total slap to book fans and GRRM.

[sweetsunray]

2 minutes ago, DutchArya said:

So what will happen to Melisandre? Jon sent her South... will she end up serving Dany? Filling her in on the WW threat? 

Before Dany she has to go through the RL, with BwB Rh'llor followers going North, and Arya prowling for people to kill.

[Cas Stark]

3 minutes ago, Le Cygne said:

Hibberd at EW, who gets the scoops from D&D&C, came right out with it. No spoiler tags or anything. He's acting like the show established this.

It did.  Unless people think that Lyanna at 16 who wouldn't have sex w/her fiance, was having sex with Rhaegar and ?? after she ran off w/Rhaegar.  But, I'm surprised he came so hard at it, since the whispering I assumed was to allowing them to do a more direct reveal next year...

[LadyDoom]

4 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

Before Dany she has to go through the RL, with BwB Rh'llor followers going North, and Arya prowling for people to kill.

I bet Arya will lead the BwB now, if she does and yet doesn't run into or even mentions Nymeria, then fuck everything. 

[a black swan]

3 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

Before Dany she has to go through the RL, with BwB Rh'llor followers going North, and Arya prowling for people to kill.

She told Arya that they would meet again. This is obviously happening as Arya will be moving North. But will Arya let her go? I think this is how Arya learns of Jon's resurrection and maybe even the WW threat. She will spare Mel because she brought Jon back I think.

[a black swan]

1 minute ago, LadyDoom said:

I bet Arya will lead the BwB now, if she does and yet doesn't run into or even mentions Nymeria, then fuck everything. 

They most likely will use the footage of the wolf pack next season. They have done that in the past, ironically with another Arya scene. The one where she retrieves Needle was shot during S5 production but used in S6. 

It would be nice if her warging is sparked with her reunion with Nymeria. 

[The Wull]

1 minute ago, DutchArya said:

They most likely will use the footage of the wolf pack next season. They have done that in the past, ironically with another Arya scene. The one where she retrieves Needle was shot during S5 production but used in S6. 

It would be nice if her warging is sparked with her reunion with Nymeria. 

There won't be any warging of Nymeria.  They didn't have Jon warg Ghost after Olly stabs him, so only Bran is a warg on the show.  I agree in the books though.  I hope she learns to consciously do it.

[Stannis is the man....nis]

16 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

An idea that struck me for the finale, for those thinking Stannis wins against the Boltons - Glovers, Mormonts, Manderly, Cerwyns etc survive right? Glovers, Mormonts and Cerwyns fight in Stannis's army in the books, right? Just, like Stannis cannot burn Shireen himself without winning WF, he can't have lost a battle when half his army survives it... unless they'd suddenly fight for Boltons, which ain't happening. The Cerwyns in Stannis's army are survivors of Ramsay routing them when Rodrik attempts to besiege WF when Theon holds it. Manderly cooks Frey pies and has Davos looking for Rickon at Skagos, and he declared emotionally for Stark. Mormonts seem to know enough and had their mother and heiress butchered at the RW. Glovers are either with Manderly and know Roose betrayed them (sent them to Maidenpool) and it weren't the Boltons that saved their home from Ironborn.

And while I do give credit to GNC - none of these lords would stab Stannis in the back while Boltons are alive, and while they have no Rickon yet, and only a fake Arya.

So, for all those claiming "show does what is to happen in the books with Stannis"... All those houses declaring for Jon and being alive and well, when they are in the middle of the battle in the books + Boltons gone + Stannis's army butchered... None of that adds up.

Thank you I was saying that for months when people were calling Battle of the Bastards is canon that Jon wouldn't have any houses to work with becuase they would all be died

[imaginepageant]

31 minutes ago, Landru said:

Having time pass quickly is not a unique problem to GoT, it happens in many shows and movies and there are plenty of techniques to deal with it (e.g. exposition, a montage, or even showing a marked change in appearance of characters). This show doesn't even try.

It seemed obvious enough to me. I guess I don't need a montage to figure out that getting from point A to point B takes time. It's pretty simple logic.

Let's say Varys wasn't there in that closing scene. The Martell and Tyrell ships still were, and needed to be, or else there wouldn't have been enough ships for Dany to set out for Westeros in the first place. That alone implies that time has passed between Varys making the alliance with the Martells and Tyrells in Dorne and the Martell and Tyrell ships getting to Meereen. Or would everyone then be upset that the ships themselves magically teleported to Meereen? It's a fairly obvious chain of events: Varys gets to Dorne, the alliance is forged, the Martell and Tyrell ships sail back to Meereen, Dany's now-complete fleet sets out for Westeros. And again, it's pretty simple logic that this would have taken time.

31 minutes ago, Landru said:

Even more problematic, there are no consequences in other areas of the world for time passing. ... So what's happened in the capital? What about the White Walkers? Can Little Sam finally walk?

You can't say there are no consequences in other areas of the world before those consequences have had a chance to happen. If, at the start of next season, the King's Landing storyline picks up exactly where it left off and it seems that little to no time has passed there before Dany's fleet arrives, then yes, that will be a problem. But chances are a good chunk of time will have passed unseen in King's Landing between season six and seven—just as it did between season three and four (established by Jaime commenting that he's been back for a few weeks in the first episode of season four). We also skip over a good chunk of time between season four and five (established by Tyrion's state upon arriving in Pentos, not to mention his full beard).

Also, we aren't necessarily on the same timeline all over the world. An event in King's Landing in episode four isn't necessarily happening at the exact same time as an event at the Wall in episode four; there might be days or even weeks between the two storylines. For example, Cersei's hair grew out some between season five and six, implying that a few weeks passed there, but no time at all passed at the Wall. That doesn't present a problem as long as the storylines and characters between the two locations aren't interacting with each other, or there isn't any explicit mention of time that would create an inconsistency. In the meantime, we can assume that the events that followed in King's Landing happened more quickly than those at the Wall, allowing for the Wall to "catch up" with them, so to speak.

I'm guessing the White Walkers are biding their time until Bran gets south of the Wall, when they will be able to use whatever silly magic now connects them. As for Little Sam, yeah, they really screwed up time with him. No excuses there.

[kissdbyfire]

25 minutes ago, SuperMario said:

I'm sure R+L=J is true on the show, but R is irrelevant in their eyes. Basically, in their version, Jon is a Targaryen bastard. Unless they show more of it next season with little backstory, which seems odd, they did this as a total slap to book fans and GRRM.

I bet they're going for a shock, another OMG DID NOT SEE THAT COMING. And they will wait to reveal Rhaegar is Jon's father to tie it in with something Khaleesi next year. 

ETA: or not? Just read Cas' post.