Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

[CrypticWeirwood]

1 minute ago, Sheiraseastar23 said:

The fact that some scenes have leaked but not the entire episode, makes me think this is not in the actual episode, and all these leaks are questionable at best. They did say they were gonna film alternate endings so no one would actually know the end until it officially airs. 

If then. They could always shoot three endings and then broadcast three different versions at the same time.

[bloodsteel bitterraven]

Based on everything I have read this is how I expect the series to end:

There is no Iron throne.  I don't believe for a second that Bran will become King.

Sansa rules in the North and the Riverlands

R. Arryn in the Vale

Davos in the Crownlands

Yara on the Iron Islands

Brienne and Jaime's child in the Westerlands (Brienne is regent)

Gendry Baratheon in the Stormlands

Sam in the Reach

Random nobody in Dorne (they might call him Quentyn and claim he is Doran's nephew or something).

[Vaith]

1 hour ago, T and A said:

OK, so if the leaks are true, I have one question: 

WHY THE FUCK DOES IT MATTER THAT JON IS RHAEGARS AND LYANNAS SON?

Checklist effect. It's something that will probably be important in the books for Jon to actually grapple with, and they had to include it because they wanted to get to R+L before Martin, I guess. 

[alienarea]

And maybe TWoW and ADoS have been written but not released because they have the same crap ending.

[teej6]

2 minutes ago, bloodsteel bitterraven said:

Based on everything I have read this is how I expect the series to end:

There is no Iron throne.  I don't believe for a second that Bran will become King.

Sansa rules in the North and the Riverlands

R. Arryn in the Vale

Davos in the Crownlands

Yara on the Iron Islands

Brienne and Jaime's child in the Westerlands (Brienne is regent)

Gendry Baratheon in the Stormlands

Sam in the Reach

Random nobody in Dorne (they might call him Quentyn and claim he is Doran's nephew or something).

Why Sansa in the RL. Did they say Edmure is dead? And isn’t Roslin pregnant in the show?

[Lady Fevre Dream]

11 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I don't think Vic ever makes it back out of Slaver's Bay, but we'll probably never know.  And him killing Cersei would be kind of a strange way to end her story.  People have said that R+L was too 'obvious' also, so my guess is that it's Jamie.

LOL  I actually always have thought Tyrion or Jaime are the only choices.  I lean different ways to which of her little brothers at different times.  Cersei's actions are the ones that have caused most of her prophecies to come true, so why not making it come true that she is killed by her little brother Tyrion as she has always feared.  Of course, Jaime also fits as a little brother, the one she's never worried about.  I think either works perfectly.  Some days I want it to be Tyrion, some days Jaime. 

[Vaith]

5 minutes ago, bloodsteel bitterraven said:

Random nobody in Dorne (they might call him Quentyn and claim he is Doran's nephew or something).

Or Manfrey, or one of the younger Sand Fakes. I believe a Martell sigil has been spotted in the leaked images. 

[Vaith]

1 minute ago, alienarea said:

And maybe TWoW and ADoS have been written but not released because they have the same crap ending.

I seriously doubt that this Missandei murder/rape is going to play a part in the "final showdown" in the books. She's like, 10, and a rather tertiary character. 

[bloodsteel bitterraven]

3 minutes ago, teej6 said:

Why Sansa in the RL. Did they say Edmure is dead? And isn’t Roslin pregnant in the show?

It could be Edmure, but Friki hasn't mentioned anything about Edmure being at the trial so maybe D&D forgot him?  Is Roslin pregnant on the show?  I don't remember to be honest.  I actually thought Arya would get the Riverlands since Nymeria is there, but now I think she will either return to the Faceless men cult or become a red priestess.

[T and A]

Just now, Vaith said:

I seriously doubt that this Missandei murder/rape is going to play a part in the "final showdown" in the books. She's like, 10, and a rather tertiary character. 

She is not tertiary for Daenerys, though. And she is 10, which makes it even worse. Remeber what Danerys did to the masters of Mereen? 

[Cas Stark]

2 minutes ago, Lady Fevre Dream said:

LOL  I actually always have thought Tyrion or Jaime are the only choices.  I lean different ways to which of her little brothers at different times.  Cersei's actions are the ones that have caused most of her prophecies to come true, so why not making it come true that she is killed by her little brother Tyrion as she has always feared.  Of course, Jaime also fits as a little brother, the one she's never worried about.  I think either works perfectly.  Some days I want it to be Tyrion, some days Jaime. 

Exactly.  At numerous points in her life she could have driven a stake through the heart of the prophecy, most especially by not aborting Bob's baby, or by making peace with Marg, but again and again she cements the truth of the prophecy by her myopic actions, so she will continue to do the same until the hands wrap around her neck. 

[Ser Drewy]

Oh my God, these coming episodes sound hilariously bad. 

[Lady Fevre Dream]

2 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

Exactly.  At numerous points in her life she could have driven a stake through the heart of the prophecy, most especially by not aborting Bob's baby, or by making peace with Marg, but again and again she cements the truth of the prophecy by her myopic actions, so she will continue to do the same until the hands wrap around her neck. 

Then again, we are talking 'book' sense.  Plus, that part is not included in the show, right? 

 

[Ser Drewy]

Jaime/Brienne sex scene confirmed, it seems: https://imgur.com/OeEmOPx

[longest night]

Just going to point out that one of the leaks going around from an industry forum indicates that Jaime betrays the Starks, Jon at the NW, etc basically contradicts another leak which specifically states Jaime does not betray anyone.

[CrypticWeirwood]

11 minutes ago, alienarea said:

And maybe TWoW and ADoS have been written but not released because they have the same crap ending.

Winds is written and waiting for the series to end for the announcement. He's begun Dream but not finished it yet.

The showrunners gave this away by accident in one of their interviews.

[Vaith]

8 minutes ago, T and A said:

She is not tertiary for Daenerys, though. And she is 10, which makes it even worse. Remeber what Danerys did to the masters of Mereen? 

Nathalie Emmanuel's Missandei is different enough that I have to completely disregard any relevance this has in the books. Remember when Ellaria Sand was the complete opposite of her canon counterpart just because Benioff & Weiss liked Varma?

[Cas Stark]

4 minutes ago, Lady Fevre Dream said:

Then again, we are talking 'book' sense.  Plus, that part is not included in the show, right? 

 

I don't expect at this point for the show to be faithful necessarily to who kills Cersei, she will die, but we knew she would die for years, if someone other than Jamie kills her, I think it means nothing.  Arya is for certain not the key to killing the Others in the books, so all we can know from that is what we already knew, that they would one way or the other be neutralized.  Like we can know that House Frey goes down hard, probably not at the hands of Wolverine, but Stoneheart, we can know that so far, 2 dragons die.  The show made such a mess of the North that I don't think we know anything about that story except that Sansa will be Lady of Winterfell.  

[The Coconut God]

4 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I don't think Vic ever makes it back out of Slaver's Bay, but we'll probably never know.  And him killing Cersei would be kind of a strange way to end her story.  People have said that R+L was too 'obvious' also, so my guess is that it's Jamie.

Yes, but you lost your faith in George while I'm still hoping he set some things up for a reason. 

Victarion has a score to settle with Euron in relation to the wife he "made him" murder. At the time this was introduced, we never even knew Cersei would ally herself with Euron, although the hints were there. Maybe the wife backstory is not filler after all.

3 minutes ago, Vaith said:

No, the entire point is that Tyrion is the obvious decoy that Cersei expects throughout AFFC while at the same time her relationship with Jaime is breaking down. It's supposed to be ironic, and not a shock for the sake of shocks. Victarion, Euron, Arya, Jon, Daenerys... none of these people contribute as much to her arc or mean anything to her character compared to Jaime. 

Tyrion is the blatantly wrong option that only Cersei believes, Jaime is the decoy for "clever" readers looking for a twist.

I made a post about this here a while back if you want the details, but the short story is that Maggy's prophecies are likely from Cersei's perspective, not omniscient (because she had to drink her blood), and her killer is called the valonqar (notice the "the" instead of "your") because:

1. He was likely ranting about his older brother while killing her, probably justifying himself like a remorseful murderer would.
2. The older brother had a Valyrian look, which is a match for Euron's armor and the high chance that he will be riding a dragon in the books.

Now, Jaime makes perfect sense if you analyze this from Cersei's perspective. Her arc is about alienating her closest allies, being blind and reckless and in general being the architect of her own demise. It would be poetic from that point of view for her to finally alienate her brother and lover and get killed by him without seeing it coming.

But the thing is, Jaime is on a different path. He's on a redemption arc where he already decided to stop caring about his sister. She sent him a letter begging him to come rescue her, and what did he do? He burned it and went off with Brienne. He broke free from Cersei. Going back to kill her would be character regression and doesn't really make sense if we look at things from the perspective of his arc.

And that's why he's the decoy. George's writing is character driven, so Jaime will do what makes sense for Jaime, not what's poetic for Cersei's arc. He is a complex person, not a narrative tool. The theme of Cersei being the architect of her own demise works just as well, if not better, if it happens through her alliance with Euron (the younger, more beautiful... king).

[Cas Stark]

2 minutes ago, CrypticWeirwood said:

Winds is written and waiting for the series to end for the announcement. He's begun Dream but not finished it yet.

The showrunners gave this away by accident in one of their interviews.

I don't believe that for a minute.