X-Buster Posted April 15, 2019 Share Posted April 15, 2019 Martin carefully laid out the rules of skin changing in order to prepare the readers for what will happen. Varamyr's purpose was that preparation. Jon will die from his wounds but his mind will continue to live in his direwolf. A Time for Wolves is too obvious a title and it needed to change. But the story doesn't have to. Jojen tells Bran "the wolves will come again" and it can easily mean the Starks have turned to direwolves when the pack gets together again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platypus Rex Posted April 15, 2019 Share Posted April 15, 2019 Either that or … he was setting the stage for Tyrion dying, and living out his "second life" as a dragon (like Fafnir the kinslaying dwarf turned dragon of Norse legend) only to be ultimately slain, in dragon form by an old friend (Jon Snow), much like Fafnir was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisdaw Posted April 15, 2019 Share Posted April 15, 2019 No Jon is not going to be his direwolf for the rest of ASOIAF. He dies at the end, maybe second lifes Ghost, maybe not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Euron III Greyjoy Posted April 15, 2019 Share Posted April 15, 2019 I thought Varamyr's prologue was just giving us an info dump on skinchangers. If anything I felt like it had more to do with Bran then Jon. I don't think Jon will spend the rest of the story in Ghost. Melisandre saw Jon in a vision go from man to wolf back to man again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverwolf22 Posted April 15, 2019 Share Posted April 15, 2019 8 hours ago, Platypus Rex said: Either that or … he was setting the stage for Tyrion dying, and living out his "second life" as a dragon (like Fafnir the kinslaying dwarf turned dragon of Norse legend) only to be ultimately slain, in dragon form by an old friend (Jon Snow), much like Fafnir was. what if instead of jon snow killing tyrian paralleling siegfried slaying fafnir maybe its jaime @Platypus Rex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commentator Posted April 15, 2019 Share Posted April 15, 2019 Bran is too powerful to be contained in wolf form. He can just escape to the weirwood net and preserve his mind that way when his death comes. Jon and Arya are the ones who are most likely to become wolves. They already are in temperament and personality. I can see Jon dying and Arya losing her mind to avenge him. They die and continue on as direwolves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moiraine Sedai Posted April 16, 2019 Share Posted April 16, 2019 On 4/15/2019 at 12:32 AM, Platypus Rex said: Either that or … he was setting the stage for Tyrion dying, and living out his "second life" as a dragon (like Fafnir the kinslaying dwarf turned dragon of Norse legend) only to be ultimately slain, in dragon form by an old friend (Jon Snow), much like Fafnir was. Tyrion is a lion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheThreeEyedCow Posted April 16, 2019 Share Posted April 16, 2019 Mel saw it in her flames. A man, then a wolf, then a man again. Ghost will be a good place for Jon's spirit/soul to linger until somebody can raise him from the dead. He needs to get out quickly before the Wolf takes over his mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van Gogh Posted April 16, 2019 Share Posted April 16, 2019 On 4/15/2019 at 12:19 AM, Unit A2 said: Martin carefully laid out the rules of skin changing in order to prepare the readers for what will happen. Varamyr's purpose was that preparation. Jon will die from his wounds but his mind will continue to live in his direwolf. A Time for Wolves is too obvious a title and it needed to change. But the story doesn't have to. Jojen tells Bran "the wolves will come again" and it can easily mean the Starks have turned to direwolves when the pack gets together again. Jon, Arya, and Rickon will become wolves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X-Buster Posted April 17, 2019 Author Share Posted April 17, 2019 On 4/15/2019 at 12:32 AM, Platypus Rex said: Either that or … he was setting the stage for Tyrion dying, and living out his "second life" as a dragon (like Fafnir the kinslaying dwarf turned dragon of Norse legend) only to be ultimately slain, in dragon form by an old friend (Jon Snow), much like Fafnir was. Only if Aerys was his father. Which I don't think is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platypus Rex Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Unit A2 said: Only if Aerys was his father. Which I don't think is true. Why else have Tywin marry his cousin? So GRRM can have it both ways. So Tyrion can be a dragonseed and still be a Lannister. So he will still be a kinslayerfor slaying Tywin, even if Tywin is not technically his father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustythesmith Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 3 hours ago, Platypus Rex said: Why else have Tywin marry his cousin? So GRRM can have it both ways. So Tyrion can be a dragonseed and still be a Lannister. So he will still be a kinslayerfor slaying Tywin, even if Tywin is not technically his father. Yeah I don't really understand the gripe about Tywin not really being his father. Was Ned not really Jon's father? Of course he was Jon's father. Because fatherhood isn't majorly about genetic material. It's a familial role and, using the meaning of the word father that matters the most, Tywin will never not have been Tyrion's father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 Im just going to point at Royal Assassin/Assassin’s Quest by Robin Hobb as my thoughts on how Jon lives on. With possibly Val and Borroq taking the place of Chade and Burrich. (note, i am not accusing grrm of stealing ideas) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
300 H&H Magnum Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 13 hours ago, Lucky Ducky said: Jon, Arya, and Rickon will become wolves. Bran might join that pack. His dog is still kicking in the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Sansa Stark Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 You are right about one thing: Jon will warg into Ghost before his body dies, but it will be a temporary thing until he is resurrected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mullocose Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 On 4/15/2019 at 12:19 AM, Unit A2 said: Martin carefully laid out the rules of skin changing in order to prepare the readers for what will happen. Varamyr's purpose was that preparation. Jon will die from his wounds but his mind will continue to live in his direwolf. A Time for Wolves is too obvious a title and it needed to change. But the story doesn't have to. Jojen tells Bran "the wolves will come again" and it can easily mean the Starks have turned to direwolves when the pack gets together again. Yeah, Jon will be a Direwolf for at least the first half of the next novel... Until he takes Hodor's Body!!! This will fulfill Mel's vision of Jon being a Man, Wolf, then a man again... Mel just didn't specify which man he would be... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo of House Cartel Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 While I do expect around two TWOW chapters with Jon trapped in the mind of Ghost, each perhaps lasting a week or two timeline wise, I don't think it will be a permanent situation. I am open to the idea of Jon getting his regular body back and eventually second lifing Ghost after possibly dying in the War for the Dawn, but as of yet I still think there are too many avenues to explore with human Jon. Perhaps Jon's dead body will be stored down in the cold cellars beneath Castle Black while Mel/whatever healer attends to his remains. The temperature down there might be good for stopping any potential decomposition. We got a glimpse of the cold storage systems and the "wormways" in ADWD; foreshadowing, perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only 89 selfies today Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 He already has. He had two things on his mind as he lay dying: Arya and Ghost. It's a one-way door though. He stays in Ghost until they both die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crona Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 If he is dead then yes he’s in his direwolf. However, how would he get his same body back? Wouldn’t they burn his body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Sidious Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 On 4/15/2019 at 12:19 AM, Unit A2 said: Martin carefully laid out the rules of skin changing in order to prepare the readers for what will happen. Varamyr's purpose was that preparation. Jon will die from his wounds but his mind will continue to live in his direwolf. A Time for Wolves is too obvious a title and it needed to change. But the story doesn't have to. Jojen tells Bran "the wolves will come again" and it can easily mean the Starks have turned to direwolves when the pack gets together again. I agree. Arya, Bran, and Rickon will die too and join the direwolf pack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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