[Spoilers] Criticize Without Repercussion

[Victarian Revolution]

Why do you people watch this show just to whinge about it?

I understand the purpose of the topic but it seems pretty hypocritical and sad to watch something that you detest this much for six seasons?

[Balerion the one eared cat]

16 minutes ago, Victarian Revolution said:

Why do you people watch this show just to whinge about it?

I understand the purpose of the topic but it seems pretty hypocritical and sad to watch something that you detest this much for six seasons?

I can list a number of reasons.

First, it wasn't so awful in the first 3-4 seasons (wasn't enjoying as much towards the end of season 4 but that's because I'm a book purist - I could accept then that it was an adaptation and still appreciate it was good television even if it wasn't obeying GRRM's every word). Old habits die hard, and I still have the occasional bit of hope that they might salvage what was once a great bit of TV.

I would rather watch it first hand if we're going to get any massive spoilers for TWOW (Jon's parents confirmation, for example) than hear about it from a randomer talking about it in a lecture/walking down the street/on the internet. If I'm gonna get spoilers, I want to know that I'm putting myself into it rather than holding out for TWOW only to have something spoiled by a vengeful friend who knows that's what I'm doing.

Similar theme - I watch it with friends who love the show without the books, it's a nice revision break and bonding experience - plus they don't get what's going on half the time if I don't explain it! Plus at least I can still discuss ASOIAF with them - if I don't watch it, I have no outlet about the books or the show.

Also, on revision breaks, it's a good distraction! At this point I love to hate it - it's entertaining to see how awful it's become, kind of like watching some sort of Monty Python parody. I need to vent my stored anger in life somewhere, and this forum seems like a pretty good way to do it. 

The sad part is, it's all I've got to do until TWOW now that I've read the series a few times through including Dunk and Egg (graphic novels and KOTSK), TWOIAF, TPATQ...

There are just a few of my (admittedly, often rather petty) reasons for continuing to watch.

[Nami]

10 minutes ago, Balerion the one eared cat said:

I would rather watch it first hand if we're going to get any massive spoilers for TWOW (Jon's parents confirmation, for example) than hear about it from a randomer talking about it in a lecture/walking down the street/on the internet. If I'm gonna get spoilers, I want to know that I'm putting myself into it rather than holding out for TWOW only to have something spoiled by a vengeful friend who knows that's what I'm doing.

Also, on revision breaks, it's a good distraction! At this point I love to hate it - it's entertaining to see how awful it's become, kind of like watching some sort of Monty Python parody. I need to vent my stored anger in life somewhere, and this forum seems like a pretty good way to do it. 

My reasons, pretty much.
At this point I'm just watching for the flashbacks and a little bit for Arya. I really don't care at all about the rest of the characters from this show (I actually hate most of them) especially now that D&D have no source material and the story telling is on their hands.

[Xcorpyo001]

31 minutes ago, Victarian Revolution said:

Why do you people watch this show just to whinge about it?

I understand the purpose of the topic but it seems pretty hypocritical and sad to watch something that you detest this much for six seasons?

I don't think criticising is the same as detesting something. I would watch something asoiaf related no matter the format/quality. 

Plus I watch it with friends, we discuss it afterwards, make comparison to the source material, etc.

And the first seasons were good. We get good scenes from time to time. I just wish some things were done better, but beggars can't be choosers. And the visuals, visual effects and some of the acting are quite good. Bad GoT>most current TV shows.

And there’s also the fact that we don’t know if GRRM will get to finish the books. One ending to this saga is better than none.

[Daenerys_Is_Coming]

17 hours ago, Rubicante said:

During the Tyrion scene with Missandei and Grey Worm, I couldn't help but think "They killed Ser Barristan off early so we could have this?".

So instead of having this awesome scene from the book where Barristan arrests Hizdahr ("Only cowards dress in iron", "This coward is about to kill you, ser"), we get Tyrion trying to make small talk.

Tyrion should not be in Mereen yet.  This is Barristan's story.

**Slow clap** THANK YOU! 

When they killed of Barry I was pissed. I loved his chapters in ADWD and turned each page with hesitation as he took down the Harpies fearing that he might draw his last breath. The book gave us suspense and tension and badass lines from the greatest knight in the kingdom. 

However, I held out hope that maybe Tyrion could fill his shoes and they would simply pass Barry's story to the shorty. Instead we get the most BORING possible scenes of Mereen where Tyrion's attempts at witty banter is growing thin and  - quite honestly - embarrassing. Fast tracking Tyrion to Mereen has thus far accomplished nothing and slowed the story down to a crawl. I'd be happy to get a zombie Barry at this point. 

[TepidHands]

I'm sort of enjoying watching the very slow-motion train wreck the show's become. The nonversation in Meereen, Khaleesi spouting all her titles to a rather unimpressed audience, Jaime and Cersei and Gregor  sittin' in a tree.

That said, I don't think we need to justify ourselves or this thread to anyone. 

[Darkstream]

1 hour ago, Victarian Revolution said:

Why do you people watch this show just to whinge about it?

I understand the purpose of the topic but it seems pretty hypocritical and sad to watch something that you detest this much for six seasons?

 

1. It's like watching a train wreck, it's a horrible thing,  but  as per human nature, I just can't turn away. 

2. Got used to be, and is supposed to be an adapt ion of one of my favorite stories ever. At first I watched it for that reason, how awesome to have your favorite books adapted to a visual medium. Unfortunately, D&D have ruined that for me. So as a  fan of Asoiaf, I feel a desire to know how D&D are butchering this story, as well as a right to voice my displeasure with it.  

3. As ubsurd as I now know it is, a small part of me still hopes against hope that the show will get back to being a quality adaption, and away from being a show about cheap shocks, juvenile dick jokes and gratuitous sex and nudity. 

 

[Cas Stark]

From The Atlantic:

 

A brief, if customary, digression: Why, again, is everyone in the North pledging fealty to Ramsay, when they know that he is a) a maniac; a bastard; and c) the murderer of his father (and step-mother and legitimate infant half-brother)? Why aren’t the Karstarks claiming the North (their hereditary relation to the Starks is right there in the name!)? Or the Umbers, now that they have such a valuable hostage? I’ve said it may times before, but Benioff and Weiss are consistently at their worst when writing Ramsay’s character, whose over-the-top evil is second only to the shocking lack of logic and sophistication with which his character is plotted. I hate to think of how many more “wow, he’s really a bad guy” moments we will have to endure—he’s eating a baby! he’s raping a kitten! he’s the CEO of Comcast!—before his inevitable demise.

[Daenerys_Is_Coming]

1 hour ago, Victarian Revolution said:

Why do you people watch this show just to whinge about it?

I understand the purpose of the topic but it seems pretty hypocritical and sad to watch something that you detest this much for six seasons?

I guess it depends on how you define "whinge"

Saying that we are "whingeing" about the show implies that we are being negative for negative's sake. That is not the case at all. It's actually the reverse. We love the source material so much that we are identifying the ways in which things could have been done better. We want the best for the show. We know how awesome it could be and we use this as an outlet to discuss where things are and are not on track. Implying that we detest something that we took time out of our busy personal lives to comment critically on is an oxymoron. 

In my opinion, it seems pretty hypocritcal and sad that you felt the need to come into this thread for no other reason than to whine about people whineing. 

[Red Tiger]

2 hours ago, Victarian Revolution said:

Why do you people watch this show just to whinge about it?

I understand the purpose of the topic but it seems pretty hypocritical and sad to watch something that you detest this much for six seasons?

Okay, i'll humor you.

1. I expected to at least have some info regarding TWOW's release date by now, instead all I hear is that GRRM is working on other projects.

2. I dont think TWOW will ever be released and I have waited years for some answers that will only come from watching this show.

3. Tits and violence.

4. The series is quite bearable if you really dont take it seriously and just see it as a big joke, something I've often done since season 4.

5. Smalljon.Fucking.Umber.

6. I like seeing religious fanatics die (only fanatics) and I believe this show will soon entertain me in this regard.

[Low Sparrow]

The reason they chose to assassinate Ned's character is because some of the braindead twits that constitute their fanbase may remember that Cersei had Ned executed in S1. The new Cersei is a tragic misunderstood victim of patriarchs, priests and peasants. Not a psychotic delusional malignant narcissist.

The D&D Smalljon is inconsistent, even by the rules of the D&D bizaro-universe version of GoT they've created. He seems to know these rules when he claims he wishes he coulda killed his father. But then forgets them when handing Reekon over to Ramsay.

He should have delivered Reekon to Jon at the wall, giving Jon a chance to be hip and get in on the latest fad sweeping bizarro-Westeros, kinslaying. And now that's Jon's given up the coat (who needs elections when you got a coat) .. it would make sense for him to kill Reekon and his other siblings so he can inherit Winterfell.

[kissdbyfire]

13 minutes ago, Low Sparrow said:

The reason they chose to assassinate Ned's character is because some of the braindead twits that constitute their fanbase may remember that Cersei had Ned executed in S1. The new Cersei is a tragic misunderstood victim of patriarchs, priests and peasants. Not a psychotic delusional malignant narcissist.

The D&D Smalljon is inconsistent, even by the rules of the D&D bizaro-universe version of GoT they've created. He seems to know these rules when he claims he wishes he coulda killed his father. But then forgets them when handing Reekon over to Ramsay.

He should have delivered Reekon to Jon at the wall, giving Jon a chance to be hip and get in on the latest fad sweeping bizarro-Westeros, kinslaying. And now that's Jon's given up the coat (who needs elections when you got a coat) .. it would make sense for him to kill Reekon and his other siblings so he can inherit Winterfell.

Reekon! 

Excellent. So sad, and so true. 

[The Fiddler]

3 hours ago, Victarian Revolution said:

Why do you people watch this show just to whinge about it?

I understand the purpose of the topic but it seems pretty hypocritical and sad to watch something that you detest this much for six seasons?

I watch it, because I doubt the books will get a proper ending (IE, 50% chance GRRM will finish TWOW before dying, significantly less chance of him finishing ADOS before dying), which is also why I'm so disappointed with and hard on the show. The show being bad, particularly in the later seasons, basically means I'll never have proper closure to a series I've loved for over a decade.   

[TWR]

59 minutes ago, Red Tiger said:

Okay, i'll humor you.

1. I expected to at least have some info regarding TWOW's release date by now, instead all I hear is that GRRM is working on other projects.

2. I dont think TWOW will ever be released and I have waited years for some answers that will only come from watching this show.

3. Tits and violence.

4. The series is quite bearable if you really dont take it seriously and just see it as a big joke, something I've often done since season 4.

5. Smalljon.Fucking.Umber.

6. I like seeing religious fanatics die (only fanatics) and I believe this show will soon entertain me in this regard.

I'm with you on 1,2 & 5. Also, I'm in too deep now to stop knowing there is a definite end date. If there was a possibity of the show dragging on for another 4-5 seasons I'd have bailed when they pulled the bag off Rickon's head.

[The Fiddler]

15 minutes ago, Low Sparrow said:

The reason they chose to assassinate Ned's character is because some of the braindead twits that constitute their fanbase may remember that Cersei had Ned executed in S1. The new Cersei is a tragic misunderstood victim of patriarchs, priests and peasants. Not a psychotic delusional malignant narcissist.

I really, really, really don't see what they did to Ned's character as assassination. I hated the TOJ scene, but the actors were overall fine. Ned is young, unsure of himself, and desperate to save his sister, and just about everyone had already guessed that Howland saved him by using some pretty shady tactics. That doesn't reflect poorly on Ned, nor does him supposedly lying about that. 

[Red Tiger]

1 minute ago, TWR said:

I'm with you on 1,2 & 5. Also, I'm in too deep now to stop knowing there is a definite end date. If there was a possibity of the show dragging on for another 4-5 seasons I'd have bailed when they pulled the bag off Rickon's head.

Oh the fact that the show is close to ending is definitely a huge motivator for me. They pretty much have to finish it soon, a soon-to-be 20-year old Arya posing as a child might work for your standard American sitcom, but it wont look convincing on this show.

[Red Tiger]

5 minutes ago, The Fiddler said:

I really, really, really don't see what they did to Ned's character as assassination. I hated the TOJ scene, but the actors were overall fine. Ned is young, unsure of himself, and desperate to save his sister, and just about everyone had already guessed that Howland saved him by using some pretty shady tactics. That doesn't reflect poorly on Ned, nor does him supposedly lying about that. 

I agree, besides it was still part of a war not some honorable duel. It's stupid as fuck that they made Bran surprised by this, shit the books outright say from the start that Howland Reed saved Ned.

If Ned put honor above saving his sister? THAT would have been a character assassination.

[watcher of the night]

3 hours ago, Victarian Revolution said:

Why do you people watch this show just to whinge about it?

I understand the purpose of the topic but it seems pretty hypocritical and sad to watch something that you detest this much for six seasons?

Guess what: no one detested if for six seasons. I am sure most of us who posts here (myself included) loved the first 4 seasons. That is why it is so depressing to see the storyline disappearing in thin air.

Though, I guess we have to accept the fact that at this stage GoT is just a high budget fanfic.

[Philokles]

20 minutes ago, The Fiddler said:

I really, really, really don't see what they did to Ned's character as assassination. I hated the TOJ scene, but the actors were overall fine. Ned is young, unsure of himself, and desperate to save his sister, and just about everyone had already guessed that Howland saved him by using some pretty shady tactics. That doesn't reflect poorly on Ned, nor does him supposedly lying about that. 

D&D intended the way Howland killed Dayne to be dishonourable, regardless of the incompetency with which they did it. They also made him into an arrogant prat in the scene for no purpose, and to press that point even further made him later boast about killing Dayne - something he would never do because: 1) he is not that sort of person and 2) he would want to make the incidents at the ToJ as low key as possible. The second point one is worse, because its implications are not confined to Ned's character but damages the plot as a whole. Effectively they prioritised a criticism of Ned over credibility.

[Low Sparrow]

13 minutes ago, The Fiddler said:

I really, really, really don't see what they did to Ned's character as assassination. I hated the TOJ scene, but the actors were overall fine. Ned is young, unsure of himself, and desperate to save his sister, and just about everyone had already guessed that Howland saved him by using some pretty shady tactics. That doesn't reflect poorly on Ned, nor does him supposedly lying about that. 

From casting that emo loser to play him to implying that Ed would either boast or let a story be told of how he bested Dayne. The same Ed Stark character who would rather be beheaded than live out a lie. The same Ed who could have consolidated power by not honoring the rules of succession. The same Ed who could have crushed his enemies by grabbing one child in the middle of the night. Remember that Ed?

That Ed (not the one living in the bizarro-universe where Cersei does no wrong) would neither have boasted of besting Dane "1000" times, not let this falsehood be spoken "1000" times.