HexMachina Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, polishgenius said: Fair enough didn't look closely enough at that. No worries. I actually only found out because i went to look for a non-Daily Mail source, and all of the articles, including the DM, were the same 2013 date Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 It's still relevant, unless Gove has said anything since 2013 that indicates he's genuinely changed his opinion. It's not like "If you're poor, it's your fault" isn't a commonly and firmly held view among a segment of the political right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 1 hour ago, The Anti-Targ said: It's still relevant, unless Gove has said anything since 2013 that indicates he's genuinely changed his opinion. It's not like "If you're poor, it's your fault" isn't a commonly and firmly held view among a segment of the political right. Agreed, and nothing in Gove’s words or actions since suggest to me he holds a different position now. I just think, especially in todays media landscape, its important that news isnt presented in a misleading way. (to clarify - i think the tweet was misleading, i dont think polishgenius meant to be misleading) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said: Agreed, and nothing in Gove’s words or actions since suggest to me he holds a different position now. I just think, especially in todays media landscape, its important that news isnt presented in a misleading way. (to clarify - i think the tweet was misleading, i dont think polishgenius meant to be misleading) Misleading is a bit of an overstatement if there is no evidence anywhere that Gove has changed his tune. Also the tweet links directly to the 2013 article. I would rather assume that people don't get the entirety of their news information solely from the text typed into a tweet and when something is linked in a tweet people will actually click on the link and check the source and not just assume Gove said this yesterday. I understand the concern that the ethical media needs to try to be free from accusations of fake newsery. But assuming there's nothing fake news about the 2013 article this example doesn't even come close to that. Bascially, does Gove have any grounds to directly attack that tweet as misleading? Since it links the 2013 article as the source, no he doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigFatCoward Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 I wish the right were as diligent at calling themselves out. Why do we have to be honourable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 If we’re going to assume that Twitter users are diligent in checking sources then we might as well assume that Gove has changed his mind in the last six years. Both things are probably not true. 6 hours ago, BigFatCoward said: I wish the right were as diligent at calling themselves out. Why do we have to be honourable? Smugness is its own reward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Which Tyler Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 I've been busy, is anyone watching? Anything to report? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 34 minutes ago, Which Tyler said: I've been busy, is anyone watching? Anything to report? I haven't seen the debate, but I'm watching slack-jawed at the idiocy of the Tory Party Twitter account which changed its name to "Fact Check UK" and is now getting reported in the hundreds of thousands for fraudulently pretending to be a real fact check account. Several real fact checking organisations seem to be threatening legal action, and thousands of other people (including Charlie Brooker, who's gone to town on it) have changed their name to the same thing to drag them mercilessly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaircat Meow Posted November 19, 2019 Author Share Posted November 19, 2019 36 minutes ago, Which Tyler said: I've been busy, is anyone watching? Anything to report? Didn't watch but read commentary on twitter. People think it was a draw - both awful. That may be to Corbyn's gain but he didn't knock it out of the park even against a confused/ignorant debater like Johnson and he needed to to turn the campaign around. Bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Horse Named Stranger Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 Quite a turn from the last GE. I remember you almost dancing, when the Tories held on to power thanks to some seats they won in Scotland. Not a criticism or anything, just an observation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 Most commentary I’ve seen suggests Corbyn missed his chance to hurt Johnson here. Bit of a win for Johnson really Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 3 hours ago, Heartofice said: Most commentary I’ve seen suggests Corbyn missed his chance to hurt Johnson here. Bit of a win for Johnson really Corbyn's mere existence seems to be a win for Johnson. He made Boris look mildly competent by bungling his lines on Brexit (e.g. falsely stating that the DUP voted for the WAB). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 17 hours ago, john said: If we’re going to assume that Twitter users are diligent in checking sources then we might as well assume that Gove has changed his mind in the last six years. Both things are probably not true. If that is true, when the source is spoon fed, then there is no way we should be using twitter users as a weather vane for if something qualifies as misleading. If some tweeter complained that this particular tweet is misleading because Gove said it in 2013, the correct response is "we know dumbass, it's linked in the tweet." not "Oh sorry, will do better next time." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Having to click a link to check for a date which is not even casually mentioned in the body of the text is an odd definition of the phrase spoon fed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Yeah I didn't think it would prove so contentious to say that someone posting an article and saying "X said Y" is misleading because people would assume the article is recent/current. Again, it's not the content that I think is misleading, I imagine Gove still holds those views, I'm just suggesting a little care is taken to ensure people aren't misled. And like it or lump it, many people Do take their news updates/news bites from social media like twitter and facebook. So I don't think it's unreasonable to call it misleading Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaircat Meow Posted November 20, 2019 Author Share Posted November 20, 2019 20 hours ago, Heartofice said: Most commentary I’ve seen suggests Corbyn missed his chance to hurt Johnson here. Bit of a win for Johnson really Johnson didn't even need to do this debate though - he could have gone for the seven way debate like Cameron did in 2015. Going one-on-one was a sort of pointless risk especially when his debate skills are so weak, so I'm not sure how he wins just because he didn't fall flat on his face. And The Absolute Boy did better with undecided voters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rippounet Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 I'm somehow reminded of this quip by one of the forum regulars here saying that you can always count on the left to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Hedge Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 We will not have to pay this degenerate's travel expenses for a while. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/nov/20/prince-andrew-to-step-back-from-public-duties-for-foreseeable-future Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 15 hours ago, john said: Having to click a link to check for a date which is not even casually mentioned in the body of the text is an odd definition of the phrase spoon fed. If you don't care when Gove said it, then you don't need to check. But don't claim you've been mislead when the source of the information is right there in front of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 11 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said: Yeah I didn't think it would prove so contentious to say that someone posting an article and saying "X said Y" is misleading because people would assume the article is recent/current. Again, it's not the content that I think is misleading, I imagine Gove still holds those views, I'm just suggesting a little care is taken to ensure people aren't misled. And like it or lump it, many people Do take their news updates/news bites from social media like twitter and facebook. So I don't think it's unreasonable to call it misleading If people are so superficial about getting their news information when given access to the full information with a single mouse click, they have no right to claim to have been mislead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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