US Politics: In A Hypocritical Condition

[DMC]

1 minute ago, IheartIheartTesla said:

Yeah, I saw that too (it was mainly the Republican pollster who said that I think, they had both a D and an R design it); kinda begs the question just why they took a poll right after if it ends up being useless. Experts should take these things into consideration.

Examining overreactions and the length of which they remain overreactions is still very important data.  Just because a poll is an outlier and/or is based on a snapshot in time does not mean it doesn't help build empirical knowledge - as long as it's appropriately designed and administered. 

[A Horse Named Stranger]

Just now, IheartIheartTesla said:

Also, why do they want to release Trump tomorrow? Regardless of how he is feeling, the next few days are critical, and even though the WH is well staffed and equipped, its not a hospital.

The longer he stays in hospital, the worse it looks for the guy campaigning on the wannabe strongman image.

[Kalbear]

3 minutes ago, IheartIheartTesla said:

Yeah, I saw that too (it was mainly the Republican pollster who said that I think, they had both a D and an R design it); kinda begs the question just why they took a poll right after if it ends up being useless. Experts should take these things into consideration.

Because it would hit a major value one way or another and dominate the headlines? 

Pollsters kind of suck that way too, ya know.

1 minute ago, IheartIheartTesla said:

Also, why do they want to release Trump tomorrow? Regardless of how he is feeling, the next few days are critical, and even though the WH is well staffed and equipped, its not a hospital.

It's always best to frame any news conference or right-wing news feed for the intended  audience.

The audience is Trump. It isn't his supporters, it isn't his detractors, it isn't actually providing news - it is directly to Trump.

And they believe that telling Trump that he might get out tomorrow is helpful to his care. It's probably inaccurate. It's probably WILDLY inaccurate. But just like yesterday, they wanted to spin a good side not because the US population would buy it but because it is what Trump wants to hear.

[Ran]

Just now, DMC said:

I mean, the Dems can threaten to burn the Capitol down with the GOP caucuses in it upon taking power, it's still not going to deter McConnell and the GOP Senate from confirming Barrett.  Regardless, expanding the court needs to be one of the key - if not the key - agenda items for a Biden administration if the Dems can capture the Senate.

Yeah, I get the sense that Hennessey, at least, is reluctant to admit that she knows the GOP is going to barrel onwards, convinced that the Democrats will never really go through with expanding the court. But she lives in hope.

 

[A Horse Named Stranger]

4 minutes ago, DMC said:

That'd require a constitutional amendment for Congress to be able to do anything about it.  Obviously that ain't happening.  Best strategy is still the National Popular Vote, which has little to do with a president's agenda.

So requirements are higher than for expanding the Supreme Court?

Could you give a brief run down, what is needed (house, senate votes) for the three main things.

Electoral College

Expanding SCOTUS

Statehood for Puerto Rico and DC

[Kalbear]

5 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

So requirements are higher than for expanding the Supreme Court?

Could you give a brief run down, what is needed (house, senate votes) for the three main things.

Electoral College

Constitutional amendment - 3/4s of all states to ratify. And 2/3rds majority vote in congress.

Quote

Expanding SCOTUS

Law passed in House by simple majority, passed in senate (presumably after removing the filibuster), signed by POTUS.

Quote

Statehood for Puerto Rico and DC

Puerto Rico: Law passed in House by simple majority, passed in senate (presumably after removing the filibuster), signed by POTUS, and approved by citizens of Puerto Rico

DC:  as above, plus potentially removing a lot of legal hurdles around Maryland, the Federal government having so much dependency on one single state, who would be the governor/mayor/etc, population and size considerations. 

[DMC]

Just now, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Could you give a brief run down, what is needed (house, senate votes) for the three main things.

Electoral College

Expanding SCOTUS

Statehood for Puerto Rico and DC

The Electoral College is in the constitution, so that would require a constitutional amendment to abolish it.  The constitution grants Congress the power to establish the composition of SCOTUS (and create all lower federal courts, for that matter), so all that is needed is the same as any other legislation - pass the House and Senate and signed by the president.  Starting with the 1789 Judiciary Act Congress has established/changed the composition of the court 7 times, mostly during the first half of the 19th century and it's been set at nine justices since, like, 1868 if memory serves. 

Same thing for statehood - the constitution provides that Congress can admit Puerto Rico and DC as states with the president's signature.  For the latter two, obviously the filibuster is an obstacle in the Senate.  But that's far less of an obstacle than requiring a constitutional amendment.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

Thanks, altho, Kal was more spot on, what I wanted to know.

Remember, not a yank, so I had no idea, what the requirements are for a constitutional amendment. Two thirds in borth houses, majority in both houses + majority of states.

So @Kalibear  was more down to what I wanted to know.

[IheartIheartTesla]

13 minutes ago, Kalibear said:

And they believe that telling Trump that he might get out tomorrow is helpful to his care. It's probably inaccurate. It's probably WILDLY inaccurate. But just like yesterday, they wanted to spin a good side not because the US population would buy it but because it is what Trump wants to hear.

My own opinion was that they were actually going to release him tomorrow, primarily because Trump would want to leave (he has never spent overnight in a hospital before); but maybe even with all their dissembling they really do want him to return to health.

[DMC]

2 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Remember, not a yank, so I had no idea, what the requirements are for a constitutional amendment. Two thirds in borth houses, majority in both houses + majority of states.

Ah, yeah.  Here's a good description of the proposal and ratification process.  Doesn't necessarily have to go through Congress, although it always has:

Quote

The Constitution provides that an amendment may be proposed either by the Congress with a two-thirds majority vote in both the House of Representatives and the Senate or by a constitutional convention called for by two-thirds of the State legislatures. None of the 27 amendments to the Constitution have been proposed by constitutional convention. The Congress proposes an amendment in the form of a joint resolution. Since the President does not have a constitutional role in the amendment process, the joint resolution does not go to the White House for signature or approval. The original document is forwarded directly to NARA's Office of the Federal Register (OFR) for processing and publication. The OFR adds legislative history notes to the joint resolution and publishes it in slip law format. The OFR also assembles an information package for the States which includes formal "red-line" copies of the joint resolution, copies of the joint resolution in slip law format, and the statutory procedure for ratification under 1 U.S.C. 106b.

The Archivist submits the proposed amendment to the States for their consideration by sending a letter of notification to each Governor along with the informational material prepared by the OFR. The Governors then formally submit the amendment to their State legislatures or the state calls for a convention, depending on what Congress has specified. In the past, some State legislatures have not waited to receive official notice before taking action on a proposed amendment. When a State ratifies a proposed amendment, it sends the Archivist an original or certified copy of the State action, which is immediately conveyed to the Director of the Federal Register. The OFR examines ratification documents for facial legal sufficiency and an authenticating signature. If the documents are found to be in good order, the Director acknowledges receipt and maintains custody of them. The OFR retains these documents until an amendment is adopted or fails, and then transfers the records to the National Archives for preservation.

 

[Castellan]

41 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

The longer he stays in hospital, the worse it looks for the guy campaigning on the wannabe strongman image.

But shat's logic! His appeal is illogic.. Voting for him is a celebration of dumbness. 

[Fez]

34 minutes ago, Kalibear said:

DC:  as above, plus potentially removing a lot of legal hurdles around Maryland, the Federal government having so much dependency on one single state, who would be the governor/mayor/etc, population and size considerations. 

There probably aren't any legal issues with Maryland unless the state decided to sue, saying that the language of the state law ceding the land to Congress was only for establishing a federal capital district and nothing else. I'd be surprised if the state sued. If they did though, I have no idea how the merits of that might play out.

I think a lot of issues, around that and other things, get resolved though by still maintaining a small Federal "District of Columbia containing the National Mall (and associated buildings and monuments), Capitol Hill (including its office buildings), the Supreme Court building, the White House complex, and the nearby agency headquarters. If kept contiguous, a few hotels, other businesses, and maybe a handful of residents, would still reside in the District as well. But if contiguousness isn't an a concern, they can all be carved out. And then the rest of the current district becomes the State of Washington, Douglass Commonwealth (I don't love the name, but that's the current proposed one).

There shouldn't be any issues around organizing the new state government, no more than any other new state had upon entry.

[DMC]

5 minutes ago, Fez said:

I think a lot of issues, around that and other things, get resolved though by still maintaining a small Federal "District of Columbia containing the National Mall (and associated buildings and monuments), Capitol Hill (including its office buildings), the Supreme Court building, the White House complex, and the nearby agency headquarters.

Yeah the bill that passed the House in June spells all this out clearly in Title I subsection B, Maryland would have no standing to sue:

Quote

Subtitle B--Seat of Government of the United States

(Sec. 111) This subtitle declares that the state shall consists of all of District territory as of enactment of this bill, with specified exclusions for federal buildings and monuments, including the principal federal monuments, the White House, the Capitol Building, the U.S. Supreme Court Building, and the federal executive, legislative, and judicial office buildings located adjacent to the Mall and the Capitol Building,

District territory excluded from the state shall be known as the Capital and shall be the seat of the federal government. The John A. Wilson Building shall not be included in the Capital. The entirety of the Frances Perkins Building, including any portion of the building located north of D Street NW, shall be included in the Capital.

(Sec. 113) The state and the Capital shall each maintain title and jurisdiction over all real and personal property held by them before the state was admitted into the Union.

(Sec. 114) This section requires current District laws to apply in the Capital.

(Sec. 115) This section renames the District of Columbia National Guard as the Capital National Guard and makes it an exclusive federal entity for the Capital.

(Sec. 116) This section declares that the Capital is neither a government nor a body corporate for municipal purposes.

Subtitle C--General Provisions Relating to Laws of State

 

[Centrist Simon Steele]

1 hour ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

He didn't cause it. He's botched the response and made things worse than they needed to be. But he obviously wasn't standing in a Bio-Chem Lab creating that virus.

Again, caused is the wrong word. So expressing sympathy and displaying, well, basic human decency is now taking sides? Again, what did Biden actually do. He wished him and well and offered a prayer for a speedy recovery. That bastard. If that's about the extent of the worries in your life, I envy you.

Talking about seeing beyond the binary, eh?

Or it shows your total absense of political instincts/common sense within you. No, offense. But that's pretty much the only explanation, on why you would even contemplate providing a collapsing Trump campaign with even a tiny bit of ammunition. If you fail to see how your "good argument" will be spun, then we should all thank the holy spaghetti monster, that you have no influence over Biden.

Again, Biden's campaign is build around decency and character matter, let's rebuild those. Biden can hammer Trump over dodging out of the campaign thanks to that hoax, or whatever if the Trump tries that. For now this goes absolutely swimmingly for Biden. Trump's claim it's nothing gets contradicted by him having to go to the hospital and being put on experimental medication.

Isn't that obvious?

I really can't argue with you when you refuse to acknowledge things I've said multiple times, and you want to hurl insults to...I don't know...be decent?

[Castellan]

I cannot believe it would be good for Trump's heath to be released tomorrow and it will not happen. I like the way he's stuck in hospital and still the lying goes on. I think it's to that doctor's credit that he was so bad at lying about the supplemental oxygen. Probably hadn't had to lie about medical facts until he encountered Trump.

[Fez]

26 minutes ago, DMC said:

Yeah the bill that passed the House in June spells all this out clearly in Title I subsection B, Maryland would have no standing to sue:

Yeah, just passing that bill again should work.

Though I wonder why the DoL building is getting a special shout-out saying it'd stay part of the federal district. It's hardly the only agency HQ that's near-but-not-actually-adjacent to the Mall/Capitol Building.

[Fragile Bird]

Looks like Trump just left Walter Reed to go back to the White House.

[Castellan]

5 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

Looks like Trump just left Walter Reed to go back to the White House.

confusion on whether he is returning or just visiting the supporters

[Castellan]

https://madison.com/ct/news/local/govt-and-politics/after-testing-positive-for-covid-19-ron-johnson-says-hes-still-against-mask-mandates/article_779c1b9f-e725-55cf-944c-03122be174e7.html

This guy is a moron. He said there was no reason to self isolate because he is not sick (ie no symptoms). 

[Fragile Bird]

Looks like it was just a stunt.