What should become of the Dreadfort and the Bolton lands after their defeat ?

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

Once Roose and Ramsay are dead and that house Bolton is finally defeated and eradicated forever, what do you think should happen to their ancestral lands and of the Dreadfort ?

Will their lands and castle be given to one or several new houses ? Who could possibly get these lands from the returning Stark children or a victorious Stannis ?

Could the Bolton lands be divided between the neighboring houses such as the Umbers, the Manderlys, Karstarks and Hornwoods or their vassals ? 

Will the Dreadfort be occupied again or could it be abandonned or even put to the torch like Ramsay did to Winterfell as a symbolic way of showing the end of house Bolton ?

[Loose Bolt]

I assume that people who has some kind of claim for that castle will try to secure their status as new lord of DF. But we do not know who those people are.

[Canon Claude]

5 hours ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

Once Roose and Ramsay are dead and that house Bolton is finally defeated and eradicated forever,

Who says Roose and Ramsay are the last Boltons left?

It wouldn’t be the first time that GRRM has retconned relatives to ensure a house’s survival.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

8 minutes ago, Canon Claude said:

Who says Roose and Ramsay are the last Boltons left?

It wouldn’t be the first time that GRRM has retconned relatives to ensure a house’s survival.

The fact that Roose kept Ramsay alive after Domeric's death and lamented that he had no other heir than him, because he would most likely have had one of his cousins or nephews as his new heir instead of Ramsay and killed Ramsay for Domeric's death if he had one, and that even someone as dumb as a rock would have been a better heir than Ramsay. 

Edited December 23, 2021 by Terrorthatflapsinthenight9

[Canon Claude]

29 minutes ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

The fact that Roose kept Ramsay alive after Domeric's death and lamented that he had no other heir than him, because he would most likely have had one of his cousins or nephews as his new heir instead of Ramsay and killed Ramsay for Domeric's death if he had one, and that even someone as dumb as a rock would have been a better heir than Ramsay. 

There’s probably going to be a surprise Bolton marriage to one of the other houses, like one of Roose’s aunts married into House Ryswell or something, and so it’ll go to one of Barbrey’s brothers.

[Floki of the Ironborn]

37 minutes ago, Canon Claude said:

It wouldn’t be the first time that GRRM has retconned relatives to ensure a house’s survival.

When exactly has he done that before??

[Curled Finger]

The Bolton lineage is such a stand out thing amid the extensive family trees of nearly every other house in the books.  We get what, mention of 4 Boltons in total?   Even if there ends up being 20 that's still a very small amount of PR for this story about families.   House Bolton is weird.   It is as though Martin himself is wiping them out page by page.  So yes, I do see those Bolton lands being up for grabs in the future.  Figure a Stark will retake Winterfell because duh, Starks belong there, but there are the Dreadfort and Hornwood lands.  We know the northern lords are keen on taking more lands but we also see a massive migration of people from north of the Wall becoming major players in defending the North.  We've already got 1 wildling house married into the Karstarks and establishing a new northern house in the arrangement.  The northern houses in existence at this time seem to be dwindling.  They almost need an infusion of new 1st Men blood to continue as an independent nation.   House Thenn is the last of the Free Folk I would have imagined taking up residence in the south but there it is.  As to arranging the best fit in the southern north I would imagine rewards will go to Wildling clans who have already demonstrated an ability to follow established rules of society which leaves me with the Skaggosi.  They have a magnar as the Thenns do, so they already grasp pecking orders.   That leaves at least 1 more open castle & land for some new or new merged house to take root.  Perhaps Jeyne Poole will get a reward or even Mance Rayder.  Perhaps it will be a love nest for Tormund and Alysanne Mormont.  Perhaps no one will want the Dreadfort and it will become the prison the Nights Watch has become.  Nah, I think there will be more vacant castles than people by the end of all of this.  

[Universal Sword Donor]

On 12/23/2021 at 5:07 PM, Floki of the Ironborn said:

When exactly has he done that before??

I don't know if it's exactly the scenario, but the Ryswells were def retconned as a stronger house with a ton more members than necessary. However Faegon and Harry the Heir would fall into that category, being introduced in ADWD and AFFC respectively.

[Canon Claude]

55 minutes ago, Universal Sword Donor said:

I don't know if it's exactly the scenario, but the Ryswells were def retconned as a stronger house with a ton more members than necessary. However Faegon and Harry the Heir would fall into that category, being introduced in ADWD and AFFC respectively.

There’s also the fact that Jon Umber brought all his sons and brothers to the army with Robb, but now he’s apparently got more sons according to Jon Snow. Did they somehow survive the Red Wedding and make it back home?

[Universal Sword Donor]

10 minutes ago, Canon Claude said:

There’s also the fact that Jon Umber brought all his sons and brothers to the army with Robb, but now he’s apparently got more sons according to Jon Snow. Did they somehow survive the Red Wedding and make it back home?

I'd imagine they were young enough to not go to war. Smalljon was the heir, but for some reason I can't explain I have him as 17-18 in my head canon. Literally nothing in the text supports that but my guess is the other sons are young enough to be pages and squires, not fit to go to war.

[Corvo the Crow]

On 12/25/2021 at 10:20 PM, Universal Sword Donor said:

I don't know if it's exactly the scenario, but the Ryswells were def retconned as a stronger house with a ton more members than necessary. However Faegon and Harry the Heir would fall into that category, being introduced in ADWD and AFFC respectively.

Harry the Heir wouldn't fall into that category as he's not an Arryn and There are plenty of Arryns still alive throughout the Vale. Though we haven't seen any, Starks, too, exist in Barrowton and White Harbor as was told in SSMs. Many houses that held more than a few villages have spread their branches so wide, most don't have much besides the name. Take Dolorous Edd Tollett for example, he is so far from the main branch, he says he grew up in a "keep" like Craster's.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

I do like the idea of House Thenn getting the Dreadfort or at least the main Bolton lands, with the castle being either abandonned or demolished in favor of a new and far less creepy and dreadsome castle, though some of the lands would be recut and redistributed to the neighbors with Larence Snow/Hornwood getting all the Hornwood lands back and the Umbers and Manderlys or their vassals getting some of the border lands as reward for their loyalty to House Stark. 

[Darth Sidious]

On 12/23/2021 at 4:29 PM, Canon Claude said:

Who says Roose and Ramsay are the last Boltons left?

It wouldn’t be the first time that GRRM has retconned relatives to ensure a house’s survival.

Good point. I will add this and you may not agree. The Starks have no right to make such determinations. They no longer rule the north. 

[Canon Claude]

22 minutes ago, Darth Sidious said:

Good point. I will add this and you may not agree. The Starks have no right to make such determinations. They no longer rule the north. 

If the Starks take back Winterfell and the houses join their banners to theirs, I’d say that they would rule the North again. And by that point, House Bolton would have to be in complete disarray.

[Buried Treasure]

Walda Bolton is pregnant. Roose thinks it likely that Ramsay will kill the child, but in a scenario where both men are defeated soon that might not happen.

 

If she has a daughter then the direct Bolton line is ended. Perhaps the girl would be made a ward of whatever family was granted the land, eventually to be married to the male heir of that family.

 

I'm not so sure about is Walda had a son - I don't think newborns are accepted into Watch. Maybe the House would continue but stripped of much of its land so it is not so powerful.

[Lucia Targaryen]

If Harrion Karstark survives then I would give the Bolton lands to Alys and Sigorn. The Dreadfort should be destroyed no matter what. 

[Corvo the Crow]

Plenty of land to raise several Wildling Lords, if you ask me. Gerrick Kingsblood with his red hair can take the seat of "Red Kings". Karstarks laid claim to Hornwood IIRC so Alys can take that if Harrion survives but the closest relation are Tallharts and they even said they'd take the name.

[Corvo the Crow]

19 hours ago, Buried Treasure said:

Walda Bolton is pregnant. Roose thinks it likely that Ramsay will kill the child, but in a scenario where both men are defeated soon that might not happen.

 

If she has a daughter then the direct Bolton line is ended. Perhaps the girl would be made a ward of whatever family was granted the land, eventually to be married to the male heir of that family.

 

I'm not so sure about is Walda had a son - I don't think newborns are accepted into Watch. Maybe the House would continue but stripped of much of its land so it is not so powerful.

That is the normal procedure. We see several houses that lose nine tenths of their lands after the Rebellion and even have their status of Lord revoked and become landed knights. House Bolton still being so powerful even after several rebellions is a real mistake. Starks have extinguished houses that weren' even traitorous rebels but proper enemies and yet Boltons who have rebelled several times remain a relatively powerful house? Inconsistent with the "rules" of the world so a mistake to write it that way.

Edited February 19, 2022 by Corvo the Crow

[Lady_Qohor]

I don't know who will get the lands or who is legally entitled to them. 

But I'd like it if everything went to Jeyne Poole. She could burn the Dreadfort to the ground if it made her happy or use all that money just you make her life a bit easier and a bit happier after everything she has suffered. 

[Aebram]

If either Bolton survives the coming war(s), they should be killed. They have earned it by their various atrocities. I would love to see the entire line extinguished, even if it means killing Walda's baby. The Dreadfort should be pulled down; it's been the site of too much cruelty and treachery to stand any longer.

Come to think of it, House Frey has earned a similar punishment because of their role the Red Wedding. Here's a poetic twist: give one of the Twins to House Blackwood, and the other to house Bracken. Then they'd have to cooperate in order to protect and maintain the bridge, which would be an important source of revenue to both of them.