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Marvel's Multiverse of Maddening Returns

Myrddin

By Myrddin,
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Myrddin Council Member

Myrddin

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I was going to ask about Madame Webb in the Trailer thread, but this seems like the better place. Given the nebulous nature of the Multiverse Saga in the MCU, my question about Sony's multiverse intersecting MCU Prime feels appropriate way to start a new thread.

So. We have another Spiderverse movie. Have they even confirmed whether Venom, Morbius (snicker), Kraven, and Madame Webb are in the same universe?

All I know is Tom Holland's Spider-Man is in 616 and Tom Hardy's Venom is not.

And they wonder why casual viewers are overwhelmed and confused by MCU Phase 4 and 5 alongside Sony's Phase 1.5. 

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Rhom Council Member

Rhom

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3 hours ago, Myrddin said:

I was going to ask about Madame Webb in the Trailer thread, but this seems like the better place. Given the nebulous nature of the Multiverse Saga in the MCU, my question about Sony's multiverse intersecting MCU Prime feels appropriate way to start a new thread.

So. We have another Spiderverse movie. Have they even confirmed whether Venom, Morbius (snicker), Kraven, and Madame Webb are in the same universe?

All I know is Tom Holland's Spider-Man is in 616 and Tom Hardy's Venom is not.

And they wonder why casual viewers are overwhelmed and confused by MCU Phase 4 and 5 alongside Sony's Phase 1.5. 

Its like someone crossed Final Destination with a superhero movie...

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Myrddin Council Member

Myrddin

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5 minutes ago, Corvinus85 said:

The director for Avengers: The Kang Dynasty has left the project. That makes the rumors about the MCU potentially distancing itself from Majors and getting rid of Kang even stronger.

 

5 minutes ago, IlyaP said:

Woah. Avengers: The Kang Dynasty just lost its director.

Corvinus was NOT going to be ninja'd again in the same thread!

ETA: They should just recon Loki's finale as having solved the Kang problem and move forward with Doom and/or X-Men. It's not like anyone is really invested in Kang as a character/threat.

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Rhom Council Member

Rhom

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10 minutes ago, Myrddin said:

 

Corvinus was NOT going to be ninja'd again in the same thread!

ETA: They should just recon Loki's finale as having solved the Kang problem and move forward with Doom and/or X-Men. It's not like anyone is really invested in Kang as a character/threat.

Considering that no one even knew we were even in a phase with the last sequence of movies; I think you could quite easily just pivot away and make Deadpool 3 the Avengers type event that changes the approach.

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IlyaP Council Member

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13 minutes ago, Rhom said:

Considering that no one even knew we were even in a phase with the last sequence of movies; I think you could quite easily just pivot away and make Deadpool 3 the Avengers type event that changes the approach.

Crazy idea: what if we just...stopped? Like, what if we just stopped making comic book movies? 

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Rhom Council Member

Rhom

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I don't know why there's so much confusion on why things aren't working.

The first two phases were very clearly delineated.  

IM -> Hulk -> IM2 -> Thor -> Cap -> Avengers

IM3 -> Thor 2 -> Cap3 -> Avengers 2

I complained at the time a couple years ago that there was no current phase.  Throwing a bunch of standalone movies at the wall with no structure and no "event" to target made the entire franchise feel aimless.

Step back.  Take a breath.  Focus on how to build.  

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IlyaP Council Member

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21 minutes ago, Rhom said:

I complained at the time a couple years ago that there was no current phase.  Throwing a bunch of standalone movies at the wall with no structure and no "event" to target made the entire franchise feel aimless.

What if it's like Dallas, and everything after Endgame is just The Watcher having like, an insane drug trip, and like Pam in Dallas, it was all a dream? A giant cosmic hallucination brought about by too many cervezas and nachos on movie night at The Watcher's House of Fun.

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Myrddin Council Member

Myrddin

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26 minutes ago, Rhom said:

IM -> Hulk -> IM2 -> Thor -> Cap -> Avengers

Granted they were only loosely aiming (hoping) for an Avengers movie at first, they were still able to organically sow the seeds of the end of Phase 1 within the others. Loki was established in Thor and the Tessaract in Cap.

 

30 minutes ago, Rhom said:

IM3 -> Thor 2 -> Cap2 -> Avengers 2

Again, Age of Ultron was organically set up in the others. IM3 = Stark with PTSD wanting to create a shield around the world.  Cap 2 = Rogers starting to distrust idea of power in the wrong hands. Ultron was the result of both vision* and worst nightmare of both Rogers and Stark.

Of course, that concept took one step further in Civil War (Avengers 2.5) to break up the team, and set up losing in Infinity War.

The only thing I feel from Phase 4 is the Chaos of the Multiverse (which I guess is the point?) and the leadership vacuum left in the wake of Endgame.

 

*unintended nod toward Vision. heh.

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SpaceChampion Council Member

SpaceChampion

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Confirmation: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/fantastic-four-casts-reed-richards-1235392357/

Still dependent on sorting out his shooting schedule though.  He's apparently not returning for season 4 of Mando.

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Rhom Council Member

Rhom

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21 minutes ago, Myrddin said:

The only thing I feel from Phase 4 is the Chaos of the Multiverse (which I guess is the point?) and the leadership vacuum left in the wake of Endgame.

Was that the point of it?  "Phase 4" has always been hard for me to delineate.  Yeah you had the fake out multiverse in Far From Home and then the real Multiverse movies in No Way Home/Multiverse of Madness.  But you also had movies that had no seeming connection to multiverse in Shang Chi, Eternals, and BP2.  Was Quantumania the end of P4 or the beginning of P5? :dunno:   Even the TV shows didn't have a consistent theme there.  WandaVision only teased a multiverse with the the Boner joke.  Hawkeye.  MoonKnight.  SheHulk.  No multiverse.  Loki and What If? were clearly MV.

So when you look at a "set up," there wasn't even a consistent hook for that.

Even the post credits scenes didn't do much to build it up.  Instead we had things like whatever happened at the end of Shang Chi and a signal of some sort.  A sword at the end of Eternals we are likely to never see now.  In P1/P2, most of the real shared universe building was done in those short scenes "I. Am. Ironman." "Have you ever heard of the Avengers initiative?" "There's a hammer in the desert"  "Fine I'll do it myself."  Those are the only real things that hinted at a larger universe at first.  

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Corvinus85 Council Member

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1 hour ago, Myrddin said:

ETA: They should just recon Loki's finale as having solved the Kang problem and move forward with Doom and/or X-Men. It's not like anyone is really invested in Kang as a character/threat.

I thought they kinda did. The TVA is busy hunting Kang variants. I figure that they'll be successful at this job until Feige and co. decide to re-cast Kang and then we can have a Council of Kangs big event movie.

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