Winterfella Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 How can anyone not think the strike had an effect on this season? It went from being 20+ episodes (supposedly across two or three arcs) to just 12 episodes. Story lines have obviously been truncated and switched about and hurried. I won't comment on bad acting, because that's frankly gonna happen (looking at you Mr. West). But to think that a full slate of episodes wouldn't have helped get the writers into a better stride is dumb. There are flaws, I'm not arguing that there aren't. I'm suggesting some of those flaws would have been non-existant or worked themselves out over the course of 20+ episodes. From everything I've read, I'm pretty certain that these 11 episodes were going to be the first 11 episodes of the 22 episode season, strike or no strike. What you see was in the can before the strike began. The only thing the strike did was spare us 11 more episodes of this crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon AS Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 From everything I've read, I'm pretty certain that these 11 episodes were going to be the first 11 episodes of the 22 episode season, strike or no strike. What you see was in the can before the strike began. The only thing the strike did was spare us 11 more episodes of this crap. Yeah, if they changed anything during the course of the season it was because of negative viewer reactions. There was even a story about Kring refusing to change anything about the 11th episode right before the strike to turn it into a more effective season finale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EHK for Darwin Posted November 27, 2007 Author Share Posted November 27, 2007 How can anyone not think the strike had an effect on this season? It went from being 20+ episodes (supposedly across two or three arcs) to just 12 episodes. Story lines have obviously been truncated and switched about and hurried. They had always intended the first 11 eps to be their own self-contained (more or less) chapter. The season was conceived in three parts (the other two shorter of course) to avoid the sort of viewer dropoff the show suffered after last season's long hiatus. It was always the plan to have episode 11 as a 'mid-season' climax of sorts, ending a number of existing storylines. The strike didn't change that. Maybe it led them to tie off a few more loose ends, but they always were planning on tying off a number of them. The shit they had planned for the second and third 'chapters' will still presumably be there once production restarts. This season is shit on its own merits. The strike had very little to do with it as far as I can tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heal Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 For the second to last episode of the season, I found tonight's show a bit slow. It had it's cool parts--I even have dedicated a section to them at the bottom of the post--but I looked at my watch a lot throughout the episode. Overall, I think Heroes has come a long way since the beginning of the season. I think many Heroes viewers are just spoiled from the novelty and plot twists of the first season so they are critical when stories/characters aren't up to snuff. But, that said, I am looking forward to the season finale. As the ads keep saying, "It all comes down to this." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandsnake Posted November 28, 2007 Share Posted November 28, 2007 1. Adam, despite having no empirical data to test the question, knows that he can die via decapitation/getting the head blown off. In one of the graphic novels, Adam meets a man called Evan in 1777 who has the same power as him, I'm assuming he killed him and that's how he knows what can kill him.. Novel 60 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EHK for Darwin Posted November 28, 2007 Author Share Posted November 28, 2007 *Smacks the living shit out of Sandsnake* Sorry. But I said (either here or on IMDB boards) that I would beat the living shit out of any person that brought up the annoying and irrelevant graphic novels as evidence of ANYTHING in this show. I don't really care if creators say its canon. The fact is the show has 10 million veiwers. The graphic novels have several thousand. If some piece of background or story doesn't make the show, that means the writers simply didn't think it was important or relevant enough to go in there. And for pretty much all purposes, it doesn't exist. You do not lay necessary foundation or explanation outside of the lone essential medium. (the show) My comment still applies. Hate the damned graphic novels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerxes Posted November 28, 2007 Share Posted November 28, 2007 Like it or not the graphic novels are cannon. As for the head thing, it wouldn't take him 400 years to figure out head wounds affect him differently from normal ones (see Claire with stick and Peter with glass) not to mention Victoria Pratt and therefore the company also knew possibly due to some research discovering the secret of the powers lay in the brain. Given the other completely inexplicable plot holes this season, it's a minor point with plenty of explanations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted November 28, 2007 Share Posted November 28, 2007 Love the graphic novels. Not indulging in cross-media creative material is just so 90's, EHK. Sandsnake, In fact, #61 shows that the Evan fellow can create clones of himself, rather than heal wounds. Sort of like Jaime Madrox, the Multiple Man. Re: Adam's head, Is it even established that he really believes that getting his head blown off would do him in? He claims to Peter that it would work, but then he's using that simply as an excuse for why he killed her, when it's clear that that was his intent all along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Time for Wolves Posted November 28, 2007 Share Posted November 28, 2007 Given the other completely inexplicable plot holes this season, it's a minor point with plenty of explanations. Hmm, I'm not so sure about that. There are too many plotholes around Adam - why didn't they take his blood when they knew it was possibly the only antidote to the virus they developed? Why didn't they kill him if they knew how? How do you explain Adam saying, "they would've killed if they could", while later revealing that Pratt knew how to kill him. And a head shot is so simple - are we expected to believe that they never experimented that particular method? Anyway, I can agree with some of explanations for other problems that others put forward in the last couple pages. Mohinder is a dumbass, but his motivations are at least somewhat consistent (and that's really saying something, by this point). I also think this show had a lot of potential - I enjoyed many of the second season episodes despite all the problems. But it's just getting hard to ignore the sloppiness. And I agree that Peter is too powerful. Way too powerful. And yet he doesn't use his powers effectively - I completely forgot about telekinesis. Sylar was such a badass back in the day. Kay Fury: Yes. I was in awe too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grozeng Posted November 28, 2007 Share Posted November 28, 2007 Peter is telekinetic. For Sylar that means stopping bullets, throwing bodies, and slicing heads open. For the less experienced Peter who claims to 'remember everything', that should at least mean swatting aside a little twerp with a sharpened stick...if he intended to go the 'no hurting/killing' route. Again, why? Hiro has no useful combat abilities against Peter. Its not a matchup. Its the Kurgan facing off against a one-legged infant. But you forget. I know what happens from reading the spoilers. It sounds cool but will probably be a cop out and last 30 seconds. SPOILER: Peter Vs Hiro fight Peter counters every attack with the TK like a sword until Hiro gets the upper hand with the sword to his neck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grozeng Posted November 28, 2007 Share Posted November 28, 2007 They had always intended the first 11 eps to be their own self-contained (more or less) chapter. The season was conceived in three parts (the other two shorter of course) to avoid the sort of viewer dropoff the show suffered after last season's long hiatus. It was always the plan to have episode 11 as a 'mid-season' climax of sorts, ending a number of existing storylines. The strike didn't change that. Maybe it led them to tie off a few more loose ends, but they always were planning on tying off a number of them. The shit they had planned for the second and third 'chapters' will still presumably be there once production restarts. This season is shit on its own merits. The strike had very little to do with it as far as I can tell. They changed around some of the last 3 episodes and changed a bit of the ending because of the strike. According to the TV guide episode synopsis some of what was originally planned for Episode 10 was moved to Episode 9 and Episode 11. And from the preview for next week some things were changed from the original episode 11. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Mord Posted November 28, 2007 Share Posted November 28, 2007 Edit: The hell with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Mord Posted November 28, 2007 Share Posted November 28, 2007 BTW ... I've got some issues with the Founders. Firstly, was Adam a Founder or not? I can conceive how he would be, but that would mean that Kaito and Bob were conveniently excluding him from their tabulations -- although this is not unforgivable. Bob, of course, would hardly want to reveal the family skeletons to Mohinder, and Kaito was talking about potential victims, among whom, of course, he probably would never have considered Adam. But also -- while the names of the Founders have appeared on Wiki, I don't know where they came from. Parkman had little stickies on his photograph when he'd tracked them all down, but was someone actually able to read all those tiny things? And then, which names go with which persons? And lastly, and this is the one that today most disappointed me in this episode ... If Victoria left the company in 1977, what is she doing in that picture, which can't be more than, what, five, eight years old? If it's some kind of reunion party -- why would she go back to celebrate the reunion of founding a company whose purposes she now believes to be so deeply corrupt? Or ... maybe it's personal. Maybe she just is on such friendly terms with the others, personally, that she appeared for their sakes, sort of thing? Is there any indication of just when, in the backstory, Maury turned bad-guy? And why do people keep making references to "the Petrellis," meaning Arthur, too, as evil? All we know about him is he was clinically depressed and has since died, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerol Posted November 28, 2007 Share Posted November 28, 2007 I'm really getting tired of the whole thing. Every single plot thread depends on someone acting incredibly naive and stupid, either Maya, Peter, or Mohinder. At this point, I think that the little speck of litter hanging off my cat's butt has more foresight and common sense than Mohinder Suresh. I can handle a certain suspension of disbelief, overlook a few plot holes, etc. But the sheer amount of stupidity it takes for a plot line to advance here I something I can't take. After the first half of this season ends and the writers strike gets settled, I am going back to watching 2 1/2 Men. At least that show acknowledges that it is stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Time for Wolves Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 Is there any indication of just when, in the backstory, Maury turned bad-guy? And why do people keep making references to "the Petrellis," meaning Arthur, too, as evil? All we know about him is he was clinically depressed and has since died, right? Apparently Maury was manipulated by Adam - although honestly I don't know how a freaking mindmaster can be manipulated or seduced by someone else. Especially if Adam was locked up. Bob described Maury as a "blunt tool". And he's not dead, he's just trapped in his own nightmare and can't wake up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Time for Wolves Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 Yeah. I admit I like this show just because I WANT to like it, plot holes and all, but... Can I get a What What?!? What? What? I feel the same way. How dare you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelli Fury Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 I like this show because I like to objectify the men on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young Wolf Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 I like this show because I like to objectify the men on it. I concur. ETA: Oh shit. Dub's gonna be pissed when he sees that I made him sound somewhat gay with someone other than Terra. This is very obviously Mya. Really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Time for Wolves Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 I'm completely awesome. You should be happy Only shirtless Sylar makes me happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelli Fury Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 I'd be fine if Mohinder and Peter took their shirts off so long as they didn't talk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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