NBA Off-season

[Week]

Well, sure. But I didn't say stars, i said players.

Coddling Lenron is hardly an act of altruism. At least not to the level that fans seem to be expecting him to go to.

And by all reports he tried to get bosh to come so he could stay. So it isn't like he didn't try.

Well, we're talking loyalty regarding a superstar, not players, so your point from before is irrelevant. As is pointing out that loyalty != altruism. Nobody said they meant the same thing and it doesn't make it any less legitimate to expect reciprocation or at least a modicum of respect (of which he showed pretty much none).

[Swordfish]

Well, we're talking loyalty regarding a superstar, not players, so your point from before is irrelevant.

Well, I obviously disagree about that, because I don't think what they've shown him even really qualifies as loyalty. if he were not one of the premiere players in the league, they wouldn't be coddling him, and they'd drop him as soon as he stopped providing value. That's not loyalty, that's good business sense.

As is pointing out that loyalty != altruism. Nobody said they meant the same thing and it doesn't make it any less legitimate to expect reciprocation or at least a modicum of respect (of which he showed pretty much none).

Again, we'll have to disagree. Reportedly he tried to stay there, and we don't know what happened in conversations behind closed doors. So we don't really know how he treated them.

Some people just weren't going to be satisfied unless he played out his career languishing in Cleveland. I think that's kind of silly.

And I bet KG would agree with me.

[Slurktan]

Again, we'll have to disagree. Reportedly he tried to stay there, and we don't know what happened in conversations behind closed doors. So we don't really know how he treated them.

He didn't try and stay there. Watch the interview again when the reporter asks him if it was all planned out beforehand that the 3 would go to Miami. He says, "Well" smiles, and then completely avoids the question.

[Swordfish]

He didn't try and stay there. Watch the interview again when the reporter asks him if it was all planned out beforehand that the 3 would go to Miami. He says, "Well" smiles, and then completely avoids the question.

Ha. Well, I guess that's the definitive proof we needed.

BURN HIM!!!!

:laugh:

[Jaime L]

Hope Lebron's ready for the wave of hate that will descend on him whereever he goes now. He's no longer the darling of the NBA, the anti-Kobe...he's now the villain. I like how they started the broadcast talking about the Bulls as the childhood team he grew rooting for. He grew up in Ohio. In the early 90s the Bulls and Cavs had a great rivalry. What a front-running piece of crap. Can't respect a guy who has always and will always be the definition of a fair weather fan.

And this decision just reflects that. Not to mention even though he says the responsibility is now on all three stars equally...he totally upstaged his fellow "stars" by holding this self-serving hour long Lebron commercial two days after they signed to show he's really on a different level then they are.

Lebron, Bosh and to a lesser extent Wade all came off like world class assholes in this process with their combined steady stream of BS and self-serving sentiment. Whereas a lot of people cheered for the three old vets who came together in Boston to get the giant monkey of their collective backs, I don't think this Big 3 will receive an entirely different reception. They not only played and pissed off two of the biggest cities in this country: New York and Chicago, think they pretty effectively turned public sentiment against them. Almost hope they embrace the villain label...because the list of people hoping they crash and burn is long.

[palin99999]

All I can say as a Clevelander we are used to this.

Also, the past two weeks have been terrible for me personally, not because of Lebron, but because a family member of mine is very sick and it puts this whole Lebron bullshit in perspective. It's just sports.

[Slurktan]

Here's Dan Gilbert's(Owner of the Cavs) take:

http://www.nba.com/cavaliers/news/gilbert_letter_100708.html

Amusing if childish.

EDIT : Bizarrely used childless instead of childish.

[palin99999]

I love Dan Gilbert.

A relative of mine covers the Cavs, and Lebron in particular, and he has told me that there is a lot of stuff the Cavs have kept secret about Lebron that will now see the light of day.

[Slurktan]

And Riles moves quick, Beasley is sent to the Timberwolves for cap space. Good pickup by Minnesota actually, one year tryout for a former number 2 pick.

Also David Lee got signed and traded to the Warriors for a pu pu platter consisting of Azubukakke(sp?), Anthony Randolph and Ronny Turiaf.

[White Walker Texas Ranger]

Amusing if childish.

The font doesn't help.

[Jaime L]

Here's Dan Gilbert's(Owner of the Cavs) take:

http://www.nba.com/cavaliers/news/gilbert_letter_100708.html

Amusing if childish.

EDIT : Bizarrely used childless instead of childish.

Wow, that's great. Actually really liked that. If I was a Cavs fan would at least be a small silver lining to know the Owner feels the same way as has our back to that extent. It was an emotional appeal but I kinda like the ballsiness of saying now the curse has gone with Lebron and that Cleveland will win a title before he does.

How great would it be if that becomes true. Infact it's so ballsy and so over the top, even Disney would blush first when presented with the idea of turning this into a sports movie.

[aeu]

my issue is lebron, wade and bosch are pretty decent dudes. it will be hard for them to treat them as villains.

"I'm gonna take my talents to South Beach"

LeBron's a douche.

Pretty sure I heard in Wilbon's interview of LeBron that the 3 of them have agreed to take a little less than the max deal to allow for some room for other players.

That was a bit confusing but I think he was talking about all 3 of them taking slightly less money (like a million less each) to fit under the salary cap. The question asked for leaving space for other potential signings, but he answered a different question.

Only if there is MLE in the next CBA. It would be hilarious if after playing with scrubs next season the new CBA would force Miami to sell at least one of them for financial reasons.

I was thinking of the exact same thing.

Every year there are a bunch of decent starters that get or share the mid level exception. I definitely think Heat can get serviceable players (off the street even) with league minimums and fill the roster to make a run in their first year, but they will have to be pretty smart / creative. Starting in their second year, once they have the MLE (and the bi-annual exception as well), they can really get quality help.

But there are rumblings about owners wanting to get rid of the exceptions in the next CBA. That would really hurt the Heat. And if you cannot win a title in 2-3 years, do you trade Bosh or Wade to get 2-3 quality players? That would be beyond hilarious.

Another scenario I would like to see: For some reason Miami starts slow. They hover around 0.500 mid season. Pat Riley jumps in, stabs his coach in the back (again), starts coaching himself, rallies the team, takes the team into the playoffs as odds on favorites, Lebron starts dancing during games again...

And Steve Van Gundy beats them for his sweet, sweet revenge.

[Mya Stone]

Has any other superstar ever gone from hero to zero in this short amount of time before?

(Also, fuck, ESPN...please show me something else at this hour. Please? Pretty please?)

[Relic]

Fuck Lebron James. Fuck him up his narrow front running pussy ass. I seriously didnt want to end up hating him but his actions today have left me no choice. What a donkey fucking dip shit.

i want to see what happens when game 7 of the eastern conference finals rolls around and riley cant figure out which ego to draw up the play for.

[add-on]

I like how they started the broadcast talking about the Bulls as the childhood team he grew rooting for. He grew up in Ohio. In the early 90s the Bulls and Cavs had a great rivalry. What a front-running piece of crap. Can't respect a guy who has always and will always be the definition of a fair weather fan.

This is what I've been saying the whole time!

Here's Dan Gilbert's(Owner of the Cavs) take:

http://www.nba.com/cavaliers/news/gilbert_letter_100708.html

Amusing if childish.

Haha, loved that.

One thing that still baffles me a bit: I think the roster that Lebron would have had in Chicago would have been better than the one he's likely to have now. That's difficult to prove, but I don't think it's clear cut, and I would have thought Chicago would have a better market and he wouldn't have to share the spotlight with Wade.

Call me biased, but I think it is pretty clear cut that the Bulls were the much better fit for LeBron. We've already got the point guard and the defensive big that the Heat will need to get the ring for which LeBron supposedly made his decision. We also don't have the two alpha dogs problem.

[Slurktan]

We also don't have the two alpha dogs problem.

It's not a two alpha dogs problem no matter what the media is saying, it's 3. Bosh will have nowhere near his numbers scoring wise without the 30-35% usage he is used to.

EDIT: To illustrate my point here's an interview from 3 weeks ago

http://www.nba.com/2010/news/features/art_garcia/06/20/chris.bosh/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpt1

My favourite bit:

"I'm not an addition. I'm a centerpiece," he said. "I have to have that confidence in myself, and I want people to know that, because I'm not somebody that helps out. I'm the guy you get like, 'Yo, we're going to win a championship, you're gonna take us there.'

"I want to hold onto that because I think every kid when they dream about playing basketball, they don't dream about being a role player. They dream about being the man. I have that position in Toronto and to give that up and go somewhere else to be an addition would kinda defeat the purpose of my dreams."

EDIT 2:

More Dan Gilbert fun!

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5365793

He is accusing LeBron directly of quitting on the Cavs.

[Jaxom 1974]

And by all reports he tried to get bosh to come so he could stay. So it isn't like he didn't try.

As I was saying before, if LeBron was the type of player and personality he thought he was, then players should have wanted to play with him no matter where he was. Instead, Bosh and Wade read him for the man child he is and made him come to them.

Some people just weren't going to be satisfied unless he played out his career languishing in Cleveland. I think that's kind of silly.

And I bet KG would agree with me.

Again, it didn't have to be Cleveland, but he'd look stronger if it seemed like he was dictating where this triumverate was going. Sure it would have been better if he hadn't moved to find a title, made himself come across as a mercenary who'd rather be where others are going to have to do more of the heavy lifting for him. Any thoughts of a killer instinct in him are gone now.

Has any other superstar ever gone from hero to zero in this short amount of time before?

Tiger?

One thing that still baffles me a bit: I think the roster that Lebron would have had in Chicago would have been better than the one he's likely to have now. That's difficult to prove, but I don't think it's clear cut, and I would have thought Chicago would have a better market and he wouldn't have to share the spotlight with Wade.

More proof that the children LeBron surrounds himself with are giving him advice based on passion and selfishness rather than actual sound, business of basketball logic.

[Rhom]

And I bet KG would agree with me.

IIRC, after Boston beat Cleveland in the playoffs, KG told Lebron that sometimes loyalty can hurt you.

[Piper]

MC is right that Lebron, Wade, and Bosh are all decent guys, but I still think they'll be villains from this point on, at least in the sports villains sense.

While my ire has certainly been raised against LeBron along with everyone else's, personally I don't see Wade as a villain here. He stayed with his team, supposedly left money on the table to do so, and convinced two other stars to join him. Isn't that what any fan base would want from their best player?

[Former Lord of Winterfell]

More Dan Gilbert fun!

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5365793

He is accusing LeBron directly of quitting on the Cavs.

He's right.

Forgetting Gilbert for the moment, when was the last time a professional athlete was accused by the media and other athletes of tanking a game? But after Game 5 of the Boston series, there were a whole lot of those folks saying that there was something fishy about that game, and that LBJ's play in that game was inexplicable. It wasn't that he shot badly, because that can happen to anyone. It was standing around on the sidelines during play, not moving when teammates were trying to get the offense going, etc. He tanked it.

The horrible narcissism of "The Decision" is bad enough, but by pretending that his mind wasn't already made up, he essentially froze the Cavs' hand this offseason. They had the opportunity to buy a lottery pick in the first round with cash and assets, but held off because they wanted to save those assets for a deal that might keep LBJ. This farce of a free agency essentially delayed their ability to rebuild/reload for a full year.

Here's a pretty good article blasting him from a non-Cleveland source.

http://articles.latimes.com/2010/jul/08/sports/la-sp-plaschke-lebron-james-20100709