Viking Round Deux

[cdawnb]

Mild spoiler for Lagertha

We haven't seen the last of her. They are going to follow her story too.

[Alia of the knife]

Mild spoiler for Lagertha

We haven't seen the last of her. They are going to follow her story too.

I think I get what you are alluding to. :thumbsup:

[Alia of the knife]

Getting caught up as we speak, and is Ragnar unaware that LAGERTHA is married?

[Buckwheat]

Maybe Lagertha will get her husband to sell Ragnar's people winter supplies?

Going to England won't help them through the immediate winter they're facing.

I got the idea though that Ragnar had food resources whereever it was he and Auslag and his war band had holed up?

Hmmm, maybe if he has enough to sell. Lagertha is definitely able to do it.

I am sure they had supplies for the small group of people - Rollo, Siggy, Aslaug and the kids and a bunch of others that ran away with them - but I am pretty sure there is not enough for the whole village.

Could it be that Athelstan does not feel like he belongs anymore, a stranger? He's seen too much, done too much, and there is no place for him with Christianity any longer, in his own mind? And that leaves him lost between worlds, so to speak. I love his storyline, poor guy.

Yep, I think that is true. He cannot find his place neither in England nor among the Vikings anymore.

Getting caught up as we speak, and is Ragnar unaware that LAGERTHA is married?

Actually this is a good question, we never got a confirmation on that, although I cannot think he would not know. I am sure he heard about it and was just being his usual "I am better and more important than anybody else so her husband does not matter if I want her here" when he asked her to stay.

[Talleyrand]

Ragnar need to bump off Horik too, that fucker's been the source of too many of his problems.

[Alia of the knife]

Hmmm, maybe if he has enough to sell. Lagertha is definitely able to do it.

I am sure they had supplies for the small group of people - Rollo, Siggy, Aslaug and the kids and a bunch of others that ran away with them - but I am pretty sure there is not enough for the whole village.

Yep, I think that is true. He cannot find his place neither in England nor among the Vikings anymore.

Actually this is a good question, we never got a confirmation on that, although I cannot think he would not know. I am sure he heard about it and was just being his usual "I am better and more important than anybody else so her husband does not matter if I want her here" when he asked her to stay.

Yeah, it's like he didn't get THAT particular message until the end when she said what she said..

And I think part of the reason she left Bjorn with Ragnar beyond his right to make that choice, is to keep him from a being the thing her husband tries to control her with.

[Nictarion]

And I think part of the reason she left Bjorn with Ragnar beyond his right to make that choice, is to keep him from a being the thing her husband tries to control her with.

Makes sense.

[GSP]

Oh my God Ragnar is stupid in the women department!

It is clearly obvious to any viewer that, while he could possibly have both those women as wives, neither of them would ever be happy with it.

I shudder to think of what that kind of life would entail.

Give me one happy wife over two pissed off ones any day, thank you.

[GSP]

Also,

and I'm not sure about this but just guessing:

If Lagertha had staid with Ragnar, would it not be all but a given that the next war, to kick of immediately, would have to be against her new husband?

He's a Yarl or something too isn't he? I'm suspecting in that culture that kind of disrespect simply could not go unanswered.

[Zorral]

Makes sense.

:agree: that allowing Bjorn to stay with Ragnar takes power from Lagertha's husband -- and allows her more room to manuever, since she neither has to keep Bjorn from striking out for the sake of his mother's honor at a man technically, legally more powerful, and since her husband can neither goad nor mistreat Bjorn either.

It was gratifying to see both Lagertha and Auslag behave with dignity and good sense with each other and with Ragnar in this episode.

It's such a relief to watch a series where people don't spend endless scenes screaming at other and that somehow is supposed to be plot -- I'm thinking particularly of the Originals and Scandal at the moment! I've pretty much stopped watching both series.

[Alia of the knife]

:agree: that allowing Bjorn to stay with Ragnar takes power from Lagertha's husband -- and allows her more room to manuever, since she neither has to keep Bjorn from striking out for the sake of his mother's honor at a man technically, legally more powerful, and since her husband can neither goad nor mistreat Bjorn either.

It was gratifying to see both Lagertha and Auslag behave with dignity and good sense with each other and with Ragnar in this episode.

It's such a relief to watch a series where people don't spend endless scenes screaming at other and that somehow is supposed to be plot -- I'm thinking particularly of the Originals and Scandal at the moment! I've pretty much stopped watching both series.

Yes, I actually thougth the scene between Lagertha and Aslaug was touching. It felt like Lagertha knew she had the power to eventually take Ragnar back completely, and she chose to leave to spare Aslaug that, because Lagertha is ultimately stronger that Aslaug.

(I speculate she will challenge her husband to combat the next time he dishonors her and kills him, taking over his rule- at least in TV world).

[Florina Laufeyson]

Agreed. It would be such a waste to not bring her back. The actress playing her has done such a fantastic job with the part.

Nice to see Aslaug finally humble herself a bit, and thank Lagertha for saving them. But it also kinda felt like she was thanking her for leaving again.

Rollo was being his usual boss self on the battlefield again. I loved the part where he yelled out to Ragnar right before saving his life. Seeing Borg ride away with his tail between his legs was hilarious.

Aslaug was taken aback by the fact it was Lagertha that chose, not her or Ragnar. Lagertha showed so much strength in this episode, its unreal. She is the Skadi to Ragnar's Njord here and remember the myth. Njord is the seafaring god. His realm is wind and ocean. Skadi cannot bear too long the ocean and longs for her mountains. And they end up separating on good terms. Lagertha's choice is Skadi's choice. That parallel.. <3333

Siggy, I don't see why everyone likes her, she's a snake in the grass, and as we see from next weeks sneak peek, she shows her true colors.

Dont care. Siggy forever. :commie:

Bjorn has made mum really proud on the battlefield and by sacrificing to the gods. Good boy.

I just hope the terrible uninteresting husband gives Lagertha a reason to leave him again. I want her to come back to the story.

I could watch all the show about Athelstan's "spiritual meltdown", as Florina upthread has said. For me his future decisions are by far the most interesting part of the series. He still believes in the Christian God enough to ask him to reveal himself to him, but not enough to actually trust in him, and then he also partly believes in the Norse gods, so he refuses to eat Christ's body ... it was excellently shown how the similarities between the religious ceremonies were underlined: the sacrifice of the animals and men / the sacrifice of Christus; the bodies of dead animals and men / the bread and wine.

I am pretty sure not even Athelstan himself knew what it was about, but I can guess it is a mixture of at least two elements:

1. The God eluding him, and whatever was under the bed only showing itself as the "devil", I guess that is a representation of Athelstan's not having enough faith in Christianity.

2. How he touched his cheek makes me also think it has to do with the kiss of the woman whose husband has hurt her. We never saw him having much trouble keeping celibate, but I think that kiss might have made it a bit harder for him. :blushing: Of course the want for a woman - especially since he is a monk - would be seen as a sin by a Christian and the temptation by the devil, in Athelstan's current mental state probably also something more to push him towards the Norse gods, who do not demand of him to be celibate. Nor, as we have seen, do they allow the husband to mutilate his wife so horribly.

What the fact that she appeared to him as Mary has to do with that, if at all, I have no ideas. Probably just a further proof how confused Athelstan is.

Or maybe I am just making stuff up. :leaving:

On a semi-related note, can we agree it is a miracle that Athelstan managed not to cause a fire with his rolling over and dropping the candle on the floor in a room that was full of wood, fabric and maybe straw? I kept waiting for something to catch fire from that candle throughout the whole scene.

Now the question for Ragnar's village is, how will they survive the winter now that they burned the food supplies? Go to England and steal their food?

Thing is, Athelstan shouldnt be a monk if he doesnt want to. Hes still got his band that shows hes a thane, does he not? This is symbolic that Athelstan is indeed, a free man. He's balking at the Christian god because that god seems to want to enslave him again, but in reality, its not the god, its His servants that wish to enslave Athelstan again. Hes just in the middle of realizing it right now.

The Norse gods do not allow for free women to become property. Lagertha's actions reflect that.

I do like your interpretation of what the dark creature under his bed could be. It very well be that Athelstan himself just cannot put his faith into God and its manifesting in his mind like that. He is very very confused.

Ragnar need to bump off Horik too, that fucker's been the source of too many of his problems.

Nah i think that's Bjorn's job. Ironside! Ironside! :commie:

[Zorral]

Yes, I actually thougth the scene between Lagertha and Aslaug was touching. It felt like Lagertha knew she had the power to eventually take Ragnar back completely, and she chose to leave to spare Aslaug that, because Lagertha is ultimately stronger that Aslaug.

It's perhaps that Lagertha recognizes that it is Bjorn who will take back Ragnar for them both, in a sense -- because, older than Aslaug's sons, and becoming combat experienced -- as well, certainly trained to a degree by Lagertha's shield maiden skills? Ragnar's is so pleased that he has his son Bjorn at his side in combat -- though he had to snipe at Bjorn, telling him he has so much to learn. Well, yeah, he does, but for a first killing combat, Bjorn did damned good -- and his uncle is that brilliant combatant, Rollo. Ragnar's at least twice pronounced in this series that fathers become jealous of their sons ring in the background to this. For me, anyway! :)

[Sarah Lannister]

I guess you could call Siggy 'a snake in the grass' but what's she got to lose. She's lost everything, and its obvious she wants to regain what she lost. So she embraces intrigue to restore herself to her former place. Go Siggy!

[Buckwheat]

Yes, I actually thougth the scene between Lagertha and Aslaug was touching. It felt like Lagertha knew she had the power to eventually take Ragnar back completely, and she chose to leave to spare Aslaug that, because Lagertha is ultimately stronger that Aslaug.

I agree about Lagertha's power. I do not think she wants to use that power - not only because she wants to spare Aslaug the shame, but also because she is too proud to come crawling back to the man who has dishonoured her. Lagertha :wub:

Thing is, Athelstan shouldnt be a monk if he doesnt want to. Hes still got his band that shows hes a thane, does he not? This is symbolic that Athelstan is indeed, a free man. He's balking at the Christian god because that god seems to want to enslave him again, but in reality, its not the god, its His servants that wish to enslave Athelstan again. Hes just in the middle of realizing it right now.

The Norse gods do not allow for free women to become property. Lagertha's actions reflect that.

I do like your interpretation of what the dark creature under his bed could be. It very well be that Athelstan himself just cannot put his faith into God and its manifesting in his mind like that. He is very very confused.

Oh, I was not trying to imply he has to be. It is only what the rest of the Christians back in England expect from him - from their point of view, he has returned to the right place after years of slavery, humiliation, punishment and trials by God, whatever. So they think he should be happy to be back, being able to be a Christian, to live in England again - although that is obviously not the case with him. I agree with you that he feels like the other Christians are enslaving or smothering him.

[Alia of the knife]

Good points on Lagertha, and I'm good with Siggy doing what she needs to do.

As far as Athelstan goes, I think he will reconcile his conflicts and find that he is free to make his choices irregardless of what the "christian," (little c), fathers try to tell him.

And I definitely think he is not meant to be a monk, but it doesn't mean he still can't be a man of wisdom and find a path into and learning from both cultures.

It's interesting because I think it was Rollo who spent his whole life in conflict with his beliefs.

[GSP]

Personally, I suspect the series is going to use Athelstan and a significant contributing force to the Christianization of the Vikings. I realize that the time line issues would not make sense, but this series has played very fast and loose with that anyhow, incorporating events that are separated by centuries iirc. I think that is what his little mental meltdown was partially foreshadowing. He sees some similarities between the two faiths with the strong symbolism in blood and sacrifice. I think he'll use that as a way of fusing the two faiths.

[Florina Laufeyson]

I guess you could call Siggy 'a snake in the grass' but what's she got to lose. She's lost everything, and its obvious she wants to regain what she lost. So she embraces intrigue to restore herself to her former place. Go Siggy!

So what is in that sneak peek that Siggy is up to? Someone wanna spoiler it for me?

I agree about Lagertha's power. I do not think she wants to use that power - not only because she wants to spare Aslaug the shame, but also because she is too proud to come crawling back to the man who has dishonoured her. Lagertha :wub:

Oh, I was not trying to imply he has to be. It is only what the rest of the Christians back in England expect from him - from their point of view, he has returned to the right place after years of slavery, humiliation, punishment and trials by God, whatever. So they think he should be happy to be back, being able to be a Christian, to live in England again - although that is obviously not the case with him. I agree with you that he feels like the other Christians are enslaving or smothering him.

Oh i know what you meant. Just pointing out how Athelstan feels. These people who are his own, expect him to act the slave when he fought for his freedom with Ragnar and pals. Its sad that they expect him to go back to being a monk, to the point where they were gonna kill him for it. Athelstan has learned not to fear death (like any good Norseman would) but to die for something like that on a cross like the Christ...yeah thats messed up. Plus on how these Christians treat their women. Athelstan has seen how strong and capable women can be and still remained celibate despite it all. To see one battered like that poor girl, it enraged him. That was the heathen inside him for the gods do not allow such disrespect to a free woman.

I love Athelstan's part right now. So love it.

Personally, I suspect the series is going to use Athelstan and a significant contributing force to the Christianization of the Vikings

Maybe. But the non-Catholic view probably.

[Veltigar]

Yet another awesome episode! I wish there were more series like this. Especially loved Rollo in this. Clive Standen is one heck of an actor.

I thought that new Björn was hilarious. That expression on his face when he executed that one guy XD

[Nictarion]

Yet another awesome episode! I wish there were more series like this. Especially loved Rollo in this. Clive Standen is one heck of an actor.

Indeed! I really want GoT to cast him as Victarion or Euron, but the success of Vikings probably means that's not going to happen.