Your Unpopular ASOIAF Opinions/Hot Takes

[The Bard of Banefort]

Another unpopular opinion of mine is that I think a lot of the “badass” characters from the Dance (Cregan and Lord Dustin, Bloody Ben, Lady Sam) are cringe. I find them all very self-righteous and obnoxious.

Edited December 5, 2023 by The Bard of Banefort

[Ran]

Cregan is very over-rated by the same sort of people who call Stannis the Mannis. The rest, well, mileage varies -- I enjoy them all. I'm not sure what Ben Blackwood does that's so self-righteous, he's thrust in to a pretty fraught situation and handles himself well. Liked the bit about him weeping.

[SeanF]

On 12/3/2023 at 5:12 PM, Raven Princling said:

Idk how unpopular these are, but I will avoid saying opinions I have already stated in other threads: 

1: Cersei should have had a flock of ladies around her in court same way Margaery does.  Same goes for Winterfell. Ned should have had more guests or even wards from noble Northern houses than just Theon who is a captive. Same could be said for Catelyn I guess. Starks ruled north for centuries and were Wardens of the North after conquest. They are basically the heart of the North and should have had a court of their own (a lesser one than King's Landing of course, but still).

2: Oldtown and Hightowers should have been introduced earlier.

3: Feast is actually a really good book and is my favorite in the series. I do not understand why so many people think the quality dropped with it and Dance. 

4: The hatred for Catelyn is ridiculous. People who criticize her behavior because of Jon do not realize that many women in her position would react the same way or worse in modern times, let alone in medieval times. She ignored him, gave him cold looks and said something bad in the middle of grief where she was not thinking rationally. She never abused him or anything.  I am not saying she was right or that Jon deserved it, I am simply saying that her behavior was natural (human-like) given the circumstances. She did make mistakes, but people acting like she started the war (and some claim she even planned it lmao) and is the sole reason for North's downfall are way off imo. 

5: This has been said many times before, but I wish Tyrion would have tried to get Littlefinger and failed after becoming Hand. Heck, it would have made way more sense if Tyrion tried to chop his head off, failed somehow and Littlefinger fled to Vale to get with Lysa.

6: Roose is a complete idiot for keeping Ramsay alive and letting him run around killing and torturing people. He should have killed him years ago and, if needed, made new bastards or something. Ramsay will doom his entire House (not that I feel bad).

7: Robert was a terrible King and the only character that genuinely annoyed me in the first book. 

8: Tyrion, Cersei and others in King's Landing should have mentioned Jon Arryn and Lysa way more. Jon was Robert's hand for years, but the characters barely mention how they were at court. They should have remembered and thought of them more.

9: If Young Griff makes a good king, I do not care if he is Blackfyre. They are basically Targaryens without marriage certificate anyway.

10: Tywin is not that good of a politician. He was too quick to resort to violence which caused his enemies to pounce on his children the moment he died. He is also a shit father not only to Tyrion, but Jaime and Cersei as well. 

11: Jon is not named as heir in Robb's will. The chapter purposefully makes you think it is Jon and uses him as a red herring.

I’m not much interested in the Ironborn, and Meereen dragged, up until Daznak’s Pit, but mostly I enjoyed Feast and Dance.

[Dofs]

34 minutes ago, Ran said:

Cregan is very over-rated by the same sort of people who call Stannis the Mannis. The rest, well, mileage varies -- I enjoy them all. I'm not sure what Ben Blackwood does that's so self-righteous, he's thrust in to a pretty fraught situation and handles himself well. Liked the bit about him weeping.

Cregan is worse than Mannis, imo.

[Ran]

I should add that his over-rated doesn't mean he's a bad character. I think he's actually a good one, he's distinctly flawed, and his uncompromising pose is undermined by having his head turned by Alysanne which shows that to some degree there was some political posturing going on that was ultimately self-serving.

 

[Craving Peaches]

1 hour ago, Ran said:

Cregan is very over-rated by the same sort of people who call Stannis the Mannis. The rest, well, mileage varies -- I enjoy them all. I'm not sure what Ben Blackwood does that's so self-righteous, he's thrust in to a pretty fraught situation and handles himself well. Liked the bit about him weeping.

Yep. These people are all like 'I love his rigid and inflexible attitude' but of course if someone had that attitude in real life and they were going to suffer because of it... I don't understand why being arbitrary is glorified.

Edited December 5, 2023 by Craving Peaches

[frenin]

It makes absolutely zero sense how Daeron the Daring is considered a good guy. It's truly baffling.  He does three things in the war, burn soldiers, massacre civilians and refugees and die to a tent.

[SaffronLady]

3 minutes ago, frenin said:

It makes absolutely zero sense how Daeron the Daring is considered a good guy. It's truly baffling.  He does three things in the war, burn soldiers, massacre civilians and refugees and die to a tent.

Imagine you are a Green fighting on the Honeywine.

[The Bard of Banefort]

I once saw someone say that Cregan would probably consider Ned a "falcon in wolf's clothing," and I think that's probably very accurate. This asshole misses the entire war, doesn't suffer through any of the carnage, then thinks he has the right to storm in and start barking orders. It's amazing how everyone just went along with it.

28 minutes ago, frenin said:

It makes absolutely zero sense how Daeron the Daring is considered a good guy. It's truly baffling.  He does three things in the war, burn soldiers, massacre civilians and refugees and die to a tent.

Yeah, that struck me on my last re-read too. Maelor's killers had already been executed by Lady Vance, they surrendered to the Greens, and Daeron torches a village full of civilians just because. I guess it shows just how odious the Greens are in the books that he's considered the "good" son.

[Craving Peaches]

4 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

This asshole misses the entire war, doesn't suffer through any of the carnage, then thinks he has the right to storm in and start barking orders.

Exactly. 

37 minutes ago, frenin said:

He does three things in the war, burn soldiers, massacre civilians and refugees and die to a tent.

He also torches them when they are in a Sept, a place of holy refuge. His actions are bad even by in-world standards.

[BlackLightning]

On 9/7/2023 at 7:28 PM, sifth said:

Tyrion's first wife, doesn't make sense, timeline wise. Tyrion was 16 when he got married, yet Jamie is 6 years older than him, so he would be about 23, which meant the whole thing happened when Jamie was in the Kingsguard. So why is Jamie back home at Casterly Rock, if he's suppose to be in Kings Landing, protecting Robert? Are Kingsguard allowed to take vacations and visit their homes?

There was a point in time where Aerys moved the royal court to Casterly Rock. I think it was for six months or a year. Not too long but long enough...

[SeanF]

1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said:

Exactly. 

He also torches them when they are in a Sept, a place of holy refuge. His actions are bad even by in-world standards.

Yes, in a world where everyone believes in the gods, and believes they exact retribution, that would be considered a dreadful act of blasphemy.

[sifth]

47 minutes ago, BlackLightning said:

There was a point in time where Aerys moved the royal court to Casterly Rock. I think it was for six months or a year. Not too long but long enough...

Timeline still doesn't match up. Tyrion was 9 during Robert's Rebellion. So he would have to have been married during Robert's time as king.

[Ser Arthurs Dawn]

On 11/29/2023 at 9:25 AM, The Bard of Banefort said:

Jorah is over-hated.

*nervous cough*

I fully admit that my incessant hatred of him is just flat-out uncalled for, and he's certainly not the worst apple in the bunch (by far).. But I personally consider Daenerys a saint for having put up with his obsession for as long as she did. He is the only non-villainous character that I hate. There are plenty of characters that I don't like, but that I at least find entertaining. Not him.

[BlackLightning]

14 hours ago, sifth said:

Timeline still doesn't match up. Tyrion was 9 during Robert's Rebellion. So he would have to have been married during Robert's time as king.

It works

If Tyrion was married during Robert's time as king, then Jaime probably would've been able to come and go as he so pleased. Maybe there was business to attend to in the West and Robert gave Jaime leave to live at Casterly Rock for a time.

[sifth]

2 hours ago, BlackLightning said:

It works

If Tyrion was married during Robert's time as king, then Jaime probably would've been able to come and go as he so pleased. Maybe there was business to attend to in the West and Robert gave Jaime leave to live at Casterly Rock for a time.

It’s possible, I suppose.

[Lord of Raventree Hall]

2 hours ago, Ser Arthurs Dawn said:

*nervous cough*

I fully admit that my incessant hatred of him is just flat-out uncalled for, and he's certainly not the worst apple in the bunch (by far).. But I personally consider Daenerys a saint for having put up with his obsession for as long as she did. He is the only non-villainous character that I hate. There are plenty of characters that I don't like, but that I at least find entertaining. Not him.

I just want to make sure, the reason Jorah is hated is essentially cause he is over-aggressive with Daenerys? Cause I agree with that. 

However, if he could get over being in love with her...I actually think he was a decent advisor to her. Even a decent friend at times. Not that he shows signs of being able to do that...just if he could, lol. Like, I think he is one of her few advisors who actually like disagrees with her (something I think is needed, but with him having a bit more respect...something else he should work on), and thinks kind of outside the box (like more creative than her other advisors..other than Skahaz I guess, lol). 

Don't get me wrong though, if I had been Daenerys, I would have banished him too. She even says it (in her own head)...if he'd just been more humble, she would have forgiven him. But instead he acts like an entitled douche. It was honestly kind of always his personality though, so it's consistent to who he is. I guess maybe an entitled douche can be a decent advisor though as long as they stay loyal to you, lolol and give up any idea of love with you. I'd say to him if I was there, "Move on bro!" lol

[Ser Arthurs Dawn]

4 minutes ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

I just want to make sure, the reason Jorah is hated is essentially cause he is over-aggressive with Daenerys? Cause I agree with that. 

However, if he could get over being in love with her...I actually think he was a decent advisor to her. Even a decent friend at times. Not that he shows signs of being able to do that...just if he could, lol. Like, I think he is one of her few advisors who actually like disagrees with her (something I think is needed, but with him having a bit more respect...something else he should work on), and thinks kind of outside the box (like more creative than her other advisors..other than Skahaz I guess, lol). 

Don't get me wrong though, if I had been Daenerys, I would have banished him too. She even says it (in her own head)...if he'd just been more humble, she would have forgiven him. But instead he acts like an entitled douche. It was honestly kind of always his personality though, so it's consistent to who he is. I guess maybe an entitled douche can be a decent advisor though as long as they stay loyal to you, lolol and give up any idea of love with you. I'd say to him if I was there, "Move on bro!" lol

Yes, that's why. I'm with you on all of it! I think he gives her solid advice too, but his behavior towards her is something I wouldn't have been able to look past. Which is why I say, kudos to her  He makes my skin crawl. He gives me the ultimate ick. And then later when he has a silver-haired prostitute on his lap  The eBay Daenerys.

[SeanF]

1 hour ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

I just want to make sure, the reason Jorah is hated is essentially cause he is over-aggressive with Daenerys? Cause I agree with that. 

However, if he could get over being in love with her...I actually think he was a decent advisor to her. Even a decent friend at times. Not that he shows signs of being able to do that...just if he could, lol. Like, I think he is one of her few advisors who actually like disagrees with her (something I think is needed, but with him having a bit more respect...something else he should work on), and thinks kind of outside the box (like more creative than her other advisors..other than Skahaz I guess, lol). 

Don't get me wrong though, if I had been Daenerys, I would have banished him too. She even says it (in her own head)...if he'd just been more humble, she would have forgiven him. But instead he acts like an entitled douche. It was honestly kind of always his personality though, so it's consistent to who he is. I guess maybe an entitled douche can be a decent advisor though as long as they stay loyal to you, lolol and give up any idea of love with you. I'd say to him if I was there, "Move on bro!" lol

His advice, though is always to be more callous and cruel.

[frenin]

2 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

Like, I think he is one of her few advisors who actually like disagrees with her (something I think is needed, but with him having a bit more respect...something else he should work on), and thinks kind of outside the box (like more creative than her other advisors..other than Skahaz I guess, lol

I do not remember a single Dany advisor who uncritically agrees with her,

Barristan disagrees a lot, so does Daario, Shavepate etc.