U.S. Politics: Covfefe Boys

[Zorral]

48 minutes ago, lokisnow said:

Well obviously failing upwards is the exclusive Provence of the executive caste and their golfing buddies. Anyone who has ever once been hired as a wage slave of course wouldn’t be eligible. 

All wage slaves should find this enlightening, particularly those who aren't paid a living wage by the sorts of Walmart, amazon, etc. This is not new.  Though the article doesn't include this, there was a booming business in manuals advising plantation slave holders in the glorious days of the Cotton Kingdom on how to best manage one's slave work force.  These manuals were definitely studied by industrial factory management capitalists as well -- just like the tactics of Jim Crow and the principles of eugenics and slavery were carefully studied by Hitler and his cronies in the 1930's.

http://bostonreview.net/race/caitlin-c-rosenthal-how-slavery-inspired-modern-business-management

Quote

How Slavery Inspired Modern Business Management
By “dangling the carrot” to improve worker productivity, businesses are taking a page from slavery’s playbook.
bostonreview.net

 

[A Horse Named Stranger]

57 minutes ago, Martell Spy said:

Looks like a Gambino-style roll-up.

And Cohen is cast as "The Bull" Gravano who spilled the goods on Gotti before going into witsec to have his name pop up in the new decades later in connection with some meth operation in Arizona? (please, don't tell me I mixed up the NY families).

[Week]

56 minutes ago, SweetPea said:

Hmmm, only 16 percent of democrats think it's possible for Obama to have been a good president? Interesting.

Trollolololol. 

[James Arryn]

1 hour ago, SweetPea said:

Hmmm, only 16 percent of democrats think it's possible for Obama to have been a good president? Interesting.

It’s good that you’re trying. 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

Sen. McCain has decided to end his medical treatment, signalling that he probably isn't long for this world. I know a lot of people here hate his guts, but I've always admired him despite his many flaws. 

[Serious Callers Only]

Reminder that treason is not just about a idiot making a fool of himself on TV:

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/24/us/politics/cia-russia-midterm-elections.html

 

Quote

Kremlin Sources Go Quiet, Leaving C.I.A. in the Dark About Putin’s Plans for Midterms

People are dead because of covfefe boy Rand Paul. There is no fucking way the election isn't rigged.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

26 minutes ago, SpaceForce Tywin et al. said:

Sen. McCain has decided to end his medical treatment, signalling that he probably isn't long for this world. I know a lot of people here hate his guts, but I've always admired him despite his many flaws. 

Not a particular fan of John McCain.  I think his rep as a"Maverick" is overstated.  Giving Palin a national profile by choosing her for a running mate in 2008 was extremely damaging to the discourse in this country.

However, he's also demonstrated the ability to be sensible in the past and he's one of the few republicans that doesn't bow and scrape to either Rush Limbaugh, Fox News or the evangelicals.  If he had won the nomination 2000, the world would be a better place.

He's also one of the few Republicans with the spine to continue his "Trump can fuck himself" stance, which raises him in my estimation.

[A True Kaniggit]

16 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

He's also one of the few Republicans with the spine to continue his "Trump can fuck himself" stance, which raises him in my estimation.

Eh. The reason so many people don't take this into consideration is because he is dying. If he wasn't dying, and had more terms to think of, would he take this stance?

How many current Republicans think "Trump can fuck himself" but don't state so because they want to hold their positions.

[Morpheus]

20 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Not a particular fan of John McCain.  I think his rep as a"Maverick" is overstated.  Giving Palin a national profile by choosing her for a running mate in 2008 was extremely damaging to the discourse in this country.

However, he's also demonstrated the ability to be sensible in the past and he's one of the few republicans that doesn't bow and scrape to either Rush Limbaugh, Fox News or the evangelicals.  If he had won the nomination 2000, the world would be a better place.

He's also one of the few Republicans with the spine to continue his "Trump can fuck himself" stance, which raises him in my estimation.

He bowed to the evangelicals in 2007- 2008 when he realized that was the only way to win the Republican nomination, he learned his lesson. Had he won in 2000 much would probably have been the same, the same interests would likely have pushed him to initiate a war in Iraq which he supported even through his 2008 campaign. And he gives nice soundbites against Trump but had he not fallen ill, he most likely would be tossing the media witty quips while refusing to take any action along with his bestie, Graham.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

22 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Not a particular fan of John McCain.  I think his rep as a"Maverick" is overstated.  Giving Palin a national profile by choosing her for a running mate in 2008 was extremely damaging to the discourse in this country.

However, he's also demonstrated the ability to be sensible in the past and he's one of the few republicans that doesn't bow and scrape to either Rush Limbaugh, Fox News or the evangelicals.  If he had won the nomination 2000, the world would be a better place.

He's also one of the few Republicans with the spine to continue his "Trump can fuck himself" stance, which raises him in my estimation.

Yeah this is more or less my thoughts too. He's made many mistakes, but he's also done some legitimately good things. 

Also, @DanteGabriel regularly links a great article debunking his maverick status. I'm sure he'd be happy to link it for your consumption. 

7 minutes ago, A True Kaniggit said:

Eh. The reason so many people don't take this into consideration is because he is dying. If he wasn't dying, and had more terms to think of, would he take this stance?

How many current Republicans think "Trump can fuck himself" but don't state so because they want to hold their positions.

Who knows, but he'd be more likely than most of his colleagues to do so. 

[Kalbear]

I think McCain as a politician has been fairly harmful to the country and I think that he's been brave only in comparison to other Republicans, which is to say that he's almost never stood up against something wrong instead of actually never standing up against something wrong. I am glad that he's going to be out of politics. 

I think that any human going through cancer treatments deserves sympathy regardless; it is brutal for the person and for the family who has to watch them deteriorate into something only resembling the person they love. It's a horrible decision to have to make to end treatment, and it's the right one, and I feel bad for him and his family. 

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

47 minutes ago, A True Kaniggit said:

Eh. The reason so many people don't take this into consideration is because he is dying. If he wasn't dying, and had more terms to think of, would he take this stance?

How many current Republicans think "Trump can fuck himself" but don't state so because they want to hold their positions.

To answer the first: yes, I think he would, though I can't prove that.  Trump got cheap laughs by mocking him for him for being a POW.  That alone is enough.  The real question is, why aren't more former military people speaking up about it?  Hopefully they'll get around to it when they are eulogizing McCain.  

Second: It's an absolute certainty that there are plenty of Republicans who understand that Trump a disgusting human being who is unfit for any public office, let alone the Presidency. And these same Republicans are afraid to speak out for fear that their base will punish them for it.  Obviously.

45 minutes ago, Morpheus said:

He bowed to the evangelicals in 2007- 2008 when he realized that was the only way to win the Republican nomination, he learned his lesson. Had he won in 2000 much would probably have been the same, the same interests would likely have pushed him to initiate a war in Iraq which he supported even through his 2008 campaign. And he gives nice soundbites against Trump but had he not fallen ill, he most likely would be tossing the media witty quips while refusing to take any action along with his bestie, Graham.

2007-08: Yeah, he had to court them for their support and I'm sure deals were done.  as would any Republican candidate.  As a rule though, he hasn't made a career out of praising Jesus or yodeling about people saying "happy holidays" or prayer in schools or any of that nonsense.

As for the rest, I don't think it would have been the same.  For one thing, he wouldn't have a cabinet composed entirely of Project for a New American Century alumni and Neo Con idiots.  He wouldn't have Dick Cheney as co-president.  He wouldn't have (and didn't) take the view of the administration on "enhanced interrogation techniques".  He may have also taken the more seriously the August 2001 daily brief, "Bin Ladin Determined To Strike in US".  And yes, it is entirely plausible he would not have manipulated intelligence to paint Iraq as an imminent threat that may or may not have had something do with 9/11.

Also, by Republican standards, McCain has been pretty good on Climate change.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

24 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

I think McCain as a politician has been fairly harmful to the country and I think that he's been brave only in comparison to other Republicans, which is to say that he's almost never stood up against something wrong instead of actually never standing up against something wrong. I am glad that he's going to be out of politics. 

I think that any human going through cancer treatments deserves sympathy regardless; it is brutal for the person and for the family who has to watch them deteriorate into something only resembling the person they love. It's a horrible decision to have to make to end treatment, and it's the right one, and I feel bad for him and his family. 

"In comparison to other Republicans" is exactly what I'm talking about.  We would have been better off if the choice in 2000 had been "McCain vs Gore." instead of what we got.  Either a McCain or Gore presidency means the Neo Cons don't take control of the executive branch for eight years.

[Kalbear]

Eh, maybe. I don't know how much McCain would have resisted the neocon wing, especially after 911. I don't remember him sticking up against them all that much, even with the torture. 

And this was a guy who picked Palin as his running mate. 

[DMC]

22 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

I think McCain as a politician has been fairly harmful to the country and I think that he's been brave only in comparison to other Republicans, which is to say that he's almost never stood up against something wrong instead of actually never standing up against something wrong. I am glad that he's going to be out of politics. 

I think that any human going through cancer treatments deserves sympathy regardless; it is brutal for the person and for the family who has to watch them deteriorate into something only resembling the person they love. It's a horrible decision to have to make to end treatment, and it's the right one, and I feel bad for him and his family. 

This.  McCain the politician deserves every bit of animus, ridicule, whatever, he has coming.  His "maverick" profile was by and large a facade behind which he perpetuated a vast number of iniquitous policies since (slightly) before I was born.  Campaign finance and willing to deal on immigration may get you up (or down?) a level in the circles of hell - but his obscene hawkishness probably negates that anyway.

John McCain the man I respect, although don't admire.  And anyone that feels the need to dance on his grave only reveals their own classlessness.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

8 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

Eh, maybe. I don't know how much McCain would have resisted the neocon wing, especially after 911. I don't remember him sticking up against them all that much, even with the torture. 

And this was a guy who picked Palin as his running mate. 

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2008/aug/18/john-mccain/mccain-consistently-opposed-to-torture/

[DMC]

1 minute ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2008/aug/18/john-mccain/mccain-consistently-opposed-to-torture/

Well, obviously McCain was virulently opposed to torture.  Didn't think that needed to be said.  One of the best examples of the impact signing statements can have is the law McCain made Dubya pass banning torture.  Dubya knew the bill was veto-proof, so he let it pass, then in the signing statement still directed intelligence agencies to do what they'd been doing, which effectively negated the whole bill and, once again, the Bushs fucked McCain over.

[Kalbear]

Oh, I know he was specifically against torture; what he wasn't was against the war in Iraq or Afghanistan. He didn't stand up to the neocon wing in any reasonable way in that way. I don't think McCain as POTUS in 2000 changes a whole lot. 

[DMC]

Just now, Kalbear said:

He didn't stand up to the neocon wing in any reasonable way in that way. I don't think McCain as POTUS in 2000 changes a whole lot. 

His foreign policy is worse than the neocons.  If he was in office during and after 9/11 lord knows how many other countries we'd be at war with.

[Zorral]

By now you all have seen this, right?