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Theralion

Why S8 feels wierd.

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I suspect in the book, Daenerys taking King's Landing will come first and The Long Night will be the final battle.

But by switching them in the show, the writers realized that Cersei and Jack Sparrow would be poor final bosses.

So they decided to turn Daenerys into the Mad Queen to make up for it.

It's like how The Night King got a dragon due to the fact they cut the 3rd rider and the horn of winter from the show.

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On 6/2/2019 at 3:09 AM, Theralion said:

I also believe that at some point the writers stopped adapting the books and started doing their own fan fiction.

Oh for sure!

"We've turned Dany into a full-on crazy horse Mad Queen, hmmm that's two Mad Queens, doesn't look good, ok, let's give Arya the NK kill"

Arya + Gendry

Bron!

St Tyrion the whitewashed

Sandra Snark the Smartest

Missyworm

Samwell, no longer of the NW, Lord Tarly when convenient, otherwise now Grandmaester Samruman the White

Davos

Lyanna Mormont the 8 yr old battle field commander

Jorah "should never have got greyscale in the first place, damn that was some book character we cut out, but why tf did you keep the greyscale in? What do you mean I kept it in, it was your idea" Mormont gets it all scraped off by Samruman.

errr .... that Wight Hunt?

errr ..... the Dragonpit scene? "Once in a while can't you lie a little? Just a bit?"

Teleporting

Re-spawning

Sand Snakes take over Dorne

Bells now mean surrender

 

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And it is important that the individual books refer to the civil wars, but the series title reminds us constantly that the real issue lies in the North beyond the Wall.

 - GRRM
 
Uh, yeah.

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Not to mention ...

And some of us have already seen this; but it bears repeating:

(Even if we grant it WAS foreshadowed -- which I'm not so sure of.)

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I personally do believe that Daenerys will burn King's Landing in the books, only Aegon will likely be the one on the throne, rather than Cersei. D&D loved portraying Dany as a hero; I doubt they would have had her turn villain at the end unless they had to. We see throughout the series that Daenerys has a strong desire to be loved, and her identity is rooted in her belief that she is the rightful heir to the Iron Throne. When she arrives in Westeros and realizes that another Targaryen has taken her place, making her the villain in his story, it will break her.

 

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Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I personally do believe that Daenerys will burn King's Landing in the books, only Aegon will likely be the one on the throne, rather than Cersei. D&D loved portraying Dany as a hero; I doubt they would have had her turn villain at the end unless they had to. We see throughout the series that Daenerys has a strong desire to be loved, and her identity is rooted in her belief that she is the rightful heir to the Iron Throne. When she arrives in Westeros and realizes that another Targaryen has taken her place, making her the villain in his story, it will break her.

 

I doubt, 

If fAegon ends up on the Iron Throne, then R+L=J will not be effective on the series, or that marriage annulment between Rhaegar and Ellia will not play a role in the books and Jon will be a Targaryen bastard still. Or fAegon is actually not fake and annulment will be revealed by multiple people and that will suddenly make fAegon a bastard and Jon as a true heir. There are many paths Grrm can choose.

 

Edited by RYShh

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I think D&D are just bad writers and wanted to pull the rug out from under our feet. It isn't the first time they did it. They thought a Oh Wow moment is what you do when you purposely mislead audience members.

I agree, Dany burns KL. Though, as another poster stated, it will be fAegon on the throne and not Cersie.

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I can understand why Dany fans are upset by this turn of events, but if there's one thing George is good at, it's having his story make sense. Daenerys' dark turn will be undoubtedly tragic in the books, but I have faith that George will present it in a way that makes sense for her character.

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Posted (edited)

S8 feels weird because it is absolutely awful and all of the other seasons are, at worst, passable.

1 hour ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I can understand why Dany fans are upset by this turn of events, but if there's one thing George is good at, it's having his story make sense. Daenerys' dark turn will be undoubtedly tragic in the books, but I have faith that George will present it in a way that makes sense for her character.

It's not even Dany fans that are upset. Everyone with a brain is upset. It was terribly written and directed. Lol like it's crazy...

Daenerys Targaryen is a female Alexander the Great with weapons of mass destruction.

I've always felt that Dany would go on to set the world fire -- figuratively and literally. I actually have a prediction that she'll completely destroy Norvos (the home of Arianne Martell's mother, Lady Mellario) and kill everyone there on accident when Norvos via Lady Mellario defies Daenerys' slavery-abolishing wheel-breaking.

But yeah, I totally think that she will destroy King's Landing after neutralizing the Others. But Euron will be the one on the Iron Throne, not fAegon or Cersei.

After killing Euron and burning King's Landing, then I think Daenerys will have Drogon destroy the Iron Throne. And that will mark the beginning of Daenery's dark turn. She'll announce her Napoleonic goals to conquer the world Alexandrian style and begin experimenting with blood magic and other dark arts at the behest of the red priests and/or people from Asshai.

Edited by Jabar of House Titan

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The reason why I think fAegon will be on the throne is because the show chose to include the Golden Company in the battle, which I took to be a nod to fAegon. Dany being triggered by the bells also reminded me of JonCon's flashback to the Battle of the Bells.

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I am confident that Martin can write a tragic story about Dany and Jon and I will like it in most ways, and it will feel more inevitable. There is also Jaimes experiences. Heroes don’t necessarily become celebrated in their own time, or ever.

i wonder if he is so attached to these children of his that he is reluctant to write the story as it needs to be. I recall that he left the red wedding to be the last chapter he wrote because he’s a sensitive guy, and it bothered him. I imagine it’s hard to kill off Dany emotionally. Let’s of foreshadowing with the Nissa Nissa stories. Three door could be rage or death. The lemon tree has bitter fruit, though the lemon flowers are sweet, but the fruit of the poor lemon is impossible to eat.

Yes, I think fAegon will be on the throne, possibly with Arianne, and that he will be popular, so what will Dany do with that! Good point about the battle of the bells.

i also think the bells triggered her Dothraki instincts as they are worn in their hair for each victory.

What is good? Lots of great visuals, but sometimes the let it speak for itself too much. Some of the acting was wonderful. Now we know roughly what happens. Not all of it is nuts. Dragon still seems like the stallion who could mount the world.

Maybe Euron kills fAegon. 

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

They obviously had no idea where the story was going like they claimed they did. If by some chance they did and this was their plan all along I hope they never again get a chance to fail so hard at something that should have been great.

Edited by The Last Storm

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It will be the Long Night in the books then the throne, otherwise it wouldn't make sense to name the books "The Winds of Winter" And THEN "A Dream of Spring." Also at some point there were no books to adapt. GRRM is 5yrs overdue on the 6th book and probably 20 years behind on the 7th.

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On 6/10/2019 at 11:05 AM, The Bard of Banefort said:

I personally do believe that Daenerys will burn King's Landing in the books, only Aegon will likely be the one on the throne, rather than Cersei. D&D loved portraying Dany as a hero; I doubt they would have had her turn villain at the end unless they had to. We see throughout the series that Daenerys has a strong desire to be loved, and her identity is rooted in her belief that she is the rightful heir to the Iron Throne. When she arrives in Westeros and realizes that another Targaryen has taken her place, making her the villain in his story, it will break her.

It's not just another one. It's one whose claim outranks hers. It's one whom the people love and rally around. 

This shows Dany that her whole life had no purpose. It was all built on self-delusion. She didn't matter.

That's enough to break anyone. 

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On 6/10/2019 at 8:53 PM, btfu806 said:

I think D&D are just bad writers and wanted to pull the rug out from under our feet. It isn't the first time they did it. They thought a Oh Wow moment is what you do when you purposely mislead audience members.

I agree, Dany burns KL. Though, as another poster stated, it will be fAegon on the throne and not Cersie.

Given they only started to desire the adaptation rights when they read the Red Wedding, a shocking moment that actually had build up and gravitas, I think their thought process went like this:

D1: SHOCK MOMENTS GOOD.

D2: YES, ME AGREE, SHOCK MOMENTS GOOD. ME BUY RIGHTS TO SHOCK MOMENT BOOKS.

D1: WE MAKE GOOD SHOW. BOOK MAN HELP US.

GRRM: Actually, my name is George--

D2: THEMES FOR EIGHTH GRADE BOOK REPORT. BOOK MAN HELP WITH SHOCK MOMENT. KEEP SHOCK MOMENT HAPPEN.

(four seasons later)

GRRM: See you guys, I'm going to focus on (snickers) finishing the Winds of Winter, yup, totally not gonna divert myself with side projects. Gonna focus on the Winds of Winter. Gotta love you and leave you, friends.

D1: BUT HOW SHOCK MOMENT?

GRRM: Here's a list of eventual outcomes. Make them happen, and be sure to plan them ahead of time, really seed it. We don't want to build up the butler did it when it's actually the chambermaid, after all.

D2: THANK YOU FOR GIVING LIST OF SHOCK MOMENT. WE MAKE SHOCKING.

GRRM: That's not what I said, but... good luck, friends.

(GRRM leaves)

D1: SO WHAT DO?

D2: MAKE SHOCK MOMENT. KNOW PLOT POINT, FOOL AUDIENCE INTO THINKING OTHER WAY.

D1: SHOCK MOMENT GOOD WHEN NOTHING MAKE SENSE.

D2: SMART THINKING BOY WE ARE.

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On 6/2/2019 at 4:06 AM, Theralion said:

due to the fact they cut the 3rd rider and the horn of winter from the show.

Yeah, that's a pity. The horn was at least shown to have been found by Samwell, not to be mentioned ever again. So I assume back then they were not sure and not yet decided how to end it. The horn was in and was dropped later.

The stupid ice-dragon hopefully will not be part of the books. 

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

Yeah, that's a pity. The horn was at least shown to have been found by Samwell, not to be mentioned ever again. So I assume back then they were not sure and not yet decided how to end it. The horn was in and was dropped later.

The stupid ice-dragon hopefully will not be part of the books. 

They mentioned about ice dragon in the books iirc, I think that was the reason.

Edited by RYShh

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8 hours ago, Beardy the Wildling said:

Given they only started to desire the adaptation rights when they read the Red Wedding, a shocking moment that actually had build up and gravitas, I think their thought process went like this:

D1: SHOCK MOMENTS GOOD.

D2: YES, ME AGREE, SHOCK MOMENTS GOOD. ME BUY RIGHTS TO SHOCK MOMENT BOOKS.

D1: WE MAKE GOOD SHOW. BOOK MAN HELP US.

GRRM: Actually, my name is George--

D2: THEMES FOR EIGHTH GRADE BOOK REPORT. BOOK MAN HELP WITH SHOCK MOMENT. KEEP SHOCK MOMENT HAPPEN.

(four seasons later)

GRRM: See you guys, I'm going to focus on (snickers) finishing the Winds of Winter, yup, totally not gonna divert myself with side projects. Gonna focus on the Winds of Winter. Gotta love you and leave you, friends.

D1: BUT HOW SHOCK MOMENT?

GRRM: Here's a list of eventual outcomes. Make them happen, and be sure to plan them ahead of time, really seed it. We don't want to build up the butler did it when it's actually the chambermaid, after all.

D2: THANK YOU FOR GIVING LIST OF SHOCK MOMENT. WE MAKE SHOCKING.

GRRM: That's not what I said, but... good luck, friends.

(GRRM leaves)

D1: SO WHAT DO?

D2: MAKE SHOCK MOMENT. KNOW PLOT POINT, FOOL AUDIENCE INTO THINKING OTHER WAY.

D1: SHOCK MOMENT GOOD WHEN NOTHING MAKE SENSE.

D2: SMART THINKING BOY WE ARE.

I just thought of that bit of Airplane? When he's on the radio, or was it a phone?, yelling the other guy's name: "Stryker!", and then louder "STRYKER!". And the man standing next to him lays one hell of a slap on the woman he's standing beside. 

I'm going to be charitable and say it was a 'Lost in Translation'.

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On 6/1/2019 at 10:09 PM, Theralion said:

I also believe that at some point the writers stopped adapting the books and started doing their own fan fiction.

Fan fiction means the writer doesn't own the rights to the source material; subsequently making it illegal to profit from the work. Adaption means that the rights to the source material have been acquired and thus anything in the source material can be used in a work in any way desired. Fan fiction isn't a question of, who likes the story it's a question of, who owns the rights. 

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