S John Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 3 hours ago, Tywin et al. said: This seems stranger than @Karlbear vaccinating his ducks: https://www.cnn.com/2021/03/29/politics/mitch-mcconnell-covid-19-vaccine-republican-men/index.html You know McConnell would only come out and make a statement like that if he was worried that Republican men dying of Covid more often than non-Republican men will erode an electoral advantage somewhere. but yea over in conservative land the vaccine has been received very differently than what you might read over here. That 50% number almost seems high to me based on the threads about vaccinations I’ve seen in recent days. Vaccine skepticism is rampant and appears to be the prevailing opinion on a right leaning board I visit sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoannaL Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 8 hours ago, Padraig said: Oh no. https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/canada-suspends-astrazeneca-vaccine-covid-19-1.5968657 I was trying to understand what Canada was thinking based on the above article. What has changed since the EU suspension? The attached talks about info from Germany but I don't know how much of that is new cases (since the EU relaxed things again). It was previously mentioned here that the German health people had thought they had worked out a treatment. The above article mentions a 40% fatality (on very few cases) but again, is that the very latest trends? That would otherwise suggest any treatment is faltering. As far as I could find, its 18 cases now in Germany and 4 deaths. It was 7 cases and 3 deaths at the beginning, when this side effect was discovered, so the treatment seems to help. But there are voices here as well calling to halt AZ for women under 55. France is doing that and it may be the right way to go. I think they didnt do it to not bring more insecurity into AZ vaccination, but thats no good reason to let these women suffer since there are also other vaccines. An intelligent distribution: AZ for older people and Biontech for younger would not cost vaccination capacity at all and would solve this side effect issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luzifer's right hand Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 2 hours ago, S John said: You know McConnell would only come out and make a statement like that if he was worried that Republican men dying of Covid more often than non-Republican men will erode an electoral advantage somewhere. but yea over in conservative land the vaccine has been received very differently than what you might read over here. That 50% number almost seems high to me based on the threads about vaccinations I’ve seen in recent days. Vaccine skepticism is rampant and appears to be the prevailing opinion on a right leaning board I visit sometimes. Only dead Democrats can vot I guess... Electoral fraud! Jokes aside I read that checking nearby red politicial areas for an appointment is a worthwhile approach if you want to get your shot asap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Which Tyler Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/mar/30/university-scientists-deconstruct-covid-19-vaccines-and-publish-recipe-on-open-web University scientists deconstruct Covid-19 vaccines and publish 'recipe' on open web Stanford University scientists determine sequences of Pfizer and Moderna vaccines from vials set to be discarded Scientists have determined the “recipes” for two Covid-19 vaccines using leftovers in vials bound for the trash and published the mRNA sequences on Github, the online repository for software code. The group of scientists from Stanford University were able to determine the sequences of both the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines, and included the mRNA sequences in a post they published on Github last week, tech news site Motherboard first reported. Experts say the publication will help researchers around the world better identify when testing samples whether they are looking at sequences from the Covid-19 virus or vaccines to treat the virus, because they can give false positives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padraig Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 2 hours ago, JoannaL said: As far as I could find, its 18 cases now in Germany and 4 deaths. It was 7 cases and 3 deaths at the beginning, when this side effect was discovered, so the treatment seems to help. But there are voices here as well calling to halt AZ for women under 55. France is doing that and it may be the right way to go. I think they didnt do it to not bring more insecurity into AZ vaccination, but thats no good reason to let these women suffer since there are also other vaccines. An intelligent distribution: AZ for older people and Biontech for younger would not cost vaccination capacity at all and would solve this side effect issue. Its difficult. In Ireland, we have mainly used the AZ for younger people and Pfizer/Biontech/Moderna for older. Initially because of the lack of data and then because doctors appreciated giving the higher efficiacy vaccine to those most at risk (and not having a lot of AZ). There has been no incidents here with AZ but that says nothing given our small population. Although, since the UK haven't had many issues either, maybe our similar response to our neighbour isn't a surprise. If it has to be done, it has to be done. But changing the approach to AZ again would send very bad signals. Maybe France took the best approach, going straight to the age restriction. Statistically, I imagine the EMA is right though. My main worry with Canada was that they had seen lots of new bad data. And I suppose going from 7 to 18 cases is bad but at least the fatality rate hasn't increased in sync. So good to know that the treatment is working. Still weird that it is concentrated in certain countries though. Otherwise, J&J seem to be confirmed for the week starting 19th April. And this was nice and surprising. Quote European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen informed Bosnia’s Council of Ministers Chairman that the delivery of 650,000 Pfizer vaccines, donated by the EU, will begin in the Western Balkans in the first half of April Bosnia is having lots of trouble right now with COVID. https://europeanwesternbalkans.com/2021/03/29/eu-to-deliver-650000-pfizer-vaccines-to-the-western-balkans-in-april/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotting sea cow Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 The scientific report of some of the Austrian and German cases is out but it's not yet peer-reviewed. https://www.researchsquare.com/article/rs-362354/v1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impmk2 Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 1 hour ago, Which Tyler said: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/mar/30/university-scientists-deconstruct-covid-19-vaccines-and-publish-recipe-on-open-web I was wondering when someone would do this. It's interesting how boring / simple these are. They're literally cut and pastes of full length sars-cov-2 spike with a couple amino acid substitution (I assume for folding / protein stability purposes). When I do an alignment they're absolutely 100% the same in their coding regions (ie the bit of RNA which matters). No wonder their performance is basically identical in trials, they're pretty much the same vaccine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted March 30, 2021 Author Share Posted March 30, 2021 Here’s a stupid thought. Everybody has been giving the mRNA vaccines to older people because they produce a better immune response than AZ does. Now folks are saying give the AZ vaccine to older people and the mRNA vaccines to younger people because of the blood clotting. What happens when you find out older people also get the blood clotting, now that millions of old people are getting AZ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoannaL Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 9 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said: Here’s a stupid thought. Everybody has been giving the mRNA vaccines to older people because they produce a better immune response than AZ does. Now folks are saying give the AZ vaccine to older people and the mRNA vaccines to younger people because of the blood clotting. What happens when you find out older people also get the blood clotting, now that millions of old people are getting AZ? I think that won't happen, because then we would have seen data from the UK, which started earlier and has given mio of doses of AZ to old people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotting sea cow Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 12 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said: Here’s a stupid thought. Everybody has been giving the mRNA vaccines to older people because they produce a better immune response than AZ does. Now folks are saying give the AZ vaccine to older people and the mRNA vaccines to younger people because of the blood clotting. What happens when you find out older people also get the blood clotting, now that millions of old people are getting AZ? A lot of the issue stems from the the risk-benefit perspective. Younger women who seems to be more affected by the clotting issue are at lower risk of severe covid. While the risk benefit ratio of the vaccine is most likely still very favorable, one needs to consider you are giving the vaccine to larger portion of the healthy population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoannaL Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 1 hour ago, Padraig said: Its difficult. In Ireland, we have mainly used the AZ for younger people and Pfizer/Biontech/Moderna for older. Initially because of the lack of data and then because doctors appreciated giving the higher efficiacy vaccine to those most at risk (and not having a lot of AZ). There has been no incidents here with AZ but that says nothing given our small population. Although, since the UK haven't had many issues either, maybe our similar response to our neighbour isn't a surprise. If it has to be done, it has to be done. But changing the approach to AZ again would send very bad signals. Maybe France took the best approach, going straight to the age restriction. Statistically, I imagine the EMA is right though. By checking the data today I stumbled over the decision of the state hospitals of Berlin (state Berlin- not federal Germany) to stopp AZ for women under 55 (the Charite started it which is a very well known and highly recognized hospital). also the state of Berlin stopped vaccinating its police force with AZ. There are also hospitals and communities all over Germany which decided for themselves to not use AZ for under 55 years old. I think our medical federal institutions need to act soon, otherwise there is kind of a revolution from the basis. "And this was nice and surprising. Quote European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen informed Bosnia’s Council of Ministers Chairman that the delivery of 650,000 Pfizer vaccines, donated by the EU, will begin in the Western Balkans in the first half of April Yes , very nice and important!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted March 30, 2021 Author Share Posted March 30, 2021 26 minutes ago, JoannaL said: I think that won't happen, because then we would have seen data from the UK, which started earlier and has given mio of doses of AZ to old people. The problem is, the UK has not seen any of the rare brain clots seen in Europe. I have read European officials say the problem has not been a “batch” issue, that it’s happened across different batches of vaccine. What is it that Sherlock Holmes said? When you have eliminated the impossible, no matter how improbable, what remains must be the truth? If the UK is not seeing any of those rare clotting events, doesn’t that suggest there is something different about the way the European plant is manufacturing AZ vaccine? It’s what I keep going back to as the source of the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoannaL Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 I just read new news about AZ: the state of Berlin has now officialy stopped AZ for woman under 60. Also 5 out of six University hospitals in Northrhine westphalia stopped AZ for younger women (this is important because this state is quite big- 18 mio people, so if they stop its over). In this article there were also new numbers on the side effect (so my numbers were old, I am sorry): 31 cases (two of them men), 9 deaths, of altogether 2,7 mio vaccinations. of these vaccinated there were 66% woman under 60 (medical personnel, primary school teachers and kindergarden carers) [sources are all in German] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filippa Eilhart Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Poland has been giving AZ to teachers (so mostly women under 60) and there also seems to be no reports of a higher number of incidents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Consigliere Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Some good news for Africa on the vaccine front. The African Union has reached an agreement with J&J to supply 400 million doses - 220 million this year + 180 million in 2022. Talks with AZ and Pfizer are still ongoing. The 400 million doses will be supplied from the Aspen Pharmacare factory in Port Elizabeth. An additional 30 million doses from the same factory is earmarked for South Africa with the first batch expected to be delivered next month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted March 30, 2021 Author Share Posted March 30, 2021 9 minutes ago, Consigliere said: Some good news for Africa on the vaccine front. The African Union has reached an agreement with J&J to supply 400 million doses - 220 million this year + 180 million in 2022. Talks with AZ and Pfizer are still ongoing. The 400 million doses will be supplied from the Aspen Pharmacare factory in Port Elizabeth. An additional 30 million doses from the same factory is earmarked for South Africa with the first batch expected to be delivered next month. How does one pronounce Gqeberha? I looked up Port Elizabeth to see where exactly it is and I see the name has changed. Also, I hope the plant has no problems sourcing components. 400 M doses vaccinates a big chunk of Africa, especially since countries in the north seem to be getting a good supply already, and other countries have very few cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clueless Northman Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Good news, or at least way better than the current situation. Yet Africa will need 2 bio doses, as a rough estimate (depends which vaccination threshold is required and how young people can actually be vaccinated). The continent really needs to be fully vaccinated before 2022 is over; it would be a bloody shame for advanced nations not to help achieve it, considering how fast things are going in the USA (not to mention it would be risky, variant/mutation-wise, which sadly might be the only incentive able to motivate Western countries to help once they're done with their own campaigns). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 7 hours ago, S John said: You know McConnell would only come out and make a statement like that if he was worried that Republican men dying of Covid more often than non-Republican men will erode an electoral advantage somewhere. but yea over in conservative land the vaccine has been received very differently than what you might read over here. That 50% number almost seems high to me based on the threads about vaccinations I’ve seen in recent days. Vaccine skepticism is rampant and appears to be the prevailing opinion on a right leaning board I visit sometimes. They didn't give the specific data for Republican women, but given the numbers cited in the piece, it's fair to assume that a lot of them also don't want the vaccine. Why not tell his fellow Republicans to all get the vaccine? Or Just say, "as a leader in the Republican party, every, regardless of race, gender, religion or political affiliation should get the vaccine?" He snitched on himself in my book with this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoannaL Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 4 minutes ago, Clueless Northman said: Good news, or at least way better than the current situation. Yet Africa will need 2 bio doses, as a rough estimate (depends which vaccination threshold is required and how young people can actually be vaccinated). The continent really needs to be fully vaccinated before 2022 is over; it would be a bloody shame for advanced nations not to help achieve it, considering how fast things are going in the USA (not to mention it would be risky, variant/mutation-wise, which sadly might be the only incentive able to motivate Western countries to help once they're done with their own campaigns). But you only need to vaccinate with J&J once, so 400 mio of that is as precious as 800 mio pfizer or AZ. also Africa is doing quite well compared with Europe or the Americas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Consigliere Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 3 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said: How does one pronounce Gqeberha? That's gonna be a little difficult for someone not a little bit familiar with isiXhosa. Gqe (clicking sound with tongue) be - bear rha - with the R being pronounced the same way you would pronounce a G in Afrikaans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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