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Falcon2909

What if Ned's companions hadn't died at the ToJ?

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What if Ned's companions hadn't died at the Tower of Joy?

Somehow all 7 of them manage to kill the 3 kingsguard present there without any casualties. 

and if they discover a dying lyanna and baby jon snow, what would have happened?

Would Ned have managed to convince them to keep this a secret? How would it affect things?

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Posted (edited)

Ned clearly had some idea of what he would find in the Tower of Joy. Otherwise, he would have gone there with more than seven men. It's also seems that he didn't choose the most able fighters, but friends he could rely on.

So, on one hand, probably he could have convinced them to keep it a secret. But on the other, seven people are probably too many to keep such a secret. It would be only a matter of time before one of them confides it to a talkative wife, or gets angry at Lord Eddard for some random cause and decides to betray him.

Edited by The hairy bear

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I have to agree that it would be very difficult to keep the secret. Martyn Cassel would be a household guard, so he may be an easier on to keep quiet. The Wull may be to far north to spread the rumor, but the Ryswell, Dustin and Glover are all from prominent enough houses, and as soon as a person from one of those households learns he truth (like servant or something) the rumor would be too difficult to contain. they would just have to drink too much one night and it may slip.

if they could keep mum on it though...

at the very least we could expect the Dustins and Ryswells to be less friendly with house bolton after the red wedding, provided Neds death and the red wedding all shook out the same. if any were with Robb at hags mire, they might even choose to reveal to him who Jon really was when he declared him his heir.

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22 hours ago, Falcon2909 said:

What if Ned's companions hadn't died at the Tower of Joy?

Somehow all 7 of them manage to kill the 3 kingsguard present there without any casualties. 

and if they discover a dying lyanna and baby jon snow, what would have happened?

Would Ned have managed to convince them to keep this a secret? How would it affect things?

Maybe Ned had to finish one or two off himself to keep the secret.

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On 8/25/2021 at 8:41 PM, Targaryeninkingslanding said:

I have to agree that it would be very difficult to keep the secret. Martyn Cassel would be a household guard, so he may be an easier on to keep quiet. The Wull may be to far north to spread the rumor, but the Ryswell, Dustin and Glover are all from prominent enough houses, and as soon as a person from one of those households learns he truth (like servant or something) the rumor would be too difficult to contain. they would just have to drink too much one night and it may slip.

if they could keep mum on it though...

at the very least we could expect the Dustins and Ryswells to be less friendly with house bolton after the red wedding, provided Neds death and the red wedding all shook out the same. if any were with Robb at hags mire, they might even choose to reveal to him who Jon really was when he declared him his heir.

I say Dustin and Ryswell would be unreliable, particularly Dustin because his wife would take any info on the Starks and run with it out of spite.

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17 minutes ago, Angel Eyes said:

I say Dustin and Ryswell would be unreliable, particularly Dustin because his wife would take any info on the Starks and run with it out of spite.

if her husband came back she would have no reason to resent ned. it wasn't ned's fault Brandon didn't marry her. it was his fault that her husband died (kinda). she might have even died in the meantime from having children.

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17 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

I say Dustin and Ryswell would be unreliable, particularly Dustin because his wife would take any info on the Starks and run with it out of spite.

Why would Willam Dustin want to spite Ned? He was clearly close enough with Ned that he took him along to the Tower of Joy. Ned clearly took men he could trust to be discreet, or else why would they even be there instead of a large force of troops? Dustin was clearly one of those men, so if he lived, he'd have kept quiet.

And Barbrey would have gotten her husband back, so why would she resent Ned?

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Floki of the Ironborn said:

Why would Willam Dustin want to spite Ned? He was clearly close enough with Ned that he took him along to the Tower of Joy. Ned clearly took men he could trust to be discreet, or else why would they even be there instead of a large force of troops? Dustin was clearly one of those men, so if he lived, he'd have kept quiet.

And Barbrey would have gotten her husband back, so why would she resent Ned?

Not Willam himself, but Barbrey would probably take the knowledge and run with it; too much of a risk that Willam would tell her.

Barbrey resents the Starks for two reasons: she didn’t get to marry Brandon and she lost her husband and Ned didn’t bother recovering his body for some reason (how hard is it to transport bones?) Willam being alive solves one issue but not the other.

Edited by Angel Eyes

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You know what, I actually change my mind. Ned brought only six other people with him when he went to the Tower of Joy, six people he felt he could trust. He was a great lord and a commander though, so the only reason he would bring so few people is if he had an idea of what he was to find, or at least strongly suspected. He had seen the remains of Rhaegar's other children, knew Robert did not care, and though the exact context of the relationship is unknown to us, at least most people already assumed Rhaegar was sleeping with Lyanna. Ned trusted all six of those men to keep the secret, because he already knew there would be a bastard.

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5 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

 

Barbrey resents the Starks for two reasons: she didn’t get to marry Brandon and she lost her husband and Ned didn’t bother recovering his body for some reason (how hard is it to transport bones?) Willam being alive solves one issue but not the other.

She never resented Ned for preventing her marriage to Brandon, though. That wasn’t on him. She’d probably be content to know that Rickard died a horrible death and made things work with Willam.

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Posted (edited)

Actually that battle would have been much cooler if anyone in there would have carried and used lightsabers.

EDIT: Actually somebody already made one ToJ with lightsabers

Edited by Loose Bolt
Link included

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Good point; Ned brought only the people he could trust with him because he had some idea of what he'd expect. He trusted the men, knew they'd keep it a secret; that's why he brought them along.

Oh and since Lord dustin would return alive, barbrey would have no reason to hate Ned.

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9 hours ago, Falcon2909 said:

Oh and since Lord dustin would return alive, barbrey would have no reason to hate Ned.

I think she's the kind of person who'd find a reason if she's so inclined.

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10 hours ago, Lord Lannister said:

I think she's the kind of person who'd find a reason if she's so inclined.

whats her problem? smh

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On 8/29/2021 at 10:02 AM, Lord Lannister said:

I think she's the kind of person who'd find a reason if she's so inclined.

Ned kinda got vengeance for Brandon in this scenario, and Barbery dustin doesn't lose anything for that. Maybe they would grieve for him together afterwords and be closer for it. Ned has plenty of kids, so if barb was able to have some they might even have their children marry... 

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On 8/29/2021 at 8:36 PM, Falcon2909 said:

whats her problem? smh

She's resentful of the Starks over being passed over for Catelyn as a bride for Brandon Stark. Plus according to Roose, assuming he isn't lying, warns Ramsay about her tendency to nurse grudges.

Quote

Lady Barbrey is a woman who knows how to nurse a grievance. Be grateful for that.

 

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