Varysblackfyre321 Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 32 minutes ago, john said: By people being more likely to be convicted of the crimes they’re charged with. I would refer to @karaddin solution to that. 32 minutes ago, john said: By people being more likely to be convicted of the crimes they’re charged with. How about both? A rapist should not be given different charges based around their genitals. That’s justice IMO. They should not get different treatment based around their biological sex. It permeates across society.if you Treat a rape—which is seen as the worst form of sexual assault generally—as not rape you get more prosecutors, judges, police, those enforcing the law and general society to not see as bad as rape and act accordingly and how they deal with the victim and punish the rapist. 32 minutes ago, john said: It’s already inevitable It’s inevitable there will always be misandrists who will not see women raping anyone as possible. At what point are you willing to not allow their misandry to dictate the law? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 Does a discussion about the legal definition of rape really belong on this thread? I am with @Spockydog here, still looking at the government's naked green-lighting of corruption. The government minister put up to justify it officially said that in closing down the standards committee to let one of their own off the hook they were "completely focused on trying to restore a degree of integrity and probity in public life" - the very definition of a doublethink lie. He also said, about the commissioner in charge of the standards committee "that it was difficult to see what the future of the commissioner was and it was up to her to consider her position". Basically "how dare you call us out on our corruption, we are going to get rid of you one way of another, but are trying to avoid the bad PR of outright sacking you". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 6 minutes ago, A wilding said: I am with @Spockydog here, still looking at the government's naked green-lighting of corruption. Aye. As someone old enough to remember the Cash for Questions scandal, I find this whole affair extremely depressing. Though, with opposition parties quite rightly having nothing do to with whatever bollocks Bozo intends to set up, where does he go from here? Is Parliament now just a corruption free for all with literally no oversight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 10 minutes ago, Spockydog said: Is Parliament now just a corrupt free for all with literally no oversight? I imagine that was the end goal. Though I am sure that they hoped to get there without attracting so much publicity on the way. Edit: And for me the other noteworthy aspect of this is that the MP at the centre of all this, found guilty of taking six figure sums to advocate for a company in government, is furiously protesting the unfairness of it all. While carefully not saying that he is innocent of the charges. I too am old enough to remember Neil Hamilton and Jonathan Aitken doing exactly the same thing. My impression has always been that the underlying driver for this is always "this is a legitimate job perk, lots of other people are doing similar things, it is very unfair to pick on me". Essentially it is a further indicator of the state of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varysblackfyre321 Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 12 minutes ago, A wilding said: Does a discussion about the legal definition of rape really belong on this thread? Possibly, I think discussions on laws and how they should or shouldn’t change are political by nature. And I kept it to the one in England. Though I acknowledge that’s a totally fair question to ask and could see a reasonable no to the question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 Maybe start a thread...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 13 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said: I would refer to @karaddin solution to that. It’s a valid solution. The one the England and Wales legal system has chosen is also a valid solution. 19 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said: They should not get different treatment based around their biological sex. It permeates across society.if you Treat a rape—which is seen as the worst form of sexual assault generally—as not rape you get more prosecutors, judges, police, those enforcing the law and general society to not see as bad as rape and act accordingly and how they deal with the victim and punish the rapist. There’s no equal opportunity to be a rapist. Crimes are outside society by definition. I agree purely from a legal definitional perspective, women should be included, it makes things neater. But I can see the argument for sticking closer to the long held definition. And from a practical perspective it makes no difference since, like I’ve said, women do not rape to any degree worth talking about. 24 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said: At what point are willing to not allow their misandry to dictate the law? Reasonably soon, from a law drafting point of view. Hence the inevitability. 23 minutes ago, A wilding said: Does a discussion about the legal definition of rape really belong on this thread? Yeah, fair enough. I’m repeating myself now anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varysblackfyre321 Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 48 minutes ago, Spockydog said: Maybe start a thread...? That’s a Totally fair and reasonable suggestion. I do apologize for hijacking the thread a little. I appreciate you and Wildling for breaking that train in a rational manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltaran Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 U-turn alert! Owen Paterson: Government to rethink MPs' conduct plan after backlash https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-59163961 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Which Tyler Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 9 minutes ago, Maltaran said: U-turn alert! Owen Paterson: Government to rethink MPs' conduct plan after backlash https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-59163961 A U-turn that has nothing to do with the Daily Heil failing to get on board with things - of course not. We're being governed by opinion pole and leak; with government getting away with whatever it can before it's cheerleaders in the press feel that they've tried too much. I suspect their cheerleaders will cheer the U-turn and completey forgive the initial despicatble intent, however; meaning that there's no repurcussions for anyone going forwards. We used to say that Trump got away with things daily that would sink any other government. We're not far off that ourselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 At the very least, Paterson's suspension must stand. The sleazy cunt should be forced into a by-election as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varysblackfyre321 Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 47 minutes ago, A wilding said: found guilty of taking six figure sums to advocate for a company in government, is furiously protesting the unfairness of it all. While carefully not saying that he is innocent of the charges. Wouldn’t it be better to just keep your head down there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mormont Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 On the legal definition of rape discussion, this is about the specific legal framework in the UK and so I wouldn't favour a separate thread, which could and probably would get derailed by a much broader and more inflammatory discussion if we took it out of this thread. That's my position for now, anyway. If it does get to the point of swamping other discussion in this thread I may revisit that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigFatCoward Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 The slimebag has resigned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 3 hours ago, Varysblackfyre321 said: Wouldn’t it be better to just keep your head down there? From our perspective yes. But in my opinion, your typical Tory MP believes that it is perfectly right and proper that the only people that should be allowed to censure them are a special committee of other Tory MPs that will understand. I suspect also that many of them think that favours done for a consideration is simply how the world works and that, while one mustn't admit it openly, anyone who does not realise it is a naive innocent. (I am certain that that is Johnson's own opinion for example.) I think that he is quite genuinely outraged. Incidentally, I think that is one of the reasons why they delayed lockdown so long in Spring last year - they naturally tend to judge others to be the same as themselves and assumed that a lockdown would be widely flouted. Anyway, glad to see that our new Mr Sleaze is now resigning. By past record, he will crop up in UKIP in a few years time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 26 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said: The slimebag has resigned. His fucking statement tho. He had a pretty big majority, and I doubt the people of North Shropshire will do the right thing, so I expect they'll just elect another fetid Tory homunculus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 Just read it. Considering that he has invariably been the one to use his wife's suicide as a weapon and a reason why he should be let off, while everyone else has tiptoed around it, his Quote My children have therefore asked me to leave politics altogether, for my sake as well as theirs. I agree with them. I do not want my wife's memory and reputation to become a political football. Above all, I always put my family first. is nauseating cant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 These people have no shame. At all. Ugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derfel Cadarn Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 He’ll probably be a lord in 6 months… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoodedCrow Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 Lord of the Flies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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