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US politics: Rovenber is coming.


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18 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

@Firebrand Jace

Implying that… but for US intervention in Europe the Shoah wouldn’t have happened is Horseshit of the highest order.  In Mein Kampf Hitler laid out his plans to kills Jews.  That had nothing to do with US intervention.  Further sharing any claim that the WWII allies were a “Jewish-dominated alliance” is a fucking mountain of Horseshit.

I think you are missing something here. Neither the tweet you posted nor Jace said what you are implying and the tweet is pretty accuratee. Hitler perceived the US as hostile to him and the Nazis and believed this to be part of a Jewish conspiracy. That's pretty uncontriversial so I am not sure what you are taking issue with.

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the issue people (not scot) are rightly taking with m traceys tweets is that he is taking the position that the us is not to be lauded for fighting the nazis, should not have gotten involved at all because of the additional devastation the us wrought on the continent (eg, dresden etc) and that us involvement did not in fact stop the implementation of the mass extermination of tue holocaust. he is of course incorrect in his assement, but equally shining intellects on twitter are framing his argument as him saying the us *caused* the holocaust by putting boots in the ground, which is also clearly incorrect. 

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29 minutes ago, Firebrand Jace said:

Huh? 

Nah, I'm saying that U.S.A existed in opposition to Imperial Germany years before war was declared in 1917. And also that one of the disastrous consequences of unrestricted sub warfare was that USA went from opponent to open enemy.

Hitler's relation to USA in 1941 is basically the same thing over again. Again with disastrous consequences for the German leadership.

So what I'm actually trying to convey here is that Putin would be a fool to try and politic-play himself into some situation where NATO has declared war on Russia. If you're Russia you'd rather fight Ukraine with America in its corner than Ukraine and America both in the ring at the same time. 

Does that make any sense?

I see what you are saying.  I still don’t think Tracey is anything but nuts to imply the Shoah was caused by US intervention.

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21 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I see what you are saying.  I still don’t think Tracey is anything but nuts to imply the Shoah was caused by US intervention.

He didn't? Unless there is more to the tweet chain you posted. 

edit: ah ok outsourcing consent explained. I guess your up on all the twitter drama I didn't have the context for that. I will say that tweet is still pretty much 100% accurate. But it seems some people are confusing cause and effect. The US helping England and the Soviets prior to entering the war didn't cause Hitler to become anti-semtic beecause he thought it was a Jewish conspiracy. Hitler thought everything was a Jewish conspiracy because that's how he saw the world.

Edited by Darzin
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21 minutes ago, outsourcing consent said:

the issue people (not scot) are rightly taking with m traceys tweets is that he is taking the position that the us is not to be lauded for fighting the nazis, should not have gotten involved at all because of the additional devastation the us wrought on the continent (eg, dresden etc) and that us involvement did not in fact stop the implementation of the mass extermination of tue holocaust. he is of course incorrect in his assement, but equally shining intellects on twitter are framing his argument as him saying the us *caused* the holocaust by putting boots in the ground, which is also clearly incorrect. 

 

16 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I see what you are saying.  I still don’t think Tracey is anything but nuts to imply the Shoah was caused by US intervention.

Right on, I'm caught up now. Yeah, I was just examining the sequence factors that led to war as opposed to dedicated opposituon. I wish no affiliation with whatever madness these people are frothing. 

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Texas sheriff investigating DeSantis’ role in flying migrants to Martha’s Vineyard
The sheriff’s move follows requests from Democrats for the Justice Department to investigate DeSantis over the flights.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/09/19/desantis-immigrants-marthas-vineyard-00057639

Quote

 

TALLAHASSEE, Fla. — A Texas sheriff on Monday opened an investigation into the legality of Gov. Ron DeSantis’ recent move to fly dozens of mostly Venezuelan migrants to Martha’s Vineyard.

Bexar County Sheriff Javier Salazar, an elected Democrat, said that while he could not cite specific laws that may have been broken by relocating the migrants, his office will be investigating what he called an “abuse of human rights.” The threat of criminal charges is an escalation against DeSantis amid widespread criticism from Democrats as the Republican governor promises to continue diverting migrants in Texas as a statement against Biden administration immigration policies.

“Somebody saw fit to come from another state, hunt them down, prey upon them, and then take advantage of their desperate situation just for the sake of political theater, just for the sake of making a statement,” Salazar told reporters Monday. “I believe people need to be held accountable for it to the extent possible.”

 

 

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31 minutes ago, Firebrand Jace said:

 

Right on, I'm caught up now. Yeah, I was just examining the sequence factors that led to war as opposed to dedicated opposituon. I wish no affiliation with whatever madness these people are frothing. 

Even if you weren't caught up, you quite succinctly showed that even if you accept all his logic jumps his actual point still doesn't follow from it the way he wants it to. Current Russia is struggling with Ukraine supplied by the west, dragging in the entire military forces of NATO is not going to go well and for all his judgement seems to be off in the last year there's no indication he's *that* delusional yet.

So unless he's deciding to just straight up end the world, he should know this situation is better then the alternative.

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22 minutes ago, Martell Spy said:

Texas sheriff investigating DeSantis’ role in flying migrants to Martha’s Vineyard
The sheriff’s move follows requests from Democrats for the Justice Department to investigate DeSantis over the flights.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/09/19/desantis-immigrants-marthas-vineyard-00057639

 

The party of Jesus continues to act in ways that would make Jesus weep.

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23 minutes ago, ThinkerX said:

Lost track of the article, but it seems Team Trump refused to tell the newly appointed Special Master just which documents Trump 'declassified.'

Just have the SM look for the ones with the Diet Coke stains on them. 

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13 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

@Firebrand Jace

Implying that… but for US intervention in Europe the Shoah wouldn’t have happened is Horseshit of the highest order.  In Mein Kampf Hitler laid out his plans to kills Jews.  That had nothing to do with US intervention.  Further sharing any claim that the WWII allies were a “Jewish-dominated alliance” is a fucking mountain of Horseshit.

Could you give a quote from Mr. Tracey showing that he does believe that about the Shoah? Because the Twitter quote you provided does not imply that to me. And if the quote is incorrect, that would be one thing. But I do not see why it is wrong to share a statement about Hitler's beliefs when they are clearly attributed to Hitler himself. This just shows how horrible Hitler was. 

P.S. I was writing the above while you were posting the quote from Dr. Beorn that says Tracey did argue that the U.S. entry into the war accelerated the Final Solution. But that was not at all stated in your initial post. 

Edited by Ormond
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