US Politics: Chaos Made to Border

[Kalbear]

1 hour ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

Yes, it's next level stupidity especially when it's combined with Trump and the House killing the border deal. For all of Pelosi's faults, she would never have let this happen. Mike Johnson is so bad at his job. Shit, most kids in HS class government know not to bring something up if they didn't have all the votes needed. Total own goal here. 

Eh. This just is a good way to ensure Trump knows who he wants to primary.

[Zorral]

The Republican-led House of Representatives has failed in a knife-edge vote to impeach Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas over the migrant crisis at the US-Mexico border.

Four Republicans broke ranks and joined all Democratic members of the chamber to vote 216-214 against the measure

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68172247

[A Horse Named Stranger]

8 hours ago, Phylum of Alexandria said:

I dunno, if McConnell hadn't dangled that open justice seat as an election issue to galvanize conservatives, there's a good chance Trump would have lost to Hilary in 2016, which would have butterflied away the later decision on conviction.

(still, it's not either/or. He fucked us majorly on both decisions)

That's missing the point.

Moscow Mitch got a 6:3 majority at the SCOTUS (+tax cuts) out of the orange clown. That's more than he could have hoped for, when he started this Supreme Court shizzle (that was to preserve a 5:4 majority).

Had he been a bit more ruthless and helped to convict Trump, he would have walked away with his 6:3 majority (the thing he really cared about) and diminished influence of Trump over his party, most notably doofus wouldn't be allowed to run for office again. If Thomas kicked the proverbial bucket during a second Biden term and Chutkan or Pan replace him, he'd be would be back to a 5:4 majority.

Edited February 7 by A Horse Named Stranger

[Phylum of Alexandria]

11 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

That's missing the point.

Moscow Mitch got a 6:3 majority at the SCOTUS (+tax cuts) out of the orange clown. That's more than he could have hoped for, when he started this Supreme Court shizzle (that was to preserve a 5:4 majority).

Had he been a bit more ruthless and helped to convict Trump, he would have walked away with his 6:3 majority (the thing he really cared about) and diminished influence of Trump over his party, most notably doofus wouldn't be allowed to run for office again. If Thomas kicked the proverbial bucket during a second Biden term and Chutkan or Pan replace him, he'd be would be back to a 5:4 majority.

The original wording I was responding to was "the bigger error."  From McConnell's point of view, sure, I guess you're right.

I was interpreting it as the bigger catastrophe for us. Because fuck McConnell.

[Maithanet]

I'm fairly sure McConnell didn't have the votes to conduct Trump back in 2020.  If he had, he would have voted to be rid of him.  He could have pushed harder, but it might not have done him any good.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

58 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

Eh. This just is a good way to ensure Trump knows who he wants to primary.

Which is good for Dems.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

I disagree. I think he could'Ve found the missing votes. He just placed party unity above all at that moment. Short terminism at its best. He lobbied to not convict. Sure, he wouldn't have gotten his full caucus to convict. But you are saying, that he couldn't find like 12 more votes?

[TrackerNeil]

50 minutes ago, Maithanet said:

I'm fairly sure McConnell didn't have the votes to conduct Trump back in 2020.  If he had, he would have voted to be rid of him.  He could have pushed harder, but it might not have done him any good.

That may be, but McConnell did not have to slow-walk the trial until after Trump left office, and then say, "Oh, we can't convict a president who has left office." 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

Quote

Former South Carolina Gov. Nikki Haley will lose Nevada’s nonbinding Republican primary to “none of these candidates,” an embarrassing defeat in a contest that did not feature former President Donald Trump on the ballot.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/06/politics/nevada-primaries-biden-trump-haley/index.html

Ouch! 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

9 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

If Trump loses in November and Congress does it's job in January '25, then Trump is gone forever as a political force, IMO, there's no shot he is in line for the 2028 nomination after a failure in 2024. He either takes the White House by hook or by crook this year or he's out forever. The question is whether MAGA disappears as well.

MAGA is here to stay, it just might prove to be increasingly ineffectual if Trump loses. His cheap imitations don't seem to be having a ton of success. But make no mistake about it, the old, more traditional part of the conservative movement is dead for now. The next Bush 41 or Bob Dole ain't walking through that door anytime soon as the next leader of the party. 

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

23 minutes ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

MAGA is here to stay, it just might prove to be increasingly ineffectual if Trump loses. His cheap imitations don't seem to be having a ton of success. But make no mistake about it, the old, more traditional part of the conservative movement is dead for now. The next Bush 41 or Bob Dole ain't walking through that door anytime soon as the next leader of the party. 

That’s true. 

[Maithanet]

Politico had a good article about the timeline and next steps for Trump's trial.  Interestingly, it doesn't even entertain option 4 (added by me).

1. The Supreme Court declines to take the case.  This would be the best option for the prosecution and would allow the trial to very likely be completed by summer.  The unanimous ruling from the appellate court helps here.  Hard to say whether the SC will allow that though.

2.  The Supreme Court takes the case and fast tracks it.  This would still result in a couple months delay at a minimum.  Assuming that Trump will delay all he can (a safe assumption), then we are getting pretty near election day. 

3.  The Supreme Court takes the case and does not fast track.  The case is delayed many months, and there is no chance that we get a ruling before 2025. 

4.  Same as #2, but the SC agrees that the President is immune from prosecution in all circumstances.  Trump is acquitted, and able to call that a big win.  As a side note, political assassinations are A-OK. 

[Zorral]

They really want her gone because orangish godemperor needs All the Money

Republican National Committee wants Nikki Haley to drop out to boost funds
Exclusive: RNC reported $8m in cash to spend, less than half of what it had in 2016, as it starts preparing for the 2024 election

Haley loses to ‘none of the candidates’ in Nevada primary

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/feb/07/rnc-nikki-haley-drop-out-funds

 

[Martell Spy]

Quote

MAGA is here to stay

Yep, and it is all about licking Putin's ass all the time, every day.

[Phylum of Alexandria]

1 hour ago, Maithanet said:

4.  Same as #2, but the SC agrees that the President is immune from prosecution in all circumstances.  Trump is acquitted, and able to call that a big win.  As a side note, political assassinations are A-OK. 

If that happened, Biden may as well go into benevolent dictator mode. Execute Trump and all MAGA leaders, take out the radicals in Congress, and in the courts. Then install the people he wants, and conveniently resign before any impeachment could come.

[sologdin]

Biden may as well go into benevolent dictator mode.

this is the reason that trump's attorneys argue in obvious bad faith.  they have to know that if their argument prevails, then the current president can just go full stalin. some qanonist will spot that problem and then realize further that trump is just a tool of the deep state to bring about socialism. 

[Zorral]

5 minutes ago, sologdin said:

Biden may as well go into benevolent dictator mode.

this is the reason that trump's attorneys argue in obvious bad faith.  they have to know that if their argument prevails, then the current president can just go full stalin. some qanonist will spot that problem and then realize further that trump is just a tool of the deep state to bring about socialism. 

???????????

This statement needs to be broken down in detail and glossed.

[Kalbear]

11 minutes ago, sologdin said:

Biden may as well go into benevolent dictator mode.

this is the reason that trump's attorneys argue in obvious bad faith.  they have to know that if their argument prevails, then the current president can just go full stalin. some qanonist will spot that problem and then realize further that trump is just a tool of the deep state to bring about socialism. 

Except their party - the party in power, which will obviously always be true (to them) can simply block said president from doing anything via either legislative or judicial restrictions. 

Because they assume - probably rightly - that if a dem tried that they could impeach said dem and various other dems would join in. 

[Kalbear]

On the impeachment of Mayorkas - it's hilarious to me that Republican votes largely failed because they assumed that dems would not be able to bring their whole caucus to the floor because, presumably, the dems are as unorganized and stupid as they are. Their whole plan was built around dems not being fully present - due to surgery, in this case.

This is such an incredibly stupid government. 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2024/02/06/house-republicans-yell-gallagher-impeachment-vote/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F3ca9ab9%2F65c3b8c83b7ab413cd717a51%2F5972e372ae7e8a1cf4b1d8ff%2F7%2F53%2F65c3b8c83b7ab413cd717a51

[Zorral]

‘A Palpable Fear of Even Letting Your Friends Know You Are a Democrat’
In deep red Wyoming, a Democratic Party organizer says inflamed political tensions are his greatest hurdle.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/02/07/democrat-rural-america-struggles-qa-00139921

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

One of the big reasons Biden performed a highly publicized campaign visit there.

How Did That Horribly Racist Wall Street Journal Op-Ed on Arab Americans Even Happen?
Unpacking the mess behind a story that’s already having real-world consequences.
BY AYMANN ISMAIL
FEB 06, 20246:01 PM

https://slate.com/business/2024/02/dearborn-wsj-op-ed-controversy-explained.html

Here is the piece in question, evidently paid for, one way and another, as propaganda to shape very bad consequences, not just for this particular community, but for US democracy as a whole, and anywhere else.

Welcome to Dearborn, America’s Jihad Capital
Imams and politicians in the Michigan city side with Hamas against Israel and Iran against the U.S.
By Steven Stalinsky
Feb. 2, 2024 3:24 pm ET

https://www.wsj.com/articles/welcome-to-dearborn-americas-jihad-capital-pro-hamas-michigan-counterterrorism-a99dba38

Edited February 7 by Zorral