[Book Spoilers] Rant and Rave without Repercussion II

[HexMachina]

St. Tyrion, the one true gift.

But he beat the nasty slaver up! Greyness! :p

[Elba the Intoner]

So I am joining this party a little late because I was away for the weekend and I see this is already onto the second thread. Not surprising but what is surprising is how many people are saying they liked this episode. Just look at the ratings thread here. This episode was soooooo boooorrrrriiiiinnnnggggg! Maester Aemon died. That was sad but he didn't say anything revealing for plot purposes. We already knew he was a Targ. Sansa/Ramsay/Theon - sigh. That whole sequence was a repeat of Sansa in season one when after Ned is killed Joff takes her to see his head and she sasses him and says maybe Robb will give her Joff's head. So they have just put her back to season one scenes. Also, how did Ramsay know that this woman is a North sympathizer? Reek didn't know who it was that was helping Sansa.

I was furious that they tried to use rape again as a plot device with Gilly. It was cool to see Ghost but I was wondering why he wouldn't be with Jon.

The sand snake scene was dumb. Are they trying to build up some kind of romance between Bronn and Tyene? Is that what they will use to explain why Tyene would try to poison Bronn and then give him the antidote a little later (assuming she did in fact give him an antidote)? Why wasn't Ellaria in the cell with the other girls? Why wasn't Jaime in a cell? What was the point of his scene with Myrcella? There was no purpose to any of this.

If the Sparrows are so into arresting anyone who has sinned against the gods then why is LF, a known brothel owner, even able to walk around King's Landing at all? Also, Olenna is completely ineffectual. Everyone knows about the incest and she doesn't have anything to use against Cersei herself? She has to wait for LF to present her with his gift of Lancel? And didn't Lancel tell the High Sparrow about Cersei already?

The Jorah/Tyrion scenes were just awful! Pitiful! What was with Tyrion hitting that slaver like that? They all laugh and don't do anything? Jorah's fight was not good either. I can't believe people thought that was a good fight scene. He walked out there and sucker punched all the other fighters that were left. That is not good fighting. Why was Tyrion the only one chained up and why would some random guy release him? What happened to Tyrion's accent? He is just phoning it in this season. There was no reason for Dany to be there either. It was a lame way of bringing them together. And Dany and Daario are a snoozefest to watch.

[HexMachina]

There's no longer any real complexity to this show. It's simplified to the point of absurdness.

- Faith Militant is now Budget ISIS

- No Northern Lords

- No Iron Islands

- Main point of Dorne removed (Arianne)

- No interesting journey for Tyrion through Essos

- King's Landing plot totally simplified

Is there a plot line that is in any way complex? Only Littlefinger's "plan". And that's not complex in a good way. More in a WUT? way.

Amusing things this episode:

Melli-sans-bra mentioning the power of king's blood. Hm, who was that third guy? Related to someone on the show, right?

Dany saying she can't face enemies within and without. WHAT enemies without? You're not being sieged. There is no other problem except the Sons of the Harpy. Also, glad to see that Barristan's death affected you. Straight back to fucking and flirting with Daario, no mention of Barry.

This is ENDEMIC of this season. A thing happens then is IMMEDIATELY forgotten.

Lol! Just slipped over my head that she said "enemies without". Just another "lets slip that in and hope no one notices" moment. I just laughed at the Balon thing, past caring now.

A

So, I think D&D must have visited the forums and read the "Does anyone miss Joffrey?" Thread. Because Tommen was basically Joff 2.0 in that scene

[Cas Stark]

Regarding the old lady...do you think they are doing that on purpose, the parallels...or are they just lazy and not very inventive? Since she reacted in season 1 in an unexpected way, talking back to Joff, where we see the very beginning of Sansa beginning to change.... it seems odd they're doing it on purpose to showcase how much she has evolved?

[Good Guy Garlan]

Btw., what did BookAemon say about Dany?

That she's the bee's knees and that Melisandre is full of crap because Dany, not Stannis, is the only hope to defeat the White Walkers. Basically that she's the fulfillment of an ancient prophecy that the show has neglected to mention for some reason.

[Chebyshov]

There's no longer any real complexity to this show. It's simplified to the point of absurdness.

- Faith Militant is now Budget ISIS

- No Northern Lords

- No Iron Islands

- Main point of Dorne removed (Arianne)

- No interesting journey for Tyrion through Essos

- King's Landing plot totally simplified

Don't forget Simplified Bay. Navies magically appear! There's only one group of mercenaries who conveniently stop killing even though Dany never asked Hizdahr to do a thing (it's like a happy accident). There's no crippling disease causing Dany to make difficult decisions about "her children." Rhaegal and Viseron can be as tamed or untamed as the plot necessitates. And Yunkai is done with?

[Good Guy Garlan]

Dany saying she can't face enemies within and without. WHAT enemies without? You're not being sieged. There is no other problem except the Sons of the Harpy. Also, glad to see that Barristan's death affected you. Straight back to fucking and flirting with Daario, no mention of Barry.

This is ENDEMIC of this season. A thing happens then is IMMEDIATELY forgotten.

Yeah, I could be wrong, but I seem to remember that in "Kill the Boy", Sam reads a random letter to Aemon about Dany and it says she's besieged by her enemies, but I think that in this episode she says something like, "when my enemies attack, I will be ready"

So it's like, make up your mind, girl, are you under siege or not?

[Mindwalker]

Yeah, I could be wrong, but I seem to remember that in "Kill the Boy", Sam reads a random letter to Aemon about Dany and it says she's besieged by her enemies, but I think that in this episode she says something like, "when my enemies attack, I will be ready"

So it's like, make up your mind, girl, are you under siege or not?

Yes, I definitely remember that, I thought: Huh, besieged by whom?

[King Beyond the Firewall]

Don't forget Simplified Bay. Navies magically appear! There's only one group of mercenaries who conveniently stop killing even though Dany never asked Hizdahr to do a thing (it's like a happy accident). There's no crippling disease causing Dany to make difficult decisions about "her children." Rhaegal and Viseron can be as tamed or untamed as the plot necessitates. And Yunkai is done with?

Exactly this. I'm sure that Dany even talks about her marriage to Hizdahr and says something like "I can't face enemies within and without." Can't remember the exact line but it's something like this. There are no other enemies. No siege. No disease. No sell swords to worry about. No Ironborn. No Quentyn.

But wait! Tyrion is there! Never look a gift dwarf in the mouth.

[Kyoshi]

I always like Dany's soundtrack (I think Ramin Djawadi has said he enjoys composing for her the most). But I mean generally the soundtrack has been really over-used and particularly hamfisted this season. It hasn't really been subtle since season 1, but this season is especially bad.

And the Faith theme is just so out of place. The Red God theme is also overly sinister and on-the-nose, but at least it doesn't feel like a direct comparison to a real-world religion.

Gotcha!

i am looking forward to the daznak pit and what Ramin come up with when dany mounts Drogon

Same here. But I now think the possibility of Drogon roasting her is likelier, given the way they are changing things for the lolz of it. Or Tyrion will be the one to ride Drogon; that actually wouldn't shock me at this point. I've started preparing for it.

[Mindwalker]

That she's the bee's knees and that Melisandre is full of crap because Dany, not Stannis, is the only hope to defeat the White Walkers. Basically that she's the fulfillment of an ancient prophecy that the show has neglected to mention for some reason.

Thank you!

[Hayyoth]

Don't forget Simplified Bay. Navies magically appear! There's only one group of mercenaries who conveniently stop killing even though Dany never asked Hizdahr to do a thing (it's like a happy accident). There's no crippling disease causing Dany to make difficult decisions about "her children." Rhaegal and Viseron can be as tamed or untamed as the plot necessitates. And Yunkai is done with?

Y'all realize we can't have the battle of Meereen because D&D decided to blow the budget doing a location shoot in Spain....to bring us the wondrous cinematic achievement that is Porne. Ponder that for a minute.

[LongRider]

~~~~snip~~~~

Btw., what did BookAemon say about Dany?

You can read the passage, here; http://asearchoficeandfire.com/?q=Xhondo%27s+talk&scope[]=affc

[Le Cygne]

Sansa/Ramsay/Theon - sigh. That whole sequence was a repeat of Sansa in season one when after Ned is killed Joff takes her to see his head and she sasses him and says maybe Robb will give her Joff's head. So they have just put her back to season one scenes. Also, how did Ramsay know that this woman is a North sympathizer? Reek didn't know who it was that was helping Sansa.

They regressed her to season1, but now she's a woman, so she's being raped. In the books, becoming a woman is about making her own choices, in her own way, resisting the choices others are making for her. On the show, becoming a woman is about her vagina.

And yeah, using rape as a plot device with Gilly is so horrible, too.

[kissdbyfire]

So I am joining this party a little late because I was away for the weekend and I see this is already onto the second thread. Not surprising but what is surprising is how many people are saying they liked this episode. Just look at the ratings thread here. This episode was soooooo boooorrrrriiiiinnnnggggg! Maester Aemon died. That was sad but he didn't say anything revealing for plot purposes. We already knew he was a Targ. Sansa/Ramsay/Theon - sigh. That whole sequence was a repeat of Sansa in season one when after Ned is killed Joff takes her to see his head and she sasses him and says maybe Robb will give her Joff's head. So they have just put her back to season one scenes. Also, how did Ramsay know that this woman is a North sympathizer? Reek didn't know who it was that was helping Sansa.

I was furious that they tried to use rape again as a plot device with Gilly. It was cool to see Ghost but I was wondering why he wouldn't be with Jon.

The sand snake scene was dumb. Are they trying to build up some kind of romance between Bronn and Tyene? Is that what they will use to explain why Tyene would try to poison Bronn and then give him the antidote a little later (assuming she did in fact give him an antidote)? Why wasn't Ellaria in the cell with the other girls? Why wasn't Jaime in a cell? What was the point of his scene with Myrcella? There was no purpose to any of this.

If the Sparrows are so into arresting anyone who has sinned against the gods then why is LF, a known brothel owner, even able to walk around King's Landing at all? Also, Olenna is completely ineffectual. Everyone knows about the incest and she doesn't have anything to use against Cersei herself? She has to wait for LF to present her with his gift of Lancel? And didn't Lancel tell the High Sparrow about Cersei already?

The Jorah/Tyrion scenes were just awful! Pitiful! What was with Tyrion hitting that slaver like that? They all laugh and don't do anything? Jorah's fight was not good either. I can't believe people thought that was a good fight scene. He walked out there and sucker punched all the other fighters that were left. That is not good fighting. Why was Tyrion the only one chained up and why would some random guy release him? What happened to Tyrion's accent? He is just phoning it in this season. There was no reason for Dany to be there either. It was a lame way of bringing them together. And Dany and Daario are a snoozefest to watch.

I agree with all you've said. I really don't like the Winterfell plot, and I can't foresee any scenario that would make me change my mind, regardless of how they move forward with it, I can't see it working for me. I really disliked the scene where Sansa is begging Theon for help. I feel like they're going to take Sansa to the worst place possible, and then 'boom', out of the blue, MAJOR REACTION/empowerment/whatever, in a really unrealistic turn of events.

But I'm afraid this will be a problem with many arcs and plots, where they may take characters to one (unrealistic) extreme just to magically provide a 'solution'. Like with Dany going all mad queen and burning that guy (I hated that scene!), just to put her in the worst possible situation, making her ready to welcome St. Tyrion with open arms.

Regarding CB, really didn't like the rape threat. I mean, come on, enough already. Ghost not going with Jon was incomprehensible to me. And then have him magically appear, save the day, and vanish.

I thought I hadn't understood the scene with Olenna and Littlefinger, since I couldn't for the life of me think of who he meant. But if he was talking about Lancel, then it's just more of the same casual inconsistency we've been getting all season.

[Drogonthedread]

Gotcha!

Same here. But I now think the possibility of Drogon roasting her is likelier, given the way they are changing things for the lolz of it. Or Tyrion will be the one to ride Drogon; that actually wouldn't shock me at this point. I've started preparing for it.

Well i for one think that saint tyrion will be the one to mount drogon and while he flies in joy ...dany looks broken a Son of the harpy slashes her throat

we get our red wedding moment

[LongRider]

They regressed her to season1, but now she's a woman, so she's being raped. In the books, becoming a woman is about making her own choices, in her own way, resisting the choices others are making for her. On the show, becoming a woman is about her vagina.

And yeah, using rape as a plot device with Gilly is so horrible, too.

Using a rape attempt to create a situation where Sam & Gilly get together is just so stupid, when in story, it was grief, comfort, their common humanity and yes, rum, that all had their parts to play. But subtly and nuance aren't D$D's style.

[Mark Antony]

St. Tyrion, the one true gift.

Still pissed they killed Barristan since its so obvious now that Tyrion will be taking over his dance chapters which we all called here when Barry died :(

[Cas Stark]

I thought I hadn't understood the scene with Olenna and Littlefinger, since I couldn't for the life of me think of who he meant. But if he was talking about Lancel, then it's just more of the same casual inconsistency we've been getting all season.

Who else could it be? It has to be Lancel. Granted, I had assumed that Lancel had already confessed his sins to the HS when we saw him in the opener....so it's odd that somehow LF has arranged that Lancel's confession occur now..unless he confessed to some other septon? and LF somehow?? arranged for this to come to the HS notice? which is somewhat hamfisted.

But, nobody else makes any sense and there is no other handsome boy who knows anything about Cersei's crimes except for Lancel. So, it's a plot hole but by GOT season 5 standards, n ot even a large one, LOL.

[Greywolf2375]

So, I think D&D must have visited the forums and read the "Does anyone miss Joffrey?" Thread. Because Tommen was basically Joff 2.0 in that scene

It's funny you say that because my wife doesn't really watch the show, but saw his temper tantrum with Cersei and turned to me "Didn't he die? Did they change the actor?"