Rant & Rave Season 8 [Spoilers]: When you are cool like a cucumber, as evil as the mother of madness, but never as perfect as the pet!

[Ser Drewy]

On 8/17/2020 at 7:43 AM, SeanF said:

With the benefit of hindsight, I'd say Daenerys in Qarth should have been the Red Flag, showing what would happen when D & D produced extended original material.

My experience was that disappointment began to set in during S2. I was disappointed by how they did both Dany and Jon's storylines, and didn't like Talisa. I remember thinking the end with Sam and the Others was silly as well. But I held out hope that S3 would be better, but it also brought some of its own issues as well. S4 I was more jaded, but still hopeful most of it would turn out okay... dropping Tysha was likely the endpoint for me. I went into S5 with minimal expectations, and that season really just killed any emotional investment I had in the show. I just laugh-watched S6 onwards. 

[Count Balerion]

Season 2 I was still trying to figure out what was going on. I'd not yet read the books, so was less critical. I did find Robb a bit of a jerk and Dany in Qarth a bit what-the-blazes. (My first what-the-blazes moment was the sexposition scene at the end of season 1.) After I read, I thought:

Wow, Dany is way better in the books.

Jeyne is rather colourless compared to Talisa. (Though Talisa was perhaps a little ... random?) But I liked book-Robb better.

I continued this on-the-one-hand-on-the-other-hand approach until season 5. Even during season 5, I at first thought there might be a payoff. When there wasn't, I went back and revised my earlier ratings downwards. Afterwards I was far more critical.

[kissdbyfire]

22 hours ago, Le Cygne said:

Jon as a Targ was such an epic fail. The answer to who am I has to be answered with something very personal, about himself.

The excuses are just hilarious. Well, they did revisit it. People revisit the bathroom.

They kept hyping this as great television, so awesome you don't even have to see what's going on. But there was no story.

It was. But really, what wasn’t an epic fail? We can pick from so many! Jon’s resurrection, Jaime not caring, Mean Sandra, Cersei staring out of a window and drinking, Brienne (back in s5) staring out of a window and not drinking, Sansarya fake out, Beric (who?), Pointlessbowl, Ninjarya, the Long Nap, and on and on and on it goes. Massive. Epic. Fails.

[ThotKiller]

Lord Tywin became my favorite

"Well if there was a petition, I would sign it."

"I mean, I saw it. I continue to watch the whole series even after I'd been killed off in the lavatory," Dance laughed. "Because I just thought it's a fantastic television show, you know? I was very lucky to be part of it. I loved it; there were storylines [where] I wanted to know what was going to happen to these people! I know that the finale satisfied a lot of people. It also disappointed a lot of people, and I'm afraid I am in the latter camp."

https://popculture.com/tv-shows/news/game-of-thrones-charles-dance-would-sign-petition-remake-final-season/

[ThotKiller]

On 8/16/2020 at 2:24 AM, SeanF said:

Season 8, Episode 3, was crucial.  It turned casual viewers against the show.  With a vast budget, it ought to be possible to create a decent battle scene.  The fact that it was so hard to see what was happening was unforgivable (leaving aside the stupid military tactics).

Indeed. I remember my non-book readers friends, like before that episode they were comparing the night king with thanos, they're said the battle would be better than lord of the rings, they're expecting a epic sword fight betwen The hound and Brienne and the white walkers ala tower of joy and all that you know... And after... they were so fucking mad about the show... they're ranting about everything "What kinda monkey make Cersei the final villan" 

But i think the crucial moment that turned everyone was in ep 4 when Cersei have 20 balistas that could easly kill dany and her dragon and win the damn war...But no she decided to kill missandei. and let Dany walk away

[SeanF]

2 hours ago, ThotKiller said:

Lord Tywin became my favorite

"Well if there was a petition, I would sign it."

"I mean, I saw it. I continue to watch the whole series even after I'd been killed off in the lavatory," Dance laughed. "Because I just thought it's a fantastic television show, you know? I was very lucky to be part of it. I loved it; there were storylines [where] I wanted to know what was going to happen to these people! I know that the finale satisfied a lot of people. It also disappointed a lot of people, and I'm afraid I am in the latter camp."

https://popculture.com/tv-shows/news/game-of-thrones-charles-dance-would-sign-petition-remake-final-season/

Good for him.  I see Nicolai Koster Waldau would sign it too.

[Angel Eyes]

14 hours ago, SeanF said:

Good for him.  I see Nicolai Koster Waldau would sign it too.

And Lena Headey.

https://www.denofgeek.com/tv/game-of-thrones-lena-headey-disappointed-with-cersei-death/

(this article is one of a few).

[Count Balerion]

Eeeenteresting. Although he does say nice things about the Ds. I guess the actors can't straight-out trash them, non-disclosure and whatnot. Not to mention airing dirty laundry, and the show wasn't so bad when Tywin was alive.

 

[Count Balerion]

Season 1: This looks cool. What's going on? What's a Targarian?

Season 2: This looks cool. What's going on? I guess I'd better read these books. Oh. But why did they do that weird stuff to Dany? Why is Robb a jerk? Why have Jaime kill that chap?

Season 3: This is pretty good!

Season 4: This is pretty good. BUT ....

Season 5: This is pretty goo ... Sansa going to Winterfell doesn't make sense, but there'll probably be a payoff ... oh, there wasn't ... bad WHAT??????? ... oh, come ON!

Season 6: This is less shocking than last season, but that doesn't mean it's GOOD ... Arya's indestructible! ... the North kinda forgot ... Heaven knows I'm the last thing from a military tactician; but come ON! ... R+L! ... well, that sept blowing up was cool and I do like the Targaryen fleet. But bheh.

Season 7: Cool, they're on Dragonstone ... mad Arya confirmed ... wait, Westeros responds to blowing up the sept with a collective shrug? ... this romance is very subtle ... Tyrion is an idiot ... this wight hunt looks cool. So what if it makes no sense; nothing else does, either. Best just look at the pretty stuff. Pretty, pretty, pretty!

Season 8: Maybe this won't be bad ... I can't SEE anything ... they really don't like dialogue, do they? ... oh, come ON! ... Dany will listen to her better ange.... well, this fire is pretty .... wait, WHAT just happened? ... Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!! you just ruined your own show!!!!!! ... may as well watch this last episode, I guess ... they really DON'T like dialogue, do they?

[Count Balerion]

P.S. R+L ended up le grand nada. I actually believe it LESS, now.

[Le Cygne]

TV Moments That "Jumped The Shark" So Badly, People Had To Stop Watching

13. In Game of Thrones, when Daenerys turned evil

https://www.buzzfeed.com/hannahmarder/tv-moments-so-ridiculous-people-stopped-watching

[Le Cygne]

On 8/18/2020 at 3:42 PM, kissdbyfire said:

It was. But really, what wasn’t an epic fail? We can pick from so many! Jon’s resurrection, Jaime not caring, Mean Sandra, Cersei staring out of a window and drinking, Brienne (back in s5) staring out of a window and not drinking, Sansarya fake out, Beric (who?), Pointlessbowl, Ninjarya, the Long Nap, and on and on and on it goes. Massive. Epic. Fails.

Agree. I was responding to the Preston Jacobs video above, I should have quoted that. (It was another video about abandoned plotlines.)

He was making excuses for the show in that video by using a very shallow definition of what is an abandoned plot. To him, it just means it was revisited.

Jon asks at the start of the series, Who am I, and that should have had a profound answer about him on a personal level, since it's about him as a person.

That the payoff was Dany went mad because her boyfriend didn't want to do his aunt is insulting to the audience and to the characters, and has nothing to do with Jon as a person.

Jon as a Targ should have been explored. There should have been entire episodes devoted to him wanting to know everything there is to know about his father.

Feelings he has that are his heritage, pulling him in this direction or that. That is his drama as a human being, and the audience wanted to see that.

THAT is why people say Jon as a Targ was an abandoned plotline. It meant nothing on a deep level at all. Who am I? was answered with a wet fart on the show.

[SeanF]

2 hours ago, Le Cygne said:

TV Moments That "Jumped The Shark" So Badly, People Had To Stop Watching

13. In Game of Thrones, when Daenerys turned evil

https://www.buzzfeed.com/hannahmarder/tv-moments-so-ridiculous-people-stopped-watching

This is where we missed the brilliance of D & D.

We ought to have realised she was evil, from the moment she reacted "coldly" to the death of the brother who had just threatened to cut her unborn child out of her stomach.  Obviously, a normal person would have been defending Viserys in that situation.

[Angel Eyes]

3 hours ago, SeanF said:

This is where we missed the brilliance of D & D.

We ought to have realised she was evil, from the moment she reacted "coldly" to the death of the brother who had just threatened to cut her unborn child out of her stomach.  Obviously, a normal person would have been defending Viserys in that situation.

Depends how one reacts to their sibling threatening to cut out their parts. Wasn't that what Viserys threatened her with?

[SeanF]

3 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

Depends how one reacts to their sibling threatening to cut out their parts. Wasn't that what Viserys threatened her with?

Cutting out her unborn child.

[Hodor the Articulate]

7 hours ago, SeanF said:

This is where we missed the brilliance of D & D.

We ought to have realised she was evil, from the moment she reacted "coldly" to the death of the brother who had just threatened to cut her unborn child out of her stomach.  Obviously, a normal person would have been defending Viserys in that situation.

She should have thanked her abuser. That's what good victims are supposed to do, according to D&D.

[SeanF]

4 hours ago, Hodor the Articulate said:

She should have thanked her abuser. That's what good victims are supposed to do, according to D&D.

She ought to have realised that it made her stronger.

[Angel Eyes]

8 hours ago, SeanF said:

Cutting out her unborn child.

My point is that nobody reacts well to that kind of threat.

[Mystical]

To me the point is that there should have been a reaction visible on her face. Some sort of conflict. Yes Viserys threatened her and her baby, sold her, abused her...yada yada. But he was also the reason she was alive in the first place, he had saved her and kept them going/alive and for better or worse, he was family (the only family she was aware of). Instead there was nothing. Now this was probably more due to Emilia not being the best actress around. But in a scene like that, 'deadpan' doesn't cut it.

[Corvinus85]

At the time when they filmed that scene in season 1, they were probably trying to follow the book more closely. Dany doesn't have a visible reaction in the book either, but we get her internal monologue, and we know her sadness. Between Emilia and the writing, we didn't get that, and D&D, as arrogant as ever, make it sound like that had been the intent all along, a foreshadowing of something they planned. Only they didn't plan it until near the end.