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Do you feel this show had any negative effect on how you view the books?

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Just now, T and A said:

D&D would never make Bran, whom they have butchered and ignored the most in the show, the ruler at the end, if it was not coming from GRRM. 

Do you think if they knew bran would be king for 5 years they wouldn t have handled his story diferently?

I don t think we can conclude anything from D&D story besides the fact that they don t know how to write...

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4 minutes ago, divica said:

Do you think if they knew bran would be king for 5 years they wouldn t have handled his story diferently?

I don t think we can conclude anything from D&D story besides the fact that they don t know how to write...

They knew Dany would turn tyrant for at least as long and did a terrible job on her final twist, so no reason to think they didn't also know about Bran and did the same terrible job with his character. 

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, divica said:

Do you think if they knew bran would be king for 5 years they wouldn t have handled his story diferently?

I don t think we can conclude anything from D&D story besides the fact that they don t know how to write...

That’s a bit unfair. They gave us some great stuff early on in the show, like the Varys and Littlefinger scenes and all the ones with Arya and Tywin.

I’d argue they became bad writers once the went off book entirely.

Edited by sifth

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Just now, divica said:

Do you think if they knew bran would be king for 5 years they wouldn t have handled his story diferently?

I don t think we can conclude anything from D&D story besides the fact that they don t know how to write...

Nope. They wouldn't. They just made Bran King, because GRRM told them to. What you are saying makes even less sense, then D&D's storytelling. If they had choosen to make Bran King in the end, even if GRRM hasn't, this would mean, they like Bran. And then, they would definitively made more out of his story, than what we got. They made Cersei drink Wine and look out of the balcony for two seasons, even though she had no real story since Season  6, just becaue they liked her character and Lena. If they choose to make Bran King in the end (just typing this sentence seems so stupid for me), you would not have him being absent in an entire season, not knowing what his powers are etc. Thinking that D&D choose Bran as a King is really a joke, when it comes to these two guys. 

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Drogon proved the ending will be the same. I think Martin had his ending all along. I don`t think he will ever release those books. He is smart and he knows if he ever deliver an ending it will destroy The World of Ice and Fire. Probably he hate the book, with everyone asking him same question.

 

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4 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

They knew Dany would turn tyrant for at least as long and did a terrible job on her final twist, so no reason to think they didn't also know about Bran and did the same terrible job with his character. 

That is why I prefer to believe they decided to give mostly their own ending and shock the fans. I can t think anyone can be so bad at their job that they planed this ending for years… It doesn t make sense!

5 minutes ago, T and A said:

Nope. They wouldn't. They just made Bran King, because GRRM told them to. What you are saying makes even less sense, then D&D's storytelling. If they had choosen to make Bran King in the end, even if GRRM hasn't, this would mean, they like Bran. And then, they would definitively made more out of his story, than what we got. They made Cersei drink Wine and look out of the balcony for two seasons, even though she had no real story since Season  6, just becaue they liked her character and Lena. If they choose to make Bran King in the end (just typing this sentence seems so stupid for me), you would not have him being absent in an entire season, not knowing what his powers are etc. Thinking that D&D choose Bran as a King is really a joke, when it comes to these two guys. 

Just because bran becomes king doesn t mean they like or dislike him… If it isn t grrm's ending then they just wanted to shock the fans and choose bran because nobody expected him to end up as king. the end...

7 minutes ago, sifth said:

That’s a bit unfair. They gave us some great stuff early on in the show, like the Varys and Littlefinger scenes and all the ones with Arya and Tywin.

I’d argue they became bad writers once the went off book entirely.

The problem is is this season was planed for years then the writing of the show for the last years makes no sense!

If most of the things that happened were planed by them to be original at least it would make sense why they were so porly prepared...

 

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If it had any effect on how I view the books, it is a positive one. I can even more appreciate how good the books are while the show... well...

As for the spoilers, yeah, sure, there were some but it seems to me that a lot of the plottwists were kinda predictable (Cleganebowl, Dany goes mad and dies, Sansa is the head of house Stark, Tyrion is the Hand...), with the exception of Bran becoming the king and Cersei burning the sept (not sure if this is going to happen in the books), so I don't really care and I don't think it ruined the books for me or anything.

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Well, I'm certainly going to look up spoilers before going into any future books. I don't care how how well written it is, I'm def out if Dany is a Mad Queen. I wouldn't care if it were just her dying, but I don't need yet another story about a hysterical woman.

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I will still read the books since I seriously doubt GRRM would do anything like this. Bran being king was just stupid in so many ways and it seems like they wanted to have a tragic hero in jon but have everyone get happy endings at the same time. Seeing sansa get off for all her crimes and betrayl made my stomach hurt.

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Yes, it affected me negatively. My brain understands that GRRM version of this will be much better written and thought, with things like consequences, depth, coherence, gravity, wit and style. But a not so small part of me fear that it will not be enough for the ending. And a increasingly bigger part of me fears we will have no ending at all, with GRRM not finishing the last book.

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I feel the show'd ending has rekindled my interest in Westeros, given me hope that GRRM is what I want from an author and that there is hope for the fantasy genre to break out and also write tragic or bittersweet stories for successful works. I wouldn't want the bad guys to always win any more than I want the good guys to lose or gain phyrric victories, but a mix between them would be good.

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24 minutes ago, divica said:

Just because bran becomes king doesn t mean they like or dislike him… If it isn t grrm's ending then they just wanted to shock the fans and choose bran because nobody expected him to end up as king. the end...

Yeah, sorry, but this is straight out BS and just denial, which is natural, as I could not believe this when I first read the leak either. But no, if they wanted to shock, they would have chosen another one to be ruler, definitively not Bran. Also, they have said, that they will follow GRRM main bullet points. Them being awefull writers, or you not wanting that to be true, doesn't change this fact. Them lying, would lead to GRRM posting this week something...

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2 hours ago, Kajjo said:

He is 9 year old at the beginning. Amazingly enough, he gets older year by year.

 

Bran is 7 in the first book.

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5 minutes ago, T and A said:

Yeah, sorry, but this is straight out BS and just denial, which is natural, as I could not believe this when I first read the leak either. But no, if they wanted to shock, they would have chosen another one to be ruler, definitively not Bran. Also, they have said, that they will follow GRRM main bullet points. Them being awefull writers, or you not wanting that to be true, doesn't change this fact. Them lying, would lead to GRRM posting this week something…

The only other real choices for shock value would be gendry and sansa… They would be equally bad...

And I think grrm will post something comenting the end of GOT. There is a lot of things he must talk about (for exemple the show ending similarly to LOST that he hated)… And him not playing the finale in this theatre might also mean something… 

And we are talking about the people that created the NK or that said the dothriaki were all dead… God only knows what goes in their minds… We need to wait for the post series interviews...

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I suspect full-Targ Dany is going to happen more effectively in the books, so I am not really too concerned about that; I think what we're all worried about now is King Bran.

As I mull it over, the "King Bran the Broken" bit was just D & D's oversimplified version (I know, shocker) of what the bigger implications of what GRRM may have told them. It's also possible that they just completely missed the point.

When I look at it all now, it looks to me that the EndBranGame may actually be that the conclusion of the story involves the final victory for the Children of the Forest. Basically they had two weapons with which to fight man: the WW and. . .prophecy. Since the Children couldn't beat man on the battlefield, they created a WMD, the Others, which man was able to contain by building the Wall. Failing in that, they used the 3ER to make humanity kill itself through commitment to falsified prophecies.

Not sure of all the details and implications, but having man think they "won" and are safe when in actual fact the main agent of the Children sits the throne may be. . kind of interesting? Not sure. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Cas Stark said:

Nor do I really care to find that all of Jon's history and his whole story is largely pointless, he's back to the start, cold and alone in the North.  Same for Arya.  As far as Sansa getting the queenship she always wanted, ugh, to give this character the closest thing to a happy ending, ugh.  Except for of course the author's proxies, Tyrion and Sam who also get happy endings. 

So, I'm much, much less interested in the books from here on out.

If this is GRRM’s ending, he will have trolled us with endless learning to rule chapters for Dany and Jon. What was the point of these chapters for Dany and Jon? Is Bran learning to rule or just getting high on whatever paste he’s being fed. All of GRRM’s talk about Aragorn’s tax policy is moot. Is he going to show Bran’s tax policy? And what would a 10-11 (assuming that’s his age in the last book) year old know about tax policy? Oh I forgot, he’s a child prodigy, a genius. 

If GRRM ends his books the same way as in the show, then his definition of bittersweet is very different from Tolkien’s version. I can appreciate Ned and Robb’s deaths as necessary but killing/ exiling the central characters on whom pages were devoted to show them grow as leaders is completely bitter. So Jon is the most self-sacrificing and morally upright character in the books, but he gets treated like a criminal in the end. To me that is nihilistic and terribly cynical. And all to be different and subversive. 

Edited by teej6

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29 minutes ago, Saturno said:

Yes, it affected me negatively. My brain understands that GRRM version of this will be much better written and thought, with things like consequences, depth, coherence, gravity, wit and style. But a not so small part of me fear that it will not be enough for the ending. And a increasingly bigger part of me fears we will have no ending at all, with GRRM not finishing the last book.

Well, that's what separates good writers from bad, isn't it?  Tragic characters -- from Hamlet up through Walter White -- are nothing new, It's the journey, not the destination that matters, and even if you KNOW things are going to end badly for your favorite character, going along for the ride and identifying all the places where they could have made different, better choices -- or couldn't do anything different for that matter -- is part of the fun.

Disney endings get boring after a while.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Hodor the Articulate said:

Well, I'm certainly going to look up spoilers before going into any future books. I don't care how how well written it is, I'm def out if Dany is a Mad Queen. I wouldn't care if it were just her dying, but I don't need yet another story about a hysterical woman.

I accepted years ago that she will die at the end. But her going mad is just too tragic and devastating for me and makes her struggles completely pointless. Obviously GRRM will build that up very differently than whatever the fuck it was we saw on this show, but still...

what is supposed to be the message here? "doesn't matter how much of a good heart you have, if your daddy was crazy you will be too"?

Edited by Nami

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