UK Politics: Black Lives Matter Here Too

[A Horse Named Stranger]

Curious, after all his years as biggot leader of a racist movement and party, now they decided to fire him? First NASCAR banning confederate falgs, now Nigel losing his LBC gig, racists just can't get a break these days.

[Derfel Cadarn]

6 minutes ago, Raja said:

I'd imagine someone will pick Farage up sooner rather than later.

Aliens, hopefully.

[Denvek]

I'd completely forgotten about the statue of Baden-Powell, and I live in the town where it is. It's not a major landmark, and it's only been there since 2008 (the centenary of the Scouting movement). I don't have any strong feelings one way or the other about it's removal - he doesn't seem to be as problematic as his contemporary Rhodes, but if the council decide not to put it back afterwards, that's fine. Put up some other commemoration of the Scouting movement that's about Scouts in general rather than a particular person.

[john]

57 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Curious, after all his years as biggot leader of a racist movement and party, now they decided to fire him? First NASCAR banning confederate falgs, now Nigel losing his LBC gig, racists just can't get a break these days.

The comments which appear to have been the last straw (comparing BLM protestors to the Taliban) were made on Piers Morgan’s show. Takes an arsehole to catch an arsehole I guess.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

17 minutes ago, john said:

The comments which appear to have been the last straw (comparing BLM protestors to the Taliban) were made on Piers Morgan’s show. Takes an arsehole to catch an arsehole I guess.

Catching is overselling it quite a bit. I mean, his racist bigotry has been out in the open for like forever. Him being racist has to be on the same level of news as the KKK not supporting BLM. But if those comments really broke the camels back, that is funny tho.

[williamjm]

I saw on the news today that the Scottish R number has decreased, and it looks like the number of new cases is under 20 today which sounds promising in terms of getting the coronavirus under control.

For most of the crisis the numbers in Scotland seemed to have been roughly comparable to the UK as a whole (adjusting for population) but they seem to be significantly better now. The UK numbers are steadily improving but over 1000 cases a day is still a lot. At least there doesn't seem any obvious sign yet of the loosening of restrictions causing an increase in cases.

Meanwhile, the Isle of Man has become the first part of the British Isles to be free of coronavirus and are removing most of their restrictions.

24 minutes ago, john said:

The comments which appear to have been the last straw (comparing BLM protestors to the Taliban) were made on Piers Morgan’s show. Takes an arsehole to catch an arsehole I guess.

It takes a special talent to be the most obnoxious person in the room when Piers Morgan is also there.

 

[Derfel Cadarn]

https://www.channel4.com/news/nigel-farage-ukip-letter-school-concerns-racism-fascism

Channel 4 have seen letters from Farage’s school - apparently he would sing Hitler Youth songs in the village.

[Maltaran]

48 minutes ago, williamjm said:

 

Meanwhile, the Isle of Man has become the first part of the British Isles to be free of coronavirus and are removing most of their restrictions.

 

Incorrect - Alderney has had zero cases.

[Hereward]

On 6/10/2020 at 12:35 PM, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Oh, FFS. I asked how he could've done worse policy wise than Johnson, likesay during the corona crisis. And all I get is election slogans? I must say, I am deeply disappointed in your fabulous amount of imagination. Same with the EU negotiations, that have been going nowhere, are going nowhere, and are headed for no-deal with the UK goverment not triggering the extension. I know, for one boarder that is awesome, judging from your post, I assume, you're not part of the crazed Brexit crowd. So how could Corbyn (or whoever he would've sent there) done worse?

He wanted to abolish the military? Ok, fine, how would he have gone around it? Would he have sent a corona infected Milne on a tour through all the army baracks, to take out the military by himself. Would momentum kids ride UK tanks through trafalgar square, before dumping them into Thamse in celebration? Like I said, I lack imagination. So you were supposed to provide me with the details. He shared Johnson's vision on the EU? Fine, let's assume for a second that Johnson has a view on anything otehr than the he should be PM for reasons. He would still have a more remain party to pacify instead of that lil troll Cummings. The Putin support? I was lead to believe Johnson and Cummings are doing his bidding right now. I am not saying that Corbyn was a good choice, because he obviously wasn't. I just fail to see, how he could've done worse than Johnson and his motley crew.

You can have another go. But please, come up with something better than the slogans Tories tell their kids at the fire on a camping trip to scare them.

It’s offensive to portray me as a moron circulating Tory election slogans. I apologise if my throwaway comment about you lacking imagination upset you. That was not my intention. I did not, and never will, vote for Johnson, and as you suggest, I didn’t vote for Brexit either. I’m not going to put a disclaimer in everything I post, I got bored enough with that before I left five years ago.

However, I have followed Corbyn’s “career” since the early 80s and I will not give him a pass on his utter lack of leadership, for which I’m actually quite grateful, or his stupid and anti-British policies. Commenting that he never would have been able to implement them is irrelevant in judging his preferences. It’s like giving Trump a pass because he’s too incompetent to get all of his prejudices implemented in law.

It seems to me that you’re arguing with me from an almost Arakan-like sense of moral superiority. If so, I’m sorry that my patriotism offends you. I get that Germans regard it as abhorrent, though as a German speaker, you shouldn’t be surprised at what gets said when (mainly southern) Germans think an Englishman doesn’t know what they’re saying. But the people who defeated the Nazis also, mainly, fought for patriotism, not other abstract political concepts. As such, I don’t regard it as akin, in itself, to Nazism and it would be good if others didn’t do so. 

[Derfel Cadarn]

https://twitter.com/mrjohnofarrell/status/1271006872976457729?s=21

Apparently Farage also shouted “To the gas chambers” and “Hitler was right” to a Jewish pupil while at school

[A Horse Named Stranger]

59 minutes ago, Hereward said:

It’s offensive to portray me as a moron circulating Tory election slogans. I apologise if my throwaway comment about you lacking imagination upset you. That was not my intention. I did not, and never will, vote for Johnson, and as you suggest, I didn’t vote for Brexit either. I’m not going to put a disclaimer in everything I post, I got bored enough with that before I left five years ago.

However, I have followed Corbyn’s “career” since the early 80s and I will not give him a pass on his utter lack of leadership, for which I’m actually quite grateful, or his stupid and anti-British policies. Commenting that he never would have been able to implement them is irrelevant in judging his preferences. It’s like giving Trump a pass because he’s too incompetent to get all of his prejudices implemented in law.

It seems to me that you’re arguing with me from an almost Arakan-like sense of moral superiority. If so, I’m sorry that my patriotism offends you. I get that Germans regard it as abhorrent, though as a German speaker, you shouldn’t be surprised at what gets said when (mainly southern) Germans think an Englishman doesn’t know what they’re saying. But the people who defeated the Nazis also, mainly, fought for patriotism, not other abstract political concepts. As such, I don’t regard it as akin, in itself, to Nazism and it would be good if others didn’t do so. 

Ok, let's go thru this.

I responded to that post in the fashion it merited. I am not saying you are a moron, I am saying it was a pretty moronic post, without substance and just Tory slogans about the Corbyn boogeyman.

My original point before that was, that HMG under PM Johnson has performed so abysmal, that one's imagination would be hard pressed how (even) Corbyn could've performed worse. I mean it was just atrocious. From the PM bragging about visiting and shaking hands with COVID patients without protection (and him subsequently falling severely ill), naming the acquisition of ventilators operation last gasp, to his puppet master, pardon advisor, catching covid, disregarding HMG very own guidelines regarding self-isolation, taking his wife to beauty spot, topped with a pretty ridiculous news conference of afore mentioned advisor, and HMG going out of their way to defend him by throwing their previous policy out of the window - including members of HMG explaining with a straight face, that driving is a safe way to test, whether one's eye sight is good enough to drive. That is simply a pretty indefensible record on its face, and it'S really hard to imagine how anybody (including Corbyn) could've done worse. And if you response is basically, Corbyn is worse, he is as bad as Johnson, he is in Putin's pocket, he wants to abolish the military, then that's not a particularly well thought out argument. I am truely sorry, if you thought otherwise, but it simply wasn't. I mean, the only way that could've been worse objectively would pretty much be getting infected on purpose, and ordering his policy guy to visit nursing homes while being infected with COVID. But that's the difference between gross neglience and deliberate action.

Yes, Corbyn is a moron, and would've been a deeply flawed PM, but to again just say, he would've been worse than Johnson, is not doing justice to the Premiership of Johnson - thus far (for better or worse).

Moral superiority? Please, I am strong proponent of moral relativism. Whether the UK was motivated by patriotism to defeat Nazi Germany, or whether it was fueled by a mere will to survive and beat the aggressors, at the end of the day, I don't really care what fueled the British war effort, all I care for the Nazis were defeated. But for most parts, I share Oscar Wilde's view on patriotism, I am not denying that.

[Hereward]

33 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Ok, let's go thru this.

I responded to that post in the fashion it merited. I am not saying you are a moron, I am saying it was a pretty moronic post, without substance and just Tory slogans about the Corbyn boogeyman.

My original point before that was, that HMG under PM Johnson has performed so abysmal, that one's imagination would be hard pressed how (even) Corbyn could've performed worse. I mean it was just atrocious. From the PM bragging about visiting and shaking hands with COVID patients without protection (and him subsequently falling severely ill), naming the acquisition of ventilators operation last gasp, to his puppet master, pardon advisor, catching covid, disregarding HMG very own guidelines regarding self-isolation, taking his wife to beauty spot, topped with a pretty ridiculous news conference of afore mentioned advisor, and HMG going out of their way to defend him by throwing their previous policy out of the window - including members of HMG explaining with a straight face, that driving is a safe way to test, whether one's eye sight is good enough to drive. That is simply a pretty indefensible record on its face, and it'S really hard to imagine how anybody (including Corbyn) could've done worse. And if you response is basically, Corbyn is worse, he is as bad as Johnson, he is in Putin's pocket, he wants to abolish the military, then that's not a particularly well thought out argument. I am truely sorry, if you thought otherwise, but it simply wasn't. I mean, the only way that could've been worse objectively would pretty much be getting infected on purpose, and ordering his policy guy to visit nursing homes while being infected with COVID. But that's the difference between gross neglience and deliberate action.

Yes, Corbyn is a moron, and would've been a deeply flawed PM, but to again just say, he would've been worse than Johnson, is not doing justice to the Premiership of Johnson - thus far (for better or worse).

I was not mindlessly repeating Tory slogans about Corbyn. As I said, I have closely followed Corbyn’s career for nigh on 40 years and as such, I’m more than capable of making up my own mind about his intellectual abilities, organisational skills and worrying allegiances. In fact, the idea that an electorate can be convinced of his failings on these things in the face of evidence to the contrary is itself stupid.

Johnson’s performance has been laughably inept. His deficiencies in organisation, honesty and consistency have been amply demonstrated. He has made this country a laughing stock, only saved from utter humiliation by comparison to Trump’s America.
 

But, that does not mean Corbyn would have been better. My moronic argument is that the organisational abilities of the man that Johnson beat like a gong, a man who attends demonstrations against himself, a man incapable of even controlling his own office, and a man whose extreme distrust of all capitalistic and imperialistic structures, e.g all Western governments, mean that I think it highly unlikely he would even have contemplated a lockdown, even two weeks too late, suggest to me that, however crap Johnson has been, Corbyn would have been even worse. 

[OldGimletEye]

31 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

I am strong proponent of moral relativism. Whether the UK was motivated by patriotism to defeat Nazi Germany, or whether it was fueled by a mere will to survive and beat the aggressors, at the end of the day, I don't really care what fueled the British war effort, all I care for the Nazis were defeated. But for most parts, I share Oscar Wilde's view on patriotism, I am not denying that.

The wiring in my brain housing group is starting to smoke. Something does not compute. How does on be a "strong proponent" of moral relativism, but then desperately want Nazi's to be defeated?

[Spockydog]

1 hour ago, Hereward said:

But, that does not mean Corbyn would have been better.

Well, he certainly wouldn't have abdicated responsibility for the running the country to a dingbat like Dominic Cummings.

 

[Chaircat Meow]

16 minutes ago, Spockydog said:

Well, he certainly wouldn't have abdicated responsibility for the running the country to a dingbat like Dominic Cummings.

 

Yeah, his dingbat was called Seamus Milne. 

[maarsen]

6 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Aliens, hopefully.

Can we hope for extra anal probes?

[maarsen]

11 hours ago, Heartofice said:

Removal of the statue doesn’t touch any of the issues affecting minorities right now. It is an obviously empty gesture.

It may be an empty gesture, but as empty gestures go it is one of the best.

[polishgenius]

Ladies and gentlemen; The Sun.


Legitimately one of the worst headlines and front page stories I've ever seen.

[The Marquis de Leech]

I can't help but wonder if a century hence, social values will have altered such that today's monuments are considered morally reprehensible. Tearing down statues of important arseholes is almost the ultimate expression of Whig History.

(I live in a country where half the country is basically named after British historical people and places. We've got towns named Cromwell, Naseby, Nelson, Palmerston, Picton, Blenheim, Napier, Hastings, Alexandra, and, of course, Wellington. My home city has George, Frederick, Hanover, King Edward, and Prince Albert Streets, and I actually used to work on the intersection of Cumberland and Stuart Streets. If we were starting from scratch, would any of those names be used? No. But we're not starting from scratch, and the History that shapes us all isn't supposed to accord with 2020 values, any more than 2020 abides by 2520 values).    

[Heartofice]

I have to wonder who thinks removing episodes or Fawlty Towers, Mighty Boosh and League of Gentlemen was a good idea.