Videogames: New Year, New Thread

[Derfel Cadarn]

4 hours ago, IlyaP said:

Tell them to load up Freelancer instead. It's more fun and it's, y'know - real. 

So is Elite Dangerous, and the PC version released a (buggy) first person expansion 

[Toth]

34 minutes ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

So is Elite Dangerous, and the PC version released a (buggy) first person expansion 

Or X4, which has everything including empire building, just minus the multiplayer.

[IlyaP]

26 minutes ago, Toth said:

Or X4, which has everything including empire building, just minus the multiplayer.

X4 Foundations? 

[Toth]

21 minutes ago, IlyaP said:

X4 Foundations? 

Yeah! What else did you think?

[IlyaP]

11 minutes ago, Toth said:

Yeah! What else did you think?

Steam gave me multiple options when I typed in X4 (and I am very unfamiliar with the series).

[Toth]

33 minutes ago, IlyaP said:

Steam gave me multiple options when I typed in X4 (and I am very unfamiliar with the series).

Mmh, just tried it and the first six hits are X4 and its DLCs, the other hits seem to be four-wheel drive racing games.

I can only massively recommend the X-series as a massively ambitious, if a bit overwhelming, space sandbox. The general idea is that it is very heavy on the economic simulation side. There are space stations everywhere that consume resources to create more advanced resources in production chains that lead all the way to the components that ships are being made of. Essentially every single ship needs to be produced and the AI empires build and deconstruct space stations according to supply and demand, with the player in the position to wedge themselves in, build their own space stations make money out of profitable shortages. All to fund getting ever more ships to try out/defend your properties with/dive into missions fighting the various threats or join in the conflicts within the various species. You can also walk around everywhere afoot in ships and space stations and there are now abandoned satellites with loot that you have to explore in your space suit. Admittedly, it doesn't have a shooter part or explorable planet surfaces either, but that's really beyond the point when you can just stand up, look out the window and watch the universe busily buzz on without you.

 

[Werthead]

I did enjoy X: Beyond the Frontier when it came out in 1999, but have bounced off most of the sequels. It feels like they kind of wanted to do everything so ended up being jack of all trades but masters of none: there are better empire-builders, better space sims and better space combat games, but it's hard to ignore the fact that there's almost nobody else trying to do all three at once.

I remember X3: Reunion being the closest to being really good across the board (despite some horrendous launch bugs). I never played X3's reboot/standalone expansion Terran Conflict, which seems widely regarded as the pinnacle of the series and still widely played today, thanks to an extensive modding scene. Rebirth was infamously fucked on release and they never really fixed it, and it sounds like X4 is pretty solid but you have to do an immense amount of the work to enjoy the game yourself (which some people will love and some people will bounce off hard).

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This game is just never coming out, is it? Or its Squadron 42 (?) spin-off. 

Lots of frustration here because Squadron 42 was apparently at one point almost done: Erin Roberts having much better experience of finishing and shipping polished, complete games; I still consider Starlancer to be an immensely superior game to his brother's parallel project, Freelancer. Chris Roberts decreed that the game had to work as an example of what Star Citizen itself was going to do, including FPS sections, so they had to go back and insert all these awkward FPS sequences into Squadron 42. And it appears that FPS system they are using is really, really bad, and transitioning from space combat to FPS is awkward as fuck, not to mention that they seem to have not really bothered asking people if they even want to mix those two, very different genres into the same game.

[Toth]

1 hour ago, Werthead said:

I did enjoy X: Beyond the Frontier when it came out in 1999, but have bounced off most of the sequels. It feels like they kind of wanted to do everything so ended up being jack of all trades but masters of none: there are better empire-builders, better space sims and better space combat games, but it's hard to ignore the fact that there's almost nobody else trying to do all three at once.

I remember X3: Reunion being the closest to being really good across the board (despite some horrendous launch bugs). I never played X3's reboot/standalone expansion Terran Conflict, which seems widely regarded as the pinnacle of the series and still widely played today, thanks to an extensive modding scene. Rebirth was infamously fucked on release and they never really fixed it, and it sounds like X4 is pretty solid but you have to do an immense amount of the work to enjoy the game yourself (which some people will love and some people will bounce off hard).

I wonder whether you are saying that because I'm one of the people who had sunk far more time into X3: Terran Conflict than in any other X series game and mentioned such before here, but I feel like that's more the result of me lacking in time nowadays. From the fans I get the impression Albion Prelude is more loved because it is the last standalone X3 expansion, having everything Terran Conflict has, but with a slightly larger world, a stock exchange and more focus on the player headquarters.

X1 is a fun survival space sim because you start with basically nothing and have to scrounge together every penny you can get your hands on to improve your one ship and get the means to advance through the story of being a stranded Terran test pilot in a strange galaxy. Never played X-Tension though, which did allow you to buy and control all the ships of the other species.

X2 was my entry into the series and truly shines as that ludicrous sandbox where you fly around, advance your reputation and build your economic empire. The downside is that, at least I, never managed to get through the horribly bugged story missions, since allies' AI kept breaking and crashing against jump gates during cut scenes.

X3 Reunion I actually never played, but it does set the foundation of Terran Conflict and Albion Prelude, so as bugged and rough as it is, it has the exact same mechanics and motivation spiral and crisp graphics. I guess it's also important as the conclusion of the story that started with X1, with Earth finally being found in the end.

X3 Terran Conflict... just superb. So much stuff to do. Buying a far out of your league ship in horrible condition with all systems stripped on the used market and then repair and outfit it on the side while you make your first steps has still been one of my favourite early game pastimes in X3 and I'm somewhat iffed they removed used ship sales in X4. The Terrans are from a story perspective a terrific faction, if only for the relatively rare trope of having the Terrans be that technologically far superior xenophobic isolationistic faction that is almost entirely stuck in the ludicrously densely populated solar system and that is hard to gain the trust of. But once you do and you get access to their pointedly overpowered ships with matter/anti-matter warheads and miniature blackhole generators and just casually shred everything the game throws at you, it's satisfying as hell. If you can prevent their economy from collapsing that is... Terran Conflict also introduces the ability of a myriad different starting conditions, with most only unlocked through achievements on other characters, drastically increasing replay value.

X3 Albion Prelude I did not play, mostly because it is almost the exact same game as Terran Conflict and also because I have yet to see someone explain to me how the war between the Argons and the Terrans makes any sense and why I still am supposed to regard the Argons as the good guys after the shit they pulled there.

X - Rebirth isn't as bugged anymore as it was to release, Egosoft is thorough in their fixing, but goddamn it's an awkward game that tries hard to go back to the roots of X1, given that it's more story-driven and you are stuck on your one ship. But after being spoiled by being able to own and fly everything you can see, the fans naturally hated that. I guess Rebirth in the end was necessary to test the engine for the first person exploration elements of X4 and to see what works and what doesn't.

X4 is then the product of that, combining the new gameplay features of Rebirth with the vastness and 'do whatever the heck you want' attitude of X3, but in the process pretty much completely dropping any attempt at telling a story. There are far, far, far less questlines hidden in there than in Terran Conflict and some of them are truly a bitch to find, with the game far preferring to stick solely to the randomized missions to get you cash (and being far more profitable in that than X3 ever was). Then again, the story quests in Terran Conflict also had the habit of constantly asking for absolutely painful amounts of rare stuff that you then had to set up production chains for and produce yourself in order to have any chance of getting them done in the ludicrously tight timelimits.

 

Meanwhile I did a stupid desire buy again. Because of my recent dive into the Tron universe I ended up getting myself Tron 2.0. I had heard quite the glowing reviews for it back in the day and the game... indeed does hold up astonishingly well. In some parts that is. The graphics are still to this day absolutely gorgeous (though the typical Tron neon lights do burn in the eyes after a few hours XD) and the identity disc as the main weapon is quite fun. You can let it bounce on the walls to catch enemies behind cover and you can (very slightly and very awkwardly) steer it in the air by holding the left mouse button pressed. With the right mouse button you can recall the disc for quick succession throws. I'm a bit bummed that you can't throw your disk behind someone and use the recall function to frag them from behind, unfortunately the disk then just harmlessly flies through them without registering as a hit.

Unfortunately that really slick disc gameplay is somewhat hampered by the game never really putting you into duels,  always against at least two foes instead, if not more, making it impossible to stand in the open and time your attacks with your blocks as they instead constantly gang up on you. So instead you spend most of the game covering behind some boxes, carefully nudging out of cover to throw one disk before throwing yourself back into cover. Not to mention that the game features a stealth skill that makes you generate less noise when sneaking around, but it's utterly useless because all enemies can spot you from 300 meters afar and snipe at you with stupendous precision. And due to sometimes quite vertical level design I have had it happen to me quite often that I enter a new area and get instantly sniped from somewhere above, with no chance to prepare myself.

The story I can't say much to. It's a bit baffling how little the protagonist actually expresses any confusion about being dragged into the computer to fight a virus while the hapless security programs mistake him for the virus and refuse to listen to his reasoning, even though the story starts with Alan (Bruce Boxleitner) getting captured by shadowy figures and Jet initially rushing into laboratory to find him. That seems like a pretty ridiculous sidelining of his initial concerns, especially with his relatively blasé attitude about being in the computer world and just rolling with whatever goes on. In a way it is really game-y, with the story mostly being told through breadcrumps of E-Mails littered all around the place. E-Mails that conveniently also tell you that Kevin Flynn has grown obsessed with the computer world before disappearing without a trace, alongside Tron. I get why many fans say that the story is still oddly compatible with Tron Legacy all these years later.

[Ran]

Never played Starlancer, but I loved Freelancer, personally. The atmosphere that the game managed was, for me, pretty memorable, and the art design was strong. Cruising through debris fields in the midst of vast dust and ice clouds could be spooky.

The mouse-focused gameplay was not my favorite, and made the game a bit more arcade-y, but I understood the purpose behind it.

Also, Freelancer was very modifiable and its multi-user servers were pretty great. 

Freelancer did not, of course, get all the things Roberts was aiming for -- it was not a dynamic, changing universe at all -- but for what it was, it was very enjoyable. I find myself gravitating more towards that sort of the game, where you're a trader-mercenary deciding where you go and what you do, than the more linear military campaign games, when it comes to replayability.

 

[Derfel Cadarn]

Starlancer was very good, not revolutionary but polished and fun. I remember one mission where my carrier and an enemy carroer were going toe to toe, launching torpedo broadsides while fighters and bombers had a dogfight between them. Had to balance taking out their fighters to protect my bombers and torpedoes, take out their torpedoes, to ensure their carrier dies before mine.

The box-art was awful, like something from the 16-bit days. No wonder it never sold.

Anyone play X-tension, the sequel/expansion to X-Beyond the Frontier? Seemedtk be a very low-key release, my local shop sold it as CD case only, no box. Was a big imprpvement over X as it allowed you to fly other ships and even leave your ship in a space suit. Unfortunately I never had time to really play it.

The X soubdtrakc was good, this was back when some fanes (like X-Wing V Tiefighter) had their soundtracks saved as mp3 so if you put the game disk in a CD player, it would olay the music. Wierdly, the one track I ripped and still have calls itself Redemption’s Son by Joseph Arthur, and even has that song’s image.

[Werthead]

3 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Starlancer was very good, not revolutionary but polished and fun. I remember one mission where my carrier and an enemy carroer were going toe to toe, launching torpedo broadsides while fighters and bombers had a dogfight between them. Had to balance taking out their fighters to protect my bombers and torpedoes, take out their torpedoes, to ensure their carrier dies before mine.

The battles in Starlancer could get hugely epic and impressive very quickly. That battle, between the Yamato and Pukov IIRC, was the outstanding engagement of the game, with you having to dive between enemy torpedoes and fighters and take them out before the Yamato goes down.

It wasn't quite as good as Freespace 2 or TIE Fighter but it wasn't far off. It's biggest problem was the cliffhanger ending which was meant to lead into the sequel, but poor sales meant it never got made. You had to piece together the interim story from Freelancer, which was set centuries later so there wasn't a ton of information on what happened inbetween.

[horangi]

20 hours ago, RumHam said:

That's insane. Are we sure they're not secretly building an actual spaceship? 

For that amount of money after ten years I'd just hire someone competent to make the game and walk away. 

Actually development on the Falcon 9 started the same year as Star Citizen (2010) and cost about 100 million less, assuming all the money that RSI pocketed is spent.  So yeah, not an entirely unreasonable expectation.  Something tells me that $20 investment in the game back in 2016 isnt going to pay off.

[Werthead]

Finished Fallen Order, a good game that could have been great if it hadn't been quite so janky and repetitive. I hope they build on the good bits in the sequel and drop the elements that didn't work.

Started Iron Harvest, which is a solid RTS let down by trying very, very hard to be Company of Heroes but not being anywhere near as good. That isn't a huge criticism (when Relic couldn't even make the two actual CoH sequels as good as the original), and the "maybe I should just replay CoH" argument is taken care of by Iron Harvest's stonking great big war mechs, which are a lot of fun.

[aceluby]

1 hour ago, Werthead said:

Finished Fallen Order, a good game that could have been great if it hadn't been quite so janky and repetitive. I hope they build on the good bits in the sequel and drop the elements that didn't 

This was one of my favorite games in the last few years. I think this would have been amazing game if they dropped the sliding bits, had more BIG boss battles, the lightsaber wielders were less prominent, but more difficult, and the stuff you picked up would actually help you. Other than that, I thought the game was probably the best Star Wars game since Rogue Squadron. The parry window was fairly forgiving and the force powers were a lot of fun. I also liked the metroidvania style. It’s a game that needed a bit more polish, but hit all the right notes for me

[Mexal]

On 2/4/2022 at 9:50 AM, Fez said:

Yeah, that's the curse of indie games (though honestly AAA games too these days). Different genre but I've had my eye on Last Epoch for almost 3 years now. But I've been burned by early access too many times, I don't touch games until they release.

It's really good and very polished considering it's Early Access. I've put quite a fair number of hours into it. 

[Ramsay B.]

I finally took my Oculus out and decided to use it. I’m a total VR noob as I never played anything before. I tried Vader Immortal ep 1, and it’s really short but cool as hell. It was seriously kind of intimidating the first time Vader makes his appearance and walks up to you. He’s huge.

Anyone have any recommendations? I was gonna get Resident Evil 4. That could be an intense one(loved the original).

[KingintheNorth4]

Playing Warframe, and the spy mission on Lua involving the time rifts has me totally confused. 

[IlyaP]

21 hours ago, Werthead said:

I still consider Starlancer to be an immensely superior game to his brother's parallel project, Freelancer. 

I managed to find a copy of Starlancer, Wert. Did you play it on a modern system? I'm getting a mixture of crackly audio, extreme color banding, and no mouse control whatsoever - on my Windows 10 system. 

[Ran]

1 hour ago, IlyaP said:

I managed to find a copy of Starlancer, Wert. Did you play it on a modern system? I'm getting a mixture of crackly audio, extreme color banding, and no mouse control whatsoever - on my Windows 10 system. 

This may help.

Looking at gameplay footage of Starlancer, it's a very dark and grimey sort of space shooter. Reminds me of FreeSpace a bit in that regard. Freelancer is a bit brighter.

 

[Darryk]

Well I was finally getting really into CIV VI but then had to stop cause my PC was crashing from overheating. Now I've got a new CPU fan (and I got a SSD installed at the same time, damn it makes a huge difference) I can hopefully get back into it.

In the meantime I tried playing War for the Overworld and I was kind of disappointed. I far prefer Dungeons 3 as a homage to the old Dungeon Keeper games.