Twitter 2: Tweet harder

[Varysblackfyre321]

2 hours ago, Heartofice said:

The issue for many on the left

Dude, the person who declared West in this particular thread can’t be a nazi because black appears to be on the right socially and politically(if not I stand to be corrected and apologize) and we’re mainly discussing Kanye because a right wing billionaire let him back on twitter.

Can you not immediately try to move the discussion to what’s wrong with the left?

[Derfel Cadarn]

If Musk’s management of Twitter has shown anything, no one shoukd go to Mars with him. He’d be withdrawing oxygen, food and water privileges on a whim

[Week]

8 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

Can you not immediately try to move the discussion to what’s wrong with the left?

The issue for many on 'the Right' is that their parties support, espouse, and provide cover for racism, misogyny, and bigotry to the point of violence. A problem that is orders of magnitude greater than whatever 'the Right' is whining about.

[JGP]

33 minutes ago, DMC said:

I feel like naming a social media site endeavoring to replace Twitter "Hive" is meant to be ironic.

Mastodon is too siloed, and there are moderation issues [on some servers] From what I've seen without diving, looks like it might be trying to be a safeplace for white civility popo. 

I'll wait for Jibberjabber, or Yipyapp. 

 

edit: Looks like Bouzy is floating an alternative via Bot Sentinel. 

[Tywin et al.]

14 minutes ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

If Musk’s management of Twitter has shown anything, no one shoukd go to Mars with him. He’d be withdrawing oxygen, food and water privileges on a whim

Let's be honest about this, the first trip is probably a one way. Let Elon lead it, just don't put any of your family onboard unless they really want to go.

[DMC]

16 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Let's be honest about this, the first trip is probably a one way. Let Elon lead it, just don't put any of your family onboard unless they really want to go.

I was figuring we just send him to Mars by himself like the boys sent Willzyx to the moon in South Park.

 

[JGP]

Going well on the business front though!

[mormont]

2 hours ago, Ormond said:

Concepts like "privilege" shouldn't be seen as binary but on a continuum.

I don't want to get too far into this, but I would go further and say privilege isn't binary or a continuum, but a multi-valent situation - various forms of social privileges, economic privileges, political privileges and so on, which groups may possess to greater or lesser degrees. My earlier post was simplifying all of that into a package of privileges known as 'white privilege', some of which, in a modern US context, are to a degree shared by Jewish people (though very recently they were not) and many of which are accessible, as Ty says and I noted earlier, to Jewish people who don't have any obvious indicators of Jewishness (e.g. name). But not to the extent that you can fairly say Jewish people have 'white privilege'.

I agree that some groups who do, now, get 'white privilege' didn't used to. But again, 'white' here is both a shorthand and a social construct. The boundaries can be changed, and frequently are.

I'm a 50 year old professional straight white cis male. That is the exemplar of what would generally be termed 'white privilege'. I've got all the privilege available in Western society, pretty much. And from that perspective, it's all the more important to perceive it. So many folks who share my characteristics are blind to it. Twitter in particular is full of them, Elon Musk among that number. It's almost impossible to imagine a person with more privilege than he has. But where he should use it to lift up the underprivileged, he instead uses it to inflate his own ego.

[Fragile Bird]

This conversation reminds of the fact that when I was a child the Anglo-Saxons in Toronto did not consider all those new Italian immigrants to be white. They were “Dagos”, which I gather was a typically English slurred version of “Diego”, and included Spanish and Portuguese people.

eta: sorry for wandering so far off the topic of Twitter 

[mormont]

Can we not repeat ethnic slurs, please?

Anyway, my final point is: stuff like this doesn't happen to groups who have white privilege. (CW)

[Ran]

I think we're all adult enough to actually be able to reference words in quotes that have a historical context without finding their very appearance offensive, for the most part. (I say this as one of the people who would have been referred to by said word, and has been referred to with more current related slurs.)

 

 

 

 

[Varysblackfyre321]

4 hours ago, Conflicting Thought said:

a lot of groups that werent considered white are now "accepted" as white...until they arent anymore. whitness is a very fickle concept. 

Yeah. It’s not even contingent on the color white.

Plenty East Asian people have “white” skin and early on European explorers described them as white.

That came about by virtue of  eugenicists categorizing them as yellow in the 19th century.

[Erik of Hazelfield]

2 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

If Musk’s management of Twitter has shown anything, no one shoukd go to Mars with him. He’d be withdrawing oxygen, food and water privileges on a whim

I used to think Elon Musk was cool, back when he stuck to making electric cars and sending rockets to space. As far fetched as his Mars plans were, I thought they were inspiring and thought provoking, in a sort of “yes we can” spirit. Everyone else seemed to come up with reasons why electric cars or reusable rockets couldn’t work - Elon attacked the core of the problem, and succeeded. In hindsight it may have been obvious, but like Columbus and his egg, Musk was the one who actually did it. He also seemed like a fun guy who added references to Spaceballs and David Bowie to his cars and rockets. Sending that Roadster to space was mad and beautiful. 

I mourn the loss of that man. He probably never existed in the first place, but in my mind he did. Now he’s behaving like a clown and a bully, and it seems like a mystery how he could ever have run a successful business. I even sort of hope his Mars plans fail, for the reasons cited. I’d rather stay on a ruined Earth than living under a guy like that on Mars.

[Varysblackfyre321]

3 hours ago, Week said:

The issue for many on 'the Right' is that their parties support, espouse, and provide cover for racism, misogyny, and bigotry to the point of violence. A problem that is orders of magnitude greater than whatever 'the Right' is whining about.

The right uses idpol to obscuate their bigotry?

it’s the left’s fault.

[Varysblackfyre321]

5 minutes ago, Erik of Hazelfield said:

used to think Elon Musk was cool, back when he stuck to making electric cars and sending rockets to space.

It should be said he hired people to do this.

He doesn’t even have a scientific degree and the ones he’s faked was a BA in physics.

He’s not a stupid man but he no more invented cars and rockets than the ceo of Disney invented black panther.

[Ran]

10 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

He doesn’t even have a scientific degree and the ones he’s faked was a BA in physics.

That sounded interesting, so I decided to Google. But per the University of Pennsylvania, he has a BA in Physics and BS in Economics granted in 1997. There seem to be conspiracy theories darkly suggesting nameless "investors" arranged "phony degrees", but at U Penn? It's not some fly-by-night school. 

As far as I understand it, many of the claims being spread come from claims made in a lawsuit (Eberhard v. Musk, 200) that did not go to trial and was settled out of court, so while one supposes the claimant believed their claims they don't automatically prove these claims were accurate.

[Varysblackfyre321]

25 minutes ago, Ran said:

so while one supposes the claimant believed their claims they don't automatically prove these claims were accurate.

Fair enough. It’s still unwise to treat Musk as the personal inventor of rockets and electric cars. He’s no more a rocket scientist, or engineer than the average man. 

[DMC]

The rich kid got a degree from Wharton, right?  Shocker!

[Varysblackfyre321]

So I think it’s likely West eventually just says flat out something to the tune of Hitler good, or Holocaust fake.

If/when that happens do you guys think he’ll suspend/ban Kanye or keep holding on?

[Ormond]

5 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

As someone who is actually Jewish and lives in the US this conversation is groan inducing to say the least. 

Just use "some" as a qualifier. I have blue eyes, dirty blond hair and generally look like I'm Western European and more German than Jewish. Nobody ever bothers me and people tend to be surprised when I tell them I am. However, a lot of my family does look stereotypically Jewish and they catch a lot of L's because of it, especially if they're wearing anything that clearly tells others that they are. And because of anti-Semitism I no longer have my actual last name. My grandfather had to change it because in the late 40's/early 50's nobody would hire Jewish lawyers. Funny how that game flipped.

I hate the whole "our group is not a monolith" line because it should always go without saying. Some people, like myself, can pass as white and nobody would ever know if I didn't volunteer it. Others cannot. 

I just don't get conflating "looking Jewish" in an American context with "looking non-White". Just because one has certain physical characteristics that "look Jewish" or "look Italian" to many people doesn't mean that those people think that means you are not "White". Again, there have always been subcategories within "White" or "Black" or "Asian".  One can be extremely anti-Semitic and still think Jews are White -- they just aren't the best type of "White" to these people.