Dating Thread: In Memoriam

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

5 hours ago, Maithanet said:

Surveys found that the overwhelming reason why married with kids couples have less sex is because of two side effects of having children.  Less alone time where spontaneous sex could occur, and less sleep which reduces the sex drive.  I can't really speak for married couples with no kids, although I would say my wife and I had basically the same amount of sex before and after marriage.  Marriage was not the big change, it was having kids. 

I've always read that men and women just hit their sexual peaks at different times. Men are more horny in their teens to mid 20's and women are in their thirties. Plus relationships tend to have a 18-24 month period where you feel infatuated with one another and then it wears off, hence having to work at it. And then like BFC said people just have different sex drives in general. My ex-fiancé looked into getting medication because she had zero sex drive if I wasn't initiating things.  


Hard pivot, I just found out J's ex died. I don't think she knows cause they're not friends on FB and she just ignores him when he texts (not sure if she said she blocked him or not). I'm going to tell her, but I'm worried she'll take it hard because once we got together she stopped talking to him and I know she's going to think it might be her fault. It's not, but she probably will feel that way knowing her. Not going to be a very fun call. 

ETA: That went better than expected. She appreciated that I told her, was somewhat sad, but more than anything she was relieved. Her biggest fear with him was that he might try to hurt me, her or the little man. J did blame herself a bit, but not as much as I expected. 

 

Edited April 18 by Mr. Chatywin et al.

[Tears of Lys]

7 hours ago, BigFatCoward said:

I'm 47, my getting hotter days are long gone. I can just get less hot more slowly, and hope she ages poorly. 

Balderdash.  47 is definitely not old.  There's tons of guys your age or older who are smokin'.   My husband, for example, is MUCH older than you are, would have women falling all over him if I wasn't in the picture.   

I worry for you, BFC.  That attitude isn't gonna get you anywhere.  

[Madame deVenoge]

5 hours ago, DMC said:

Um..what?  Really don’t get the hostile tone.  I went out of my way to emphasize that “unexamined” stereotype - twice.  And to be clear - the only time I dated grad students was when I was a grad student.  I’ve never dated an administrative assistant.  And no woman has thrown themselves at me in at least 15 years, if ever.

Apologies. I did not intend to sound hostile. I get a little exasperated probably because I just assume that everyone has read the same depressing stuff that is constantly in the news about dating, starting from the book by the OK Cupid founder and the massive troves of data regarding the dating preferences of men vs women to…..(basically, men pay more attention to women the younger they are, with age 18 being prime age for women, to age 51 being the prime age of contact for men on the same dating apps) all the articles in various magazines on those same massive troves of data, which are all of the exact same thing. (Let’s not forget that the more educated a woman is, the more difficult it is for her to find a partner, because men actually prefer non-educated women, while educated men are preferred by women).

And let’s not forget the book by Nancy Jo Sales, which I believe was titled “My Life in the Dating Inferno”. 

Basically, any single woman over the age of 40 is often hit over the head with “you are more likely to get struck by lightning than to marry a man after age 35” and then once one starts to approach the age of 50, well….might as well get three cats, and good thing you’ve got a great career? 

We all get told to “lower our standards” when that is the last thing we need to be doing.

 

[DMC]

5 minutes ago, Madame deVenoge said:

We all get told to “lower our standards” when that is the last thing we need to be doing.

 

Agreed!  If anything my argument here is those high standards should based on education/occupation, not on income.  That’s all I was trying to say.  But of course that’s just a general point.  You do what works for you, cuz clearly it’s working!

[Madame deVenoge]

Well, good people! Since I do not have a ring on my finger, I, while at lunch, attracted the attention of Forestry PE Guy. We chatted about his junior investment banker days at SunTrust. We are going to call him “Trey” because if his name does not have III after it, I would eat my Blahniks. He knew my former CEO at Big Tree, who was his boss at SunTrust back in the day.

Trey is off to play padel, the latest in racquet sports, while I am off to have a glass of wine at the wine bar while my housekeeper finishes up.

I do think that Law Professor is the much better bet, because he is freaking brilliant, has an amazing sense of humor, and Sunday is Date 4, at which I shall finally rip off his clothes….

But since I have not yet ripped off his clothes, nor have we had the exclusivity discussion, I must keep my options open.

[Erik of Hazelfield]

On 4/18/2024 at 10:53 PM, Toth said:

Shit. The conversation from Tuesday has caused my anxiety to flare up again in full force. I'm constantly ruminating that I don't deserve love because I could be incapable of feeling it myself and expressing it in the right way. There is just no hope... I have no concept of love, no reference point on how to feel it and how to express it. Trying to act confident and considerate may just end up hurting someone if I turn out to be incapable of backing it up...

Dude, this happens to all of us, albeit with a slightly different twist. There’s always a risk when you’re dating that one will like the other more. There’s always the possibility that you’ll have to break someone’s heart, or have yours broken, because you’re not both equally into each other. And it sucks, but it’s the only way. You can’t fall in love unless you let go of some control and let yourself be vulnerable. It’s part of the game.

You’re not incapable of love. No one is, except possibly psychopaths, and you’re clearly not one. Don’t fret over this. Of all the things you need to worry about, this is the very last. 

[Madame deVenoge]

55 minutes ago, Erik of Hazelfield said:

Dude, this happens to all of us, albeit with a slightly different twist. There’s always a risk when you’re dating that one will like the other more. There’s always the possibility that you’ll have to break someone’s heart, or have yours broken, because you’re not both equally into each other. And it sucks, but it’s the only way. You can’t fall in love unless you let go of some control and let yourself be vulnerable. It’s part of the game.

You’re not incapable of love. No one is, except possibly psychopaths, and you’re clearly not one. Don’t fret over this. Of all the things you need to worry about, this is the very last. 

100% agreed. I mean, you, Toth, kind of remind me of Werther - probably because you’re German, and I think “echtromantishe” is a word, one that I haven’t spelled correctly, I’m sure, but like, Very Romantic on the Romantic Age sense.
 

But, if you haven’t read “The Sorrows of Young Werther” it is about a young man who falls very much in love with lovely Lotte, and there’s a lot of sighing and words and zero physical interaction, but then I think she is somehow unavailable and he kills himself, and while the moral of the story is “is it better to have loved and lost or never to love at all” (which is So Very Toth, the whole philosophizing of love part) but also I think the book might have been banned because young men were literally harming themselves after reading it.

[mcbigski]

On 4/16/2024 at 12:55 PM, Madame deVenoge said:

Hahahaha!!!! Found that Onion article, where she is also relieved that he is of the same race 

Statistically, a successful relationship is also within 5 years of one’s age. 

The Doctor was 7 years older, which wasn’t a huge issue, for me, and we had both had a lot of the same experiences growing up, but he often got a little tetchy that I was in better shape that he was. That kind of bothered him.

I’ve noticed anything beyond 10 years in either direction can be difficult. Having gone 15 years in both directions….doomed to failure, for me.

Eh.  I wouldn't concern myself at all about age difference.  Five years is basically nothing once you've hit late 20s.

Not that I'm the poster child for stable long term relationships, but...  Dated one woman for 3 years plus who was ten years younger than I was (Started around 38/28).  Age was never an issue.  She pretended to not know what Raiders of the Lost Ark was, but when we actually watched it, it was clear she'd already seen it.  Incompatibilities unrelated to age difference led to the break up. 

Also dated a woman about 19 years younger than me for several years.  Age difference wasn't a deal breaker there either.  There were plenty of things that we had very different views on, but I could say the same for women I've dated my age or older. 

OTOH, a friend of mine married a woman 9 years older than him and they're great together.

If there's mutual interest between consenting adults, then who cares?    

 

On 4/18/2024 at 4:53 PM, Toth said:

Shit. The conversation from Tuesday has caused my anxiety to flare up again in full force. I'm constantly ruminating that I don't deserve love because I could be incapable of feeling it myself and expressing it in the right way. There is just no hope... I have no concept of love, no reference point on how to feel it and how to express it. Trying to act confident and considerate may just end up hurting someone if I turn out to be incapable of backing it up...

If you're able to lower the stakes in your own mind, I think that would help a lot.  It sounds like you're comparing yourself to some sort of perfectly ideal partner.  Really you just have to be mildly entertaining/endearing and a better alternative than time alone, in the shorter term.  

Statistically speaking, the next person anyone goes on a date with isn't going to turn into a life partner.  So relax and have some fun.  Don't go looking for TRUE LOVE.  Socialize with people and set much smaller goals like do at least one thing during an interaction to earn a smile.  Do that enough times and someone will be there that wants to earn yours. 

[Madame deVenoge]

Well - anyways, after SEXTING last night, oh myyyy, Law Professor is coming over to my place, tomorrow, and he is bringing the sourdough.

He truly is hilariously funny, smart as hell, and ridiculously cute, and I am so attracted to him. 

I have RESTRAINED myself, people!!! This will be the FOURTH DATE!!! I once married a man and stayed married to him for twelve years after random work sex that wasn’t even a date!!!

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

So that's a no on setting you up with my step-bro then? He said the base was around four hours from you. 

ETA: This is exactly why I love my two stepbrothers. They're honest. S and J went on a few dates when we were in HS and not much happened according to her. S and I were having a conversation, and her name came up. J and I didn't exactly want to let him know yet, but I'm also completely honest with him. He confirmed everything she said without me telling him what she had told me. When I told her we talked she seemed way more relieved than me. 

Four days

Edited April 21 by Mr. Chatywin et al.

[Toth]

On 4/20/2024 at 4:50 AM, Erik of Hazelfield said:

Dude, this happens to all of us, albeit with a slightly different twist. There’s always a risk when you’re dating that one will like the other more. There’s always the possibility that you’ll have to break someone’s heart, or have yours broken, because you’re not both equally into each other. And it sucks, but it’s the only way. You can’t fall in love unless you let go of some control and let yourself be vulnerable. It’s part of the game.

Well, I will keep that in mind. My life is busy right now anyway with exam season, civil servant status application, house hunting, then hopefully also therapy on the horizon. So I'm not eager to go dating just now, even though the loneliness and isolation is driving me crazy and my approaching 31st birthday isn't helping my impression that life is rushing past me at break-neck speed while I deep inside still feel like I'm still stuck at the exact same spot I was at 19.

The thing about vulnerability right now however is that I am far too vulnerable deep down and it's confidence that I need. And I need it badly. Can't make anyone fall in love with me when they see my anxiety pop up. And yes, I know this is the opposite angle from the one you were talking about, but see, it's a bit hard to reflect on my own possible feelings when I never met anyone I could get interested in so far. I just know I'll have to work hard to always be my best possible self without exception and it's hard to endure the thought that even that will quite probably not be enough.

On 4/20/2024 at 5:54 AM, Madame deVenoge said:

100% agreed. I mean, you, Toth, kind of remind me of Werther - probably because you’re German, and I think “echtromantishe” is a word, one that I haven’t spelled correctly, I’m sure, but like, Very Romantic on the Romantic Age sense.

I don't think "echtromantisch" is a word that exists... at least I don't know what you are trying to say with the combination. Also while I actually hadn't read Werther, I'm thinking my low self-worth may actually be a boon when it comes to unrequited love. I think I already told the story of the girl in high school I had the stereotypical butterflies for, back when I met her again last year and she acted as if I didn't exist. Where I successfully managed to swallow them down back when I was a kid and forget about it, causing me to be seen as downright unreasonable now when discussing it with people suffering from unrequited love and me being unable to relate at all. Have been called a robot a couple of times because of my pragmatic approach to blocking out emotions that I find rather distracting. I'm thinking as long as I'm not already entangled in a relationship, I could shrug it off if it happens again and surely won't act upon it in any self-destructive ways. Heck, when the bored Chinese student from Bumble said I shouldn't initiate anything again because she felt overwhelmed by me writing three times a week and that after me saying I'd totally like just being friends, but then had her standing me up at a second meeting she herself suggested, I pretty much just replied a flabbergasted "Sure." and never wrote her again, erasing her contact info half a year later when she never initiated again either.

6 hours ago, mcbigski said:

If you're able to lower the stakes in your own mind, I think that would help a lot.  It sounds like you're comparing yourself to some sort of perfectly ideal partner.  Really you just have to be mildly entertaining/endearing and a better alternative than time alone, in the shorter term.  

Not when deep down I'm thinking there is a good chance I will be perceived as worsening someone's life by being unintentionally distant or incapable of always motivating myself into initiating new things. Ultimately me myself right now am an incredibly boring person outside of being passionate about niche nerd interests. Getting the foot in seems incredibly hard when every glimpse behind my professional attitude may come off as a hint I may be some weird incel who later down the line could expose himself as a misogynistic ass, just because quite obviously no woman must have ever thought me worth anything romantically.

[BigFatCoward]

16 hours ago, Madame deVenoge said:

I have RESTRAINED myself, people!!! This will be the FOURTH DATE!!! I once married a man and stayed married to him for twelve years after random work sex that wasn’t even a date!!!

I've never been to a 4th date without fucking. I'd imagine it becomes a bit of an albatross by the 6th date. 

[Madame deVenoge]

41 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said:

I've never been to a 4th date without fucking. I'd imagine it becomes a bit of an albatross by the 6th date. 

I wouldn’t know, lol. This is the longest it’s ever taken, and certainly don’t plan on letting this wait any longer

The third date would have been difficult, because it would have had to have involved conveniently placed shrubbery.

[Mlle. Zabzie]

On 4/16/2024 at 2:41 PM, Madame deVenoge said:

Anyone who behaves badly to service people of any sort shows absolutely no class and is immediately of no interest.

It’s a HUGE red flag. 

It is also on par with “don’t you know who I am?” Which, if that question needs to be asked, no, they don’t know who you are, and it also doesn’t matter, and also, that person asking the question isn’t as important as they think they are.

ETA - on the topic of men who make significantly less money - most of them SAY it’s ok, but they can get really defensive about it. Example: my ex husband was initially tooootally cool when my salary surpassed his, but then my career really took off, and his….didn’t. It was very subtle, but he had some very real “issues” about it. Jealousy, almost. There are a number of heterosexual men for whom this is a problem. 

 

On 4/18/2024 at 1:24 PM, Kalbear said:

I personally take the 'they must make as much money as I do' to be a shorthand for 'they must be able to understand the professional and personal obligations that one has when one takes their career this seriously and not expect significant changes'. 

Also, on the marriage stuff - have more sex! Marriage doesn't mean no sex, it doesn't even necessarily mean less sex (I'd personally say children and getting older do that, but not marriage itself).

It means more freaky sex.

Have more freaky sex, folks.  

Agree on the money thing with both of you….And, this may become an issue for me.  But we shall see.  I may have my first update here next week.  Stay tuned.  I’m getting the best coaching behind the scenes.

 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

Just don't let Chats turn you into the next Wolf of Wall Street. That's what @Jace, Extat is for. 

[Madame deVenoge]

59 minutes ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

Just don't let Chats turn you into the next Wolf of Wall Street. That's what @Jace, Extat is for. 

I am an innocent young lady who would be smoking a cigarette if I smoked.

 

He just left the house, but we are planning Wednesday at his place and then Thursday is an overnight here.

He would have invited me to Seder, tomorrow, if it were just him and his dad, but there’s the kids. So sweet of him to even think about inviting me!!!!

He also asked how I stay looking like I’m 25, as he said, with his eyes roaming up and down my naked body. I told him there is a painting in the attic. He got it.

@Mlle. Zabzie - James also said that The Doctor was not that smart. 

Anyways - I’m going to go for a walk and then read a book 

[Jace, Extat]

4 hours ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

Just don't let Chats turn you into the next Wolf of Wall Street. That's what @Jace, Extat is for. 

I, uh, don't pretend to understand why I was summoned here.

But...

3 hours ago, Madame deVenoge said:

 

He also asked how I stay looking like I’m 25, as he said, with his eyes roaming up and down my naked body. I told him there is a painting in the attic. He got it.

 

O, la la. I'm glad I was. 

[BigFatCoward]

I think this thread should be moved to the Entertainment forum. 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

One more day. I've been so giddy since I started prepping to pack yesterday. 

She has the cheat code though. While I'm doing some practical shopping she's sent a few pics of some lingerie she's bought. That gremlin even modeled two for me. Fuck she looks good. 

[Spockydog]

15 minutes ago, Mr. Chatywin et al. said:

One more day. I've been so giddy since I started prepping to pack yesterday. 

She has the cheat code though. While I'm doing some practical shopping she's sent a few pics of some lingerie she's bought. That gremlin even modeled two for me. Fuck she looks good. 

Don’t forget to pack your flannel.