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Platypus Rex

Poll: Has Brienne Become a Wight?

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Posted (edited)

This is a poll.  Please answer "Yes" or "No" to the following question:

Has Brienne of Tarth Become a "Fire Wight" (That is, One of the Walking Dead Like Beric or Lady Stoneheart) Prior to Her Meeting With Jaime in A DANCE WITH DRAGONS? 

First a DISCLAIMER.  Brienne is an awesome person.  In her last point-of-view chapter, as she was about to be hanged, she was worrying about Pod, not herself.  She definitely does not deserve the fate suggested by this theory.  But GRRM does not necessarily give characters what they deserve, at least not in this life or unlife (see Ned Stark, Rob Stark, Catelyn Stark).  So without further ado ...

Nobody knows exactly what is going on with Brienne.  However, GRRM has confirmed that when she "screamed a word" at the end of her last point-of-view chapter, that the word she screamed was "sword", a clear reference to Stoneheart's "sword or noose" ultimatum.   A popular theory holds that, once she accepted the ultimatum, she was cut alive down and sent after Jaime.

A far less popular theory holds that she was not cut down alive.  She was dead when cut down, and given the kiss of fire, either by Thoros or Stoneheart.  It is her walking corpse that encounters Jaime, at midnight, at the end of Jaime's last point-of-view chapter.  The final word she screamed is significant, because, as GRRM said in an SSM, fire wights are driven by their oaths.   "Sword" per the theory, represents the dying oath to "take the sword and kill the kingslayer".  Even at night, Jaime can tell that Brienne does not look good, or, as he puts it, she seems to have aged 10 years.  In support of this theory is offered a plethora of death dreams and foreshadowings.  Jaime's weirwood dream has Brienne and Jaime trapped together in a sort of underworld, with Brienne looking strangely beautiful as if he were seeing her soul rather than her body.  One of Brienne's nightmares involves her being menaced by a sorcerer involved in the enslavement and animation of the dead. The gravedigger accidentally throws gravedirt on Brienne's feet.  The shield she carried was the black bat of Lothston, which she later learns of an emblem of ill omen, associated with dark sorcery.

That's enough context for now.  For more context, see any number of threads discussing this issue, over the years, on this or other forums.

Please feel free to give reasons for your answers, or otherwise elaborate.  However, I ask that you not argue with reasons given by other posters until at least the third page of this thread.  After that, have at it.

Thank you in advance for all votes.

-------------------------------------x

4 for to 22 against, so far.

  • For:  NonoNono, Haus Berlin, Sire de Maletroit, Unit A2, and (not counted) Platypus Rex.
  • Against:  Clegane'sPup, kissdbyfire, Euron III Greyjoy, The Mother of the Others, The Fattest Leech, Nezza86, Shara, Legitimate_Bastard, Megavora, Wolf of the Steppes, Missing Benjen, the Other Wolf, Ygrain, Lollygag, White Ravens, Prince of the North, Aurane, Remiem, Tai Pan, Impbread, Here's Looking At You Kid, Only 89 selfies today.

But remember, boys and girls, just because it is unpopular does not mean it is not true!

Previous "Unpopular Theory" Polls (in order of popularity).  Voting is still open in the original thread.

  • "Did Jojen Die Off-Page in DANCE?"*:  17 for to 31 against (35.4%).  Supported by  Gertrude, chrisdaw, WyldFyre, Penny's Got a Gun, Megavora, Back door hodor, Lost Melnibonean, Tucu, acwill07, Ibbison from Ibben, Son of Man, Remiem, OtherFromAnotherMother, Lynesse, Jo Maltese, Paltogue, Shara.  Opposed by:  HelenaExMachina, kissdbyfire, White Ravens, many others.
  • "Is Lemore Actually Ashara?":  13 for to 27 against (32.5%).  Supported by:  chrisdaw, Nevets, Annalee, Amris, bent branch, Igziabeher, the conquering bastard 25, Hugorfonics, Great Oshiro, The Lord of the Crossing, Aline de Gavrillac, Springwatch, Ialt.  Opposed by:  kissdbyfire, Ygrain, White Ravens, many others.
  • "Is Sweetrobin the Son of Littlefinger?":  12 for to 23 against (34.3%).  Supported by:  Back door hodor, Lollygag, Haus Berlin, Legitimate_Bastard, LadyOlenna, Aurane, Lynesse, Aegon VII, Sigella, Lost Melnibonean, Prince Henryis, Megavora.  Opposed by:  White Ravens, many others.
  • "Is the House with the Red Door in Dorne?"*:  9 in favor to 32 against (20.5%).  Supported by  TPTWP Timett, Sly Wren, Nezza86, Impbread, Sophia Wilson17, Sigella., Lollygag, Sweet Desire, Black Dragons.  Opposed by:  Ran, Ygrain, White Ravens, many others.
  • "Did Summer See a Dragon?"*:  8 for to 38 against (17.4%).  Supported by:  Legitimate_Bastard, rustythesmith, TPTWP Timett, Remirem, kleevedge, Gertrude, Wolfkin, sweetsunray.  Opposed by:  The hairy bear, kissdbyfire, Lost Melnibonean, White Ravens, many others.
  • "Is Jon Snow the Son of a Dayne?":  8 for to 40 against (16.6%).  Supported by:   Sly Wren, Enuma Elish, Vaedys Targaryen, JS97, SophiaWilson17, kleevedge, Luddagain, Maelerys.  Opposed by:  kissdbyfire, White Ravens, many others.
  • "Has Myrcella Already Died Off-Page?"*:  4 for to 17 against (19.0%).  Supported by:  Sir Dips A Lot, Allardyce, Crona, Haus Berlin.  Opposed by:  White Ravens, many others
  • "Will Brienne Be A New Hound"*:  3 for to 14 against (17.6%).  Supported by:  Springwatch, the Other Wolf, Lollygag.  Opposed by:  White Ravens, many others.
  • "Is Daario actually Euron?"*:  3 in favor to 43 against (6.6%).  Supported by: Adam Targaryen, Paltogue, BRANDON GREYSTARK.  Opposed by:  kissdbyfire, Lost Melnibonean, White Ravens, many others.
  • "Is Varys a Woman"*:  2 for to 32 against (5,9%).  Supported by:  Rufus Snow, Jabar of House Titan.  Opposed by:  The hairy bear, White Ravens, many others.
  • "Is Quentyn, called 'Frog', Still Alive?"*:  2 for to 46 against (4.2%).  Supported by: SophieWilson17, Tucu. Opposed by:  kissdbyfire, White Ravens, many others.

To save space, I have only listed the names of the brave souls who supported each prior Unpopular Theory, as well as one or two Forum V.I.P.s and/or regular voters who opposed it.  No disrespect to the other Victorious Winners of the poll is intended.  The full tally of names of all voters can be found in the original threads.  While I do not county my own votes, those I support are marked with a "*".

 

Edited by Platypus Rex

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Posted (edited)

Interesting. Could be. Like Davos might also have died, without knowing he was resurrected. There's no reason why she would even be aware she did die.

I like it. I'll say, yes, since I believe she executes Jaime with Oathkeeper towards the end of the story. That being said, I don't think she kills Jaime in the LS bit.

But I don't think it would ever be made conclusive.

Edited by NonoNono

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I can understand why people support the theory. After my first read of the series, I also came away convinced that she was dead and had been resurrected. On subsequent re-reads I was pleasantly surprised that I'd misremembered the text explicitly describing her death and I don't why the hell I ever thought that in the first place.

So it's a no from me and I really hope I'm right on this one because it's an aspect of the story that I really disliked.

(As an aside, I also thought that Daario had been killed and returned by trebuchet after my first read and again had a surprise on re-reading that the text doesn't actually say that)

 

 

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No.

I think, that she is not undead. Furthermore, in my opinion, it's unlikely, that she will die before she will deliver at least one of Cat's daughters to her. Probably, she will take Jaime, and will persuade him to go to The Vale to find Sansa. Then she will bring both Sansa and Jaime to Cat. And then either Cat will execute Jaime, or he will be spared, if he will promise to free Edmure, and if he will reveal to Cat, that Arya in Winterfell is a fake. So, probably, Jaime will go to fetch Edmure, and Brienne will go to search Arya.

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I wasn't aware of this theory, and nearly choked on my lunch when I read the title.  I was thinking a white wight.

Although it is an intriguing theory, I'm saying No.....can't buy in.

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Posted (edited)

In addition to lack of evidence for this theory, Brienne's symbolism has been related to cow, moon, white, blue, etc. It would be odd for George to have her transform to a fire wight at this point. 

Edited by OtherFromAnotherMother
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No. It would serve zero purpose in the story, because a living Brienne would be bound by her word to go and kill Jaime, anyway. 

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No. 

GRRM said he has big plans for Stoneheart and Beric was a freak one-off. Agree with the rest that it makes no sense for her character. 

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