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[Spoilers] Episode 806 Discussion

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3 minutes ago, SteveS_FL said:

Because King Robert, against Ned's advice,  sent an assassin to kill her.  At that point even Khal Drogo was on board with crossing the sea to Westeros.

So in the books, when was the last time she even mentioned that? Oh and Robert is dead, as is Tywin, Joffrey etc etc. And Varys arranged it. It just isn't relevant anymore, and isn't even the most recent attempt on her life. The Qaathi and Sons of the Harpy take credit for that.

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41 minutes ago, riffwraith said:

Does it bother anyone that Bronn is now a member of the SC, after threatening the lives of Jamie and Tyrion, with there being no making amends be tween he and Tyrion?

 Bronn at least gave J&T the chance to counter Cersei's offer. He had no intention of killing them in cold blood.  He just wanted them to know he was serious and not to be taken for granted, especially after being jerked around previously. 

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4 hours ago, fairwarging said:

That's why she's the face that launched a thousand ships on AO3. Chemistry with all. 

AO3 is great. I've read some interesting ships with her and somehow they manage to convince me "hey that would work out".

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7 minutes ago, SteveS_FL said:

 Bronn at least gave J&T the chance to counter Cersei's offer. He had no intention of killing them in cold blood.  He just wanted them to know he was serious and not to be taken for granted, especially after being jerked around previously. 

But he should have, and would have for a better show and episode. They get ganked for the same reasons Robb got ganked. For pissing off the wrong people too many damned times.

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1 hour ago, EProduc said:

Jon being exiled feels just weird for me. He saved many lives by killing Dany, and he loved her, yet all the other lords, and especially Tyrion, Arya and Sansa knew that she eventually would have to be killed if she would continue her tyranny, and they too wanted her to be death. Yet Jon's the one doing it and he gets punished for it while Tyrion gets to be hand of the king? Idk it just feels like Tyrion used Jon to do the dirty work. I didn't like Tyrion this last episode, he basically betrayed Dany after being the one that has been counseling her extremely bad for two seasons and he's basically one of the reasons of her demise, only to betray her when things go bad and he's the one that gets Jon banished to the wall. And yeah Greyworm wanted Jon to be punished but then he left for Naath, so why would Sansa and Arya let Jon be punished when they too wanted Dany death?

I think they only punished Jon because that was the only way to keep him alive. And even if they wanted to renege after the Unsullied left. Jon is a man of honor to a fault and would not.

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14 minutes ago, Vashon said:

So in the books, when was the last time she even mentioned that? Oh and Robert is dead, as is Tywin, Joffrey etc etc.

I think the attempt by Robert is what cemented her resolve to go to Westeros.  And  it was Khal Drogo's command, to go to Westeros and fight the men in their iron suits and stone houses.

She may have forgotten all that for a time, as she ruled Meereen, and could have been content there, but then the Sons o' Harpies drove her out and she ended up captured by the Dothraki.  Which is where the books ended if I remember correctly.  So the books are irrelevant after that point.

So being back with the Dothraki (HBO version) she revealed that she was Khaleesi of a dead Khal, which didn't help matters until she burned all the Khals, gained a second army,  and at that point the only logical course was to follow through on her dream to go take Westeros.  

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12 minutes ago, Vashon said:

But he should have, and would have for a better show and episode. They get ganked for the same reasons Robb got ganked. For pissing off the wrong people too many damned times.

Bronn was a practical man.  He calculated correctly that Cersei may never survive to pay up.  He was all about the money.  Walder Frey was all about his wounded pride.  

Now if Cersei had paid Bronn up front, it would have been totally in character for him to "gank" them both.

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21 minutes ago, SteveS_FL said:

and at that point the only logical course was to follow through on her dream to go take Westeros.  

Why? Why would that be the logical course? Wouldn't the first course be to, oh I dunno, secure much of Essos for ships, ports, supplies etc? Or use the Horde to conquer all of Essos? Its not even her dream.

 

18 minutes ago, SteveS_FL said:

Bronn was a practical man.  He calculated correctly that Cersei may never survive to pay up.  He was all about the money.  Walder Frey was all about his wounded pride.  

Now if Cersei had paid Bronn up front, it would have been totally in character for him to "gank" them both.

Or kill them both and walk away.

For all the "characters face consequences" ideal of the show, it sure as shit did what every other show did and abandon the fuck out of it when it needed to.

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Dont understand why people are upset about Bronn being there.  The Lannisters always pay their debts and Tyrion was indebted to him by his word.

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2 minutes ago, Ser Graymax said:

Dont understand why people are upset about Bronn being there.  The Lannisters always pay their debts and Tyrion was indebted to him by his word.

Because the idea of a sell sword w/no background being given the #1 richest region in the entire country as well as a seat on the small council is not remotely realistic.  

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Except for the fact that Arya ultimately lived, I hated everything after the death of the Night King.   
Tyrion Turncloak and Aegon Queenslayer faced no consequences.  Lannister soldiers were having their throats cut in the street, but the regicide and his co-conspirator are held in custody until the Nuremberg Trial in the dragon pit?  Yeah, that makes total sense.    

In the end even Drogon was disloyal.  He should have pushed the Kinslayer of Winterfell onto the Iron Throne and melted him right along with the chair.  That was supposed to be his mother.  Aegon should have been toast.  Is it supposed to be enough that he took the body away to eat it in private?  

The 3 Eyed King suddenly got a shitload of personality after being unanimously acclaimed ruler by a bunch of strangers.  Unless those guys have been watching the show since the beginning, several of them shouldn’t really know Bran from a face on a weirwood tree.  But sure, this random child can be king in the immediate aftermath of the costliest war in the history of the realm.  He is a Stark after all.  Bran's transformation back to a regular dude was ridiculous.   

The Oathbreaker Queen Blabber-Mouth in the North, finally got the crown she has wanted since episode one (well,not the exact crown, she ratted out Ned to be Joff’s Queen, not Queen of the North).  But anyway, Gingers can go back on their word without repercussions, it is known. 

Kellyanne Conway of Tarth betrayed her famous honor by whitewashing “The Kingslayer” in the white book.  Jaime taught Brienne to lie, so it wasn’t all for nothing. 
The jocular little meeting of the small council was sickening, all’s well that ends well I guess…“Wasn’t it all so funny Bronn?” I liked Bronn before they turned him into an ass.     

In the end Sam doesn’t  even write the stinking book.  Maester Whoeverthefuck writes it, and Sam just helps with the title.  So who fills in the truth about R+L=J, and the origins of the Night King and fake Baratheon-Lannister Twincest spawn, and every other secret known only to a small group of insiders?  How does this other dude illuminate all that, or is this “Song of Ice and Fire” book just another BS “official history” book at the Citadel that doesn’t cover all that really happened?    
Speaking of the Tarlys, does anyone think for a second that if Randal Tarly had taken Daenarys prisoner and she responded to a demand to renounce her claim with, “Never!”, that he would have hesitated to take her head off?  Show Tarly was a nasty piece of work and book Tarly is far worse.  Book Tarly might have executed her for having the audacity to raise her voice to him.  Sam was well rid of him.

There are probably other quibbles but these are the ones that stick out after one viewing.    

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7 hours ago, Ice Queen said:

The snow at the beginning was ash. 

When Jon and the wildlings pass the Wall, there is a green plant shooting up out of the ground. So spring is coming. 

But when Drogon is outside the door to the Red Keep when Jon goes there, he was covered in snow, no? He shook it off. Or were those still ashes?

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2 hours ago, Vashon said:

Dany could always say "Fuck it" to Westeros and the Iron Throne and conquer the richer, larger Essos, which has a nice handy underclass desperate to revolt and follw her. I could easily see her gathering up the Dothraki and using them as a hammer to acquire Norvos and Qohor while also grabbing Volantis.

I mean why go to Westeros at all? That was Viserys' obsession, Dany only sort of cared.

Well, to be honest, Westeros is one of the last things on Daenerys' mind right now. But by the end of Winds, Daenerys is going to be presented with three good reasons to go to Westeros. They are: 1) Aegon and his puppetmasters, 2) Euron and 3) the Others

And none of them have to do with the Iron Throne and actual governance. All of them do have to do with conquering and war.

Just now, Lady Anna said:

But when Drogon is outside the door to the Red Keep when Jon goes there, he was covered in snow, no? He shook it off. Or were those still ashes?

Ignore her. It was all snow.

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5 hours ago, Artcasur said:

He is the 3 eye raven and even before becoming that powerful he is already able to warg into a person. What other reason would he have to state at they end that he would find drogon?

A person? Who apart Hodor? Did I miss someone? Hodor's brain is fried he's easier to control than Summer. 

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33 minutes ago, Jabar of House Titan said:

Well, to be honest, Westeros is one of the last things on Daenerys' mind right now. But by the end of Winds, Daenerys is going to be presented with three good reasons to go to Westeros. They are: 1) Aegon and his puppetmasters, 2) Euron and 3) the Others

 

1. Who gives a shit, let him dick around in Westeros and get his shit slapped by the overwhelming weight of the Reach. Which has manpower to spare. 

2. Euron? Currently pillaging the Reach. Why should Dany care?

3. Again, so the fuck what? The Others don't have to attack or do anything south of the Wall. They can, and would have in the show had D a D not been masturbated on the floor and calling that a script, wait for Winter to hit and last for ten years or longer. Why would the Others be in a rush? They can let another Long Winter or Long Night do most of their work for them. 

 

Why should Dany care? Why would she care when she has an entire continent to play with and an entire continent to liberate from slavery? Westeros is the obsession of the Westerosi men who have followed her, meanwhile, she is building her own kingdom and her own empire with her own followers, she has no need to reclaim an indebted thrown of squabbling kingdoms.

 

She was born in the Narrow Sea, spent all her childhood in the Free Cities, became a woman on the Dothraki Sea, and became a sovereign in Old Ghis. She is closer to her homeland than any Targaryen has been in nearly 400 years. She is a self-made woman and has no need to go answering the pleas and beggings of people she has never known and who never cared for her. Everyone who ever gave her anything or helped her is in Essos.

 

Why would she want to save Westeros when she has millions of slaves to free and hundreds of thousands of slave masters to slaughter? There is zero compelling reason for Dany to ever go to Westeros or even care about conquering it. Essos is her land and her people, in truth. It is wealthier, warmer, and larger, and teeming with people who would outright worship her.

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Just now, Vashon said:

1. Who gives a shit, let him dick around in Westeros and get his shit slapped by the overwhelming weight of the Reach. Which has manpower to spare. 

2. Euron? Currently pillaging the Reach. Why should Dany care?

3. Again, so the fuck what? The Others don't have to attack or do anything south of the Wall. They can, and would have in the show had D a D not masturbated on the floor and calling that a script, wait for Winter to hit and last for ten years or longer. Why would the Others be in a rush? They can let another Long Winter or Long Night do most of their work for them. 

 

Why should Dany care? Why would she care when she has an entire continent to play with and an entire continent to liberate from slavery? Westeros is the obsession of the Westerosi men who have followed her, meanwhile, she is building her own kingdom and her own empire with her own followers, she has no need to reclaim an indebted thrown of squabbling kingdoms.

 

She was born in the Narrow Sea, spent all her childhood in the Free Cities, became a woman on the Dothraki Sea, and became a sovereign in Old Ghis. She is closer to her homeland than any Targaryen has been in nearly 400 years. She is a self-made woman and has no need to go answering the pleas and beggings of people she has never known and who never cared for her. Everyone who ever gave her anything or helped her is in Essos.

 

Why would she want to save Westeros when she has millions of slaves to free and hundreds of thousands of slave masters to slaughter? There is zero compelling reason for Dany to ever go to Westeros or even care about conquering it. Essos is her land and her people, in truth. It is wealthier, warmer, and larger, and teeming with people who would outright worship her.

Dany will care because she has people like Moqorro and Marwyn coming her way. Marwyn is coming to tell her about the anti-magic conspiracy at the Citadel and about the threat of the Others. Moqorro is coming to tell her about the threat of Euron (you can't really think Euron is going to just stop at the Reach). And then there is Tyrion who will likely try to poison her mind in regards to Aegon given Tyrion's bitterness and continuing distrust towards Illyrio and Varys.

Besides, there is something really off about Varys. And come hell or high water, Varys is going to put Aegon on that throne.

The Reach isn't going to slap Aegon around if Aegon and Euron are both giving the Reach problems at the same time as Cersei is giving House Tyrell problems in King's Landing.

Face it: Daenerys, in spite of all her flaws, is a rescuer. 

I don't think she will leave for Westeros until her work in Essos is finished. But when she hears that the people in Westeros are in big trouble from those three main entities in addition to the "smaller" threats (i.e. Cersei, Littlefinger, the Faith Militant, the archmaesters at the Citadel), she is going to take her armies and break the wheel in Westeros.

But she won't even try to be breaking the wheel in Westeros until she breaks it in Essos first.

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2 minutes ago, Lady Valicious said:

A person? Who apart Hodor? Did I miss someone? Hodor's brain is fried he's easier to control than Summer. 

And who do Bran wargs into that gets Hodor brain fried?..

so he is that powerful that he cannot only warg into people but also into people from another time.

And in the books you have sixskins who almost manage to do it, we can asume bran is way more powerful than a simple warg, no?

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1 hour ago, Lady Anna said:

But when Drogon is outside the door to the Red Keep when Jon goes there, he was covered in snow, no? He shook it off. Or were those still ashes?

Ashes. It was right after the battle and the whole city was smoldering. 

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15 hours ago, darksellsword said:

I'm sorry but I can't let the "Bran the broken" idiocy go. If someone gets a title it's something flattering or impressive, Why wouldn't they go with Bran the wise or Bran the 3eyeRaven, I know it's Brendan Rivers nickname in the books but on the show it is a title that is passed on. If they do get a condescending nickname it's said behind their back. I get it, it was supposed to be a throwback to the whole "cripples bastards and broken things" line Tyrion spewed in Season 1. I guess the show doesn't use the term cripple anymore because they pandered so hard to the liberals so now Bran is just one of the "broken things" that's so much better right. These guys can't write anything for themselves and when they drop these little season 1 references all the time its just cringing. I think 90 percent of anything D&D contributed was meme generated crap.

There are plenty of examples of this happening in our own history. It’s supposed to mean something like, ‘look at what this ruler accomplished despite their disability’ 

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