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US Politics: Butter Not Guns

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Posted (edited)

I feel a great disturbance in the Force; as if 45 million seniors had cried at once, in anger: KEEP YOUR GOVERNMENT HANDS OFF MY SOCIAL SECURITY!!!!

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White House economic adviser Larry Kudlow said Sunday that President Trump “did not mean that he was eliminating the Social Security tax” with his coronavirus executive orders. 

Kudlow told CNN’s “State of the Union” that the president will protect Social Security and Medicare after Trump vowed to make permanent his coronavirus executive orders’ cut in the payroll taxes, which help fund the programs. 

Hahaha. Trump just turbofucked himself with seniors.

Edited by The Great Unwashed

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18 minutes ago, mcbigski said:

In the long run, it's the sum of the short term.  Democracy isn't perfect, but I don't think the anti populist bias you seemed to be showing is healthy either.  And not sure what you mean exactly about "conning everyone", when you correct for the media filter, Trump has tried to complete far more of what promised than anyone since Reagan at least.  I don't want someone to grow in office, I want someone who tries to do what he or she says they'll do.

Not the same K.  Do I really need to explain why counting the votes for those who make the laws needs a much higher standard than enforcing the laws derived from fair elections?  (I think we're in the midst of a breakdown because trust has been destroyed, but who wants to go on record now that post office would be scrupulously fair in the event of a mostly by mail election?)

Towards the other question, fundamentally, do you see law enforcement's role as protecting the people or oppressing them?  Go ahead and hold republicans to their own standards.  That's only fair.  We each should be accountable for our own actions.   But why is law enforcement akin to an election? 

So it’s only the same when it’s the side you think? Both policing and elections determine how other people are able to live their lives, both are positions of authority over citizens. Both the police unions and the postal unions are granted some special statuses. Both unions tend to endorse a particular side. It’s very comparable except that ballot contents are secret and people’s skin color while being arrested is not

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Yeah, aren't mail in votes like sealed or something? I'm pretty sure that's why I licked the fucking thing even though the state told me not to.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, The Great Unwashed said:

That's a flat-out lie. He obviously made it up on the spot.

He's making all this up on the spot. Pretty obvious it wasn't vetted by legal experts. He's a 6 year old drawing executive orders in crayon. Notice though the entire order has changed. Now, states can come grovelling to Trump in order to avoid paying the $100 extra. Somehow we have gone from trying to provide aid to Americans to forcing American Governors to grovel to Trump.

Edited by Martell Spy

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26 minutes ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

Biden just needs to keep laying back and pay out more rope to Donald who is intent on hanging himself with it.

This would be a perfect time to unveil a plan to expand Social Security.

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Posted (edited)

I get the feeling that there is very little enthusiasm for Biden as a candidate. I wonder what is motivating the voters intending to vote for Biden? Are the voting for Biden or against Trump?

I'm really surprised that the best the Democratic party could come up with is a candidate who has lost, what, 3 primary races in the past. He was 2nd best, or worse, for a number of election cycles, but this time he's the best the party has?

Of course everyone of the Squad is better IMO, and Bernie, but I can understand why no one in the Squad put their hand up.

Edited by The Anti-Targ

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3 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

I get the feeling that there is very little enthusiasm for Biden as a candidate. I wonder what is motivating the voters intending to vote for Biden? Are the voting for Biden or against Trump?

I'm really surprised that the best the Democratic party could come up with is a candidate who has lost, what, 3 primary races in the past. He was 2nd best, or worse, for a number of election cycles, but this time he's the best the party has?

Of course everyone of the Squad is better IMO, and Bernie, but I can understand why no one in the Squad put their hand up.

 

Your suggestions for a better candidate is a bunch of women who haven't even completed a two year term in congress?  That haven't ever won a competitive race against a Republican?  You're objection to Biden is that he lost two presidential primaries so the better alternative is Bernie Sanders...who just lost two presidential primaries?

 

I live in a mail-in-ballot state.  Voting for president takes me less than five minutes.  I don't need to feel a shred of enthusiasm to vote for him.  I'm sure for people that actually have to stand in line to vote it is more of an issue.

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1 hour ago, Lord of Rhinos said:

 

Your suggestions for a better candidate is a bunch of women who haven't even completed a two year term in congress?  That haven't ever won a competitive race against a Republican?  You're objection to Biden is that he lost two presidential primaries so the better alternative is Bernie Sanders...who just lost two presidential primaries?

 

I live in a mail-in-ballot state.  Voting for president takes me less than five minutes.  I don't need to feel a shred of enthusiasm to vote for him.  I'm sure for people that actually have to stand in line to vote it is more of an issue.

Crazy right? But by all metrics I value, yes absolutely any one of them is preferable to Biden. And technically Bernie had only lost one primary before this one. So it was a two-time loser vs a one-time loser.

Trump was a zero time in elected office, yet got himself elected president. Dragging out the old "experience" chestnut is a bit tired by now.

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5 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

I get the feeling that there is very little enthusiasm for Biden as a candidate. I wonder what is motivating the voters intending to vote for Biden? Are the voting for Biden or against Trump?

If Biden were 15 years younger, I'd be excited to vote for him regardless of the level of insanity of Republicans. As has been discussed before, and I have no interest in debating again, I legitimately believe that dull sounding, technocratic, center-left incrementalism is the most effective method of accomplishing progress.

As is, I'm still excited to vote for Biden simply because I look forward to not having to hear about the President every fucking day of my life.

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56 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Trump was a zero time in elected office, yet got himself elected president. Dragging out the old "experience" chestnut is a bit tired by now.

His presidential term is a perfect example why government experience is a desirable quality in a president.

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34 minutes ago, Fez said:

If Biden were 15 years younger, I'd be excited to vote for him regardless of the level of insanity of Republicans. As has been discussed before, and I have no interest in debating again, I legitimately believe that dull sounding, technocratic, center-left incrementalism is the most effective method of accomplishing progress.

As is, I'm still excited to vote for Biden simply because I look forward to not having to hear about the President every fucking day of my life.

You consider exiting the stage within the next four years? :leaving:

8 hours ago, mcbigski said:

Not the same K.  Do I really need to explain why counting the votes for those who make the laws needs a much higher standard than enforcing the laws derived from fair elections?  (I think we're in the midst of a breakdown because trust has been destroyed, but who wants to go on record now that post office would be scrupulously fair in the event of a mostly by mail election?)

There's quite a bit to unpack. And I find your lack of self-awareness disturbing, or amusing. I always confuse those two.

But ok, let's go thru this a bit, in the vague hope, we reach a point where you spot the dissonance, and have a moment of enlightenenment.

So how did you get to that statement? Because you are scared of vote by mail being susceptible to fraud. Why? Because the postal union endorsed Biden. Quite a jump there. Has there ever been a problem with voting by mail in the past? No? Ok, so what's different. Ah, right the POTUS keeps on ranting on about the fraudulent method of voting by mail, and thus disputing the election results before the actual election. I am glad you share the concern about the breakdown as a result of trust being destroyed.  Anyway, wow would the mail men go about their tempting with mail in ballots go then? Will they take out ballots from Trump voters out of circulation? How would they know, who they voted for?  Again, your concern about the erosion of trust is touching, but somewhat slightly undermined by the insinuation in the final setence that the bloody mail man would've fathered a Biden Presidency, or that you wouldn't want to go on record about the fucking post office being scrupulously fair?

 

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Posted (edited)
On 8/8/2020 at 10:56 PM, mcbigski said:

 

Well the post office union already endorsed Sen. Biden, so can we really trust them to handle mail in ballots entirely fairly?  If the D's are going to make the post office an electoral force, then sauce for the goose....

There are riots going on in Belarus right now over a stolen election. More or less President for life Lukashenko says he won the election 93% to 7%. Witnesses saw poll workers crawling out of back windows with bags of ballots, off to be burned, presumably. Is that what you imagine postal workers are going to do? Crawl out of back windows with bags of mail-in ballots? How are they going to know which ballots are for Biden, which are for Trump? Do you think they are also going to open them all, then re-seal them, and no one will notice?

Note the case in Belarus - it’s the workers at the polling stations who do the dirty work. I repeat, it’s the workers at the polling stations who do the dirty work. That’s always been the way in America!

If course, this time around it could be Russian hackers, since US intelligence services say an awful lot of probing of state systems has been done over the last couple of years.

But, no, it’s gonna be postal workers, right? You played golf again this weekend, right? Did you crash the golf cart again?

Edited by Fragile Bird
Sp

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Other points I didn’t manage yesterday after an 8 hour drive- 

The post office doesn’t count the votes. The states do that. The post office literally just deliver your ballot if you want them to. Historically- REPUBLICANS are who are more likely to vote absentee.

Historically, absentee voting has not been a problem at all. It works great. Policing, on the other hand, has had many highly publicized problems which include tons of people being literally fucking killed.

 

So, @mcbigski, you are right. They’re not the same at all. Policing is an example of a situation where many examples exist of discrimination (especially in my own city of Minneapolis!), while the post office is a constitutionally mandated service that while being the largest employer of people of color (like my own mother) has not been shown to engage in any kind of misconduct with absentee ballots. Another major difference is that postal workers, if found to be tampering with ballots, would actually be held accountable. Policing isn’t similar because police have given tons of reasons for mistrust and the postal service has not. I have no concerns that my mail carrier might fucking shoot me.

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The postal service is one of the wonders of the goddamn modern world and it makes me so fucking mad to see callow shitheels like Trump and DeJoy and the Republican Shitheel Party fucking with it for their own petty self-serving bullshit reasons. Yet another example of taking a public good, sabotaging it, yelling about how badly it works, and trying to privatize it.

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10 hours ago, mcbigski said:

I don't want someone to grow in office, I want someone who tries to do what he or she says they'll do.

What is that time in office convinces the officeholder that his/her original plans just aren't sound? Wouldn't you want them to change?

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That didn't take long

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The Trump administration is open to resuming coronavirus aid talks with Democratic leaders and would offer more aid money to try to reach a compromise, Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin said Monday. 

"The president is determined to spend what we need to spend. ... We're prepared to put more money on the table," he told CNBC's "Squawk on the Street." 

Ell-o-fucking-Ell.

Give 'em hell Nancy!

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2 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

You consider exiting the stage within the next four years? :leaving:

Haven't you heard, after 3 months in office he's stepping down once he's installed a communist regime.

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