US Politics: Dominoes falling, GOP failing, what a time to be alive!

[A Horse Named Stranger]

I mean, you lot got a taste of Trump in the Oval Office for four years, if you lot decide you really want to go for seconds after a four year break, then so be it. Not for me to chide your love for fascism.

[LongRider]

7 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

“He’s now president for life. President for life. And he’s great,” the US president reportedly told Republican donors.

This is an ongoing theme with the Repubs 

“If this were a dictatorship it would be a heck of a lot easier... as long as I'm the dictator. Hehehe.”

― George W. Bush

[Kalbear]

2 minutes ago, KingAerys_II said:

The citizens affected by the increase of the cost (fuel, food) are the poor and the middle class, if Trump really has a plan to solve Ukrainian war, he's gonna win

I mean having a plan? Yeah, Trump has LOTS of plans. None of them work and most just get him and his family more money, but he has lots of plans. He even said what his plan was, and that was basically to get Ukraine scared and go along with Russia. Which is...definitely a plan! It's not a workable one, but it would definitely be something that someone has planned.

[Phylum of Alexandria]

3 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

I mean, you lot got a taste of Trump in the Oval Office for four years, if you lot decide you really want to go for seconds after a four year break, then so be it. Not for me to chide your love for fascism.

I mean, anything is possible, but the fact is that most of the country can't stand him. It's just that a significant chunk of that population aren't seeing him in the news being crazy (and he's crazier than he ever was, but not as omnipresent in the news as he will be).

I mentioned "reasonable" Republicans choosing party over country, but even stronger than party loyalty is negative partisanship. Hating "the other side" drives people much more than liking the one side. That doesn't give me great comfort, but it makes me lean in the direction that Trump will probably lose once he's back in everyone's faces.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

26 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

Well, obviously. I've said this many times previously. But the logic was true in 2016 as well, as were the arguments. The difference would be what - we were proven correct? Yay?

Point being that there will be a whole lot of people who used the same arguments you did 7 years ago as being valid now. They won't believe Trump will be THAT bad, or they'll just not vote, or they'll say that it won't make that much a difference to them personally (because it probably won't, honestly), or any number of bullshit rationalizations that were bullshit 7 years ago too. Glad you're on our side, but you should ask yourself what changed your mind in the last 7 years and then ask if that'll change everyone else's minds. 

What changed my mind was watching Trumps term as President, his flailing efforts to retain that power, and the cultish following of his devotees and the Republican Party’s shameful and cowardly acquiescence to that cult.

@Rippounet hence my point earlier.

[Kalbear]

Just now, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

What changed my mind was watching Trumps term as President, his flailing efforts to retain that power, and the cultish following of his devotees and the Republican Party’s shameful and cowardly acquiescence to that cult.

@Rippounet hence my point earlier.

That's been true since 2000. Hasn't changed people then, either. As long as they are mostly comfortable, the people that they identify as friends and family aren't too impacted, and they are told that it is Someone Else's Fault they're not going to be too up in arms. 

Plus, ya know, a whole bunch of US citizens are pretty okay with authoritarianism and down on democratic rule these days, and why wouldn't they be? Republicans have done a very good job of showing how shitty the government can be when they are not in charge and when they are in charge. 

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

14 minutes ago, KingAerys_II said:

The citizens affected by the increase of the cost (fuel, food) are the poor and the middle class, if Trump really has a plan to solve Ukrainian war, he's gonna win

Trump lies.  Then lies about having lied.  The lies about having lied about lying.  It’s what he does.

[Luzifer's right hand]

What is a reasonable Republican?

The party just made an extrem religious fanatic speaker of the house.

What a reasonable Republican believes is utterly irrelevant as they still vote for people that support such fanatics.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

5 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

Trump lies.  Then lies about having lied.  The lies about having lied about lying.  It’s what he does.

He's not lying and does have a plan: Let Putin win in exchange for Russia giving Jared billions of dollars. 

[KingAerys_II]

Republican party is full of people that believe in conspiracies and during the pandemic they made lots of "stupid statements" on the vaccines. The party of anti Vax. 

If Trump promises to decrease the cost of fuel in exchange of the Republic of Donbass and Lugansk, the average American is going to vote him. 

The Republics are the zones where ethnic Russian Ukrainians live, so it is actually not so dramatic, then lots of people don't support the fact that US is paying billions to give weapons to Ukraine

Edited November 6, 2023 by KingAerys_II

[Varysblackfyre321]

16 minutes ago, KingAerys_II said:

The Republics are the zones where ethnic Russian Ukrainians l

There’s no polling or data to indicate a hard majority wants to be annexed by Russia. unless you’re playing devils advocate and trying to explain someone else’s reasoning You’re invoking blood and soil rhetoric.

 

[IheartIheartTesla]

Is everyone talking about Trump-Biden again because of the NYT/Siena poll that showed the former ahead in 5 of the 6 swing states by about 4 points (within MoE, I imagine)? The poll also showed that Trump's support would erode by 6 pts in some of those states if he was convicted of crimes, so there is that. 

So I'm not sure how much to buy that poll since it shows Black support for Trump at an unprecedented 22%, but shoring up the coalition is probably one of the first steps to take. Generic candidate whomps Trump, so maybe there is something to getting someone else on the ballot. Still, early days yet.

Edited November 6, 2023 by IheartIheartTesla

[Phylum of Alexandria]

37 minutes ago, Luzifer's right hand said:

What is a reasonable Republican?

The party just made an extrem religious fanatic speaker of the house.

What a reasonable Republican believes is utterly irrelevant as they still vote for people that support such fanatics.

Pretty sure everyone here is using "reasonable" in scare quotes with respect to Republicans. All of the actually reasonable people have since left the party.

[KingAerys_II]

11 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

There’s no polling or data to indicate a hard majority wants to be annexed by Russia. unless you’re playing devils advocate and trying to explain someone else’s reasoning You’re invoking blood and soil rhetoric.

 

I am not the type of guy who enjoys Putin and thinks "Oh, Putin, how smart you are! How beautiful you are! You are wonderful!", Putin is a tyrant and a megalomaniac person. Do you think Trump cares about polls in those places, he doesn't know where Ukraine is, his plan is someone else work

Edited November 6, 2023 by KingAerys_II

[Varysblackfyre321]

4 minutes ago, KingAerys_II said:

I am not the type of guy who enjoys Putin and thinks "Oh, Putin, how smart you are! How beautiful you are! You are wonderful!", Putin is a tyrant and a megalomaniac person. Do you think Trump cares about polls in those places, he doesn't know where Ukraine is, his plan is someone else work

Understood and apologies for my needlessly hostile tone.

 

[Varysblackfyre321]

16 minutes ago, IheartIheartTesla said:

Generic candidate

Gavin it’d your time to Shine!

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

41 minutes ago, KingAerys_II said:

Republican party is full of people that believe in conspiracies and during the pandemic they made lots of "stupid statements" on the vaccines. The party of anti Vax. 

If Trump promises to decrease the cost of fuel in exchange of the Republic of Donbass and Lugansk, the average American is going to vote him. 

The Republics are the zones where ethnic Russian Ukrainians live, so it is actually not so dramatic, then lots of people don't support the fact that US is paying billions to give weapons to Ukraine

Ask the “ethnic Russians” in Karkiv how they feel about the Russian invasion.

[KingAerys_II]

Yes, but a peace agreement would allow Ukraine to join EU and the return in Ukraine of millions of Ukrainians living in Poland. 

Evil Dobby and his plutonium teas are very dangerous, but Azov battalion is not good, anyway. 

Before the invasion led by Evil Dobby, Ukrainian government used to bomb the Donbass, because there were rebels paid by evil Dobby, that rejected repressive laws as the Russian language outlawed in those territories 

Edited November 6, 2023 by KingAerys_II

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

3 minutes ago, KingAerys_II said:

Yes, but a peace agreement would allow Ukraine to join EU and the return in Ukraine of millions of Ukrainians living in Poland. 

Evil Dobby and his plutonium teas are very dangerous, but Azov battalion is not good, anyway. 

Before the invasion led by Evil Dobby, Ukrainian government used to bomb the Donbass, because there were rebels paid by evil Dobby, that rejected repressive laws as the Russian language outlawed in those territories 

Any “peace agreement” between Ukraine and Russia “Status Quo Ante” will demand Ukraine stay out of the EU and NATO.

Russia will refuse anything else.

Edited November 6, 2023 by Ser Scot A Ellison

[Kalbear]

Since this is the US politics thread and not the Ukraine thread I'll step in and point out that for the most part US citizens do not care that much about Ukraine, especially not after 620 days of war and no real progress for a whole year. If Trump was able to somehow reduce gas prices at the cost of throwing Ukraine under the bus he probably would be lauded for it, because all folks would notice is that gas prices went down.