Gotham TV

[Daemon I Blackfyre]

Meh, I just saw it.

I think it's going to survive until the end of its first season at least, then it'll probably get cancelled.

And that's probably for the best.

The actors are fine, but I just can't be convinced by a Jim Gordon played by Ben McKenzie. I like him, but he just doesn't seem like a good casting choice for the role. Way too blonde, muscular and young, besides Jim was already captain when he first arrived to Gotham.

Aside from that, the real issue here is the script and the fact that they want to tell yet another different version of Batman's origins. It's never necessary to give any reason behind Thomas and Martha's murder.

The whole point is that a common criminal took their lives, a nobody. The "let's find the hired killer" route is going to shape this show in something mediocre.

[Mexal]

It's ok. I'll stick with it for now but I wasn't blown away by the pilot, which is to be as expected. I'll see how it evolves before making truly judging.

[Myrddin]

Am I the only one who saw flashes of Octavian in young Bruce? Not that i want Gordon running to Bruce every week for advice on the case of the week, but the occasional inspired insight of the future master detective should be fun. Also, the more physical Alfred giving vibes of an ex-SAS operative, I can see him acting on Bruce's advice occasionally.

If Heller can do for Gotham what he did for HBO's Rome -- make all the various plot threads intertwine, each feeding the other -- I'm all in.

But I agree with the general sentiment: Based on just this first episode, I'm not sold just yet. I have confidence in Heller as the show runner, just not Fox for giving him the time to pull out a winner.

ETA: 5,000th post!

[red snow]

Am I the only one who saw flashes of Octavian in young Bruce? Not that i want Gordon running to Bruce every week for advice on the case of the week, but the occasional inspired insight of the future master detective should be fun. Also, the more physical Alfred giving vibes of an ex-SAS operative, I can see him acting on Bruce's advice occasionally.

If Heller can do for Gotham what he did for HBO's Rome -- make all the various plot threads intertwine, each feeding the other -- I'm all in.

But I agree with the general sentiment: Based on just this first episode, I'm not sold just yet. I have confidence in Heller as the show runner, just not Fox for giving him the time to pull out a winner.

ETA: 5,000th post!

If they can repeat Young Octavius with Bruce, we'll be in for a treat. I guess you have a point that young Bruce should already be super smart. Could be quite sinister/fun to have him using Gordon/others to carry out "justice" for him while he waits until he's physically stronger.

[CyanidePie]

The writing on this show :lol: :lol:

"Um yes, newspaper? Some homeless kids are being stolen."

Next day, it's the headline in the Gotham paper LMAO. This is the Gotham Gazette, not the National Enquirer, how in the hell are they building an entire front page news story on a 30-second phone call from an unidentified source? They just ran a story based on what could have been a prank call for all they know.

Fish Mooney:

"I just wish that little Penguin was still alive. I didn't...make...him suffer...nearly...enough!" *said through gritted teeth as camera zooms in on her face and DUN DUN DUH music plays*

:lol:

Bless you network TV, you're so bad.

[Corvinus85]

The writing on this show :lol: :lol:

"Um yes, newspaper? Some homeless kids are being stolen."

Next day, it's the headline in the Gotham paper LMAO. This is the Gotham Gazette, not the National Enquirer, how in the hell are they building an entire front page news story on a 30-second phone call from an unidentified source? They just ran a story based on what could have been a prank call for all they know.

Fish Mooney:

"I just wish that little Penguin was still alive. I didn't...make...him suffer...nearly...enough!" *said through gritted teeth as camera zooms in on her face and DUN DUN DUH music plays*

:lol:

Bless you network TV, you're so bad.

This episode made realize that this show should not be taken too seriously, not when they're putting so much dark comedy in it. And there is a comic book feel to it.

[Jon AS]

While the first episode mostly left me wondering what the hell the point of this show is (besides making money for the creators), the second was just bad. Bad dialogue, boring case-of-the-week, stupid Bruce Wayne scenes that didn't add anything...

So are the three main arc plots going to be a gang war, the Wayne murder mystery and Penguin somehow becoming a villain worthy of Batman's attention (I guess the first and last can be tied together)? Those all strike me as rather uninteresting hooks.

[Quoth]

I have taken all your criticisms under careful advisement. Still, until Bruce dons a costume with nipples, I'm in. :P

[RedEyedGhost]

The writing on this show :lol: :lol:

"Um yes, newspaper? Some homeless kids are being stolen."

Next day, it's the headline in the Gotham paper LMAO. This is the Gotham Gazette, not the National Enquirer, how in the hell are they building an entire front page news story on a 30-second phone call from an unidentified source? They just ran a story based on what could have been a prank call for all they know.

Fish Mooney:

"I just wish that little Penguin was still alive. I didn't...make...him suffer...nearly...enough!" *said through gritted teeth as camera zooms in on her face and DUN DUN DUH music plays*

:lol:

Bless you network TV, you're so bad.

Because the crime desk at a major city newspaper has zero sources within the police department? Sure it's implausible, but you're acting like it's not even remotely possible.

Fish is terrible. I can't think of a single thing in which I've liked JPS and she's not good in this at all, but it's definitely not all her fault as the character is poorly written and has ridiculous dialogue.

I also do not like this Alfred at all. He sounds like an old football hooligan. No high class butler would keep that low rent accent.

[polishgenius]

Yeah, in the first episode I didn't mind Fish in a hammy sort of way but here she was terrible. I would blame JPS for at least some of it though (and I don't have anything against her in general) - her dialogue was largely ridiculous but she plays it so stiff. The scene between her and Falcone really highlights a quality gap there.

[red snow]

I also do not like this Alfred at all. He sounds like an old football hooligan. No high class butler would keep that low rent accent.

They've gone a bit too far with the Michael Caine version of Alfred. He works as ex SAS but I thought the whole point of a Butler was to have some class. He seems devoid of it with all his swearing and the like. Then again, that whole conversation about him being given specific instructions by Thomas Wayne on how to raise Bruce has me wondering if they always intended Bruce to be a tough nut. Fascinating how the Butler gets to be guardian and the like - almost like Thomas had planned for such a possibility.

The problem with this episode is that it felt much more like "Arrow" in tone. This isn't necessarily a bad thing but hopefully it can find a similar groove to Arrow quicker.

The penguin is still the best thing about the show. The actor is doing a great job in being a weasly psycho yet still getting me to feel sorry for him when people pick on him.

[Jaxom 1974]

I'm trying to make peace with the Alfred portrayal. They seen to want to have this tough guy as Butler suddenly thrust into the role parent...It isn't perfect...

[Howdyphillip]

The penguin is still the best thing about the show. The actor is doing a great job in being a weasly psycho yet still getting me to feel sorry for him when people pick on him.

I had a conversation with a friend last night in which he informed me that the actor playing Cobblepot actually put bottle caps in the bottom of his shoes in order to more realistically convey the Penguin walk.

Also, if you had that nagging feeling that you have seen the guy villain of the week before, he was the Big Kahuna burger guy in Pulp fiction

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBP0Mbc7VFw

[Ferocious Veldt Roarer]

The writing on this show :lol: :lol:

"Um yes, newspaper? Some homeless kids are being stolen."

Next day, it's the headline in the Gotham paper LMAO. This is the Gotham Gazette, not the National Enquirer, how in the hell are they building an entire front page news story on a 30-second phone call from an unidentified source? They just ran a story based on what could have been a prank call for all they know.

Nah. Barbara gave them some details to start, and considering how corrupt the GCPD is, a reporter would have no trouble interviewing the witness. Hell, if paid a little extra, the cops likely would've delivered the kid to the editorial office. Now, starting such a story from scratch in late evening, and meeting the deadline for the morning edition, that's implausible. I'm OK with it. "A consistently faithful and accurate representation of how much time specific things require" wouldn't make a very good TV show. OK, maybe document, but not drama.

[BearQueen87]

I thought the second episode was good, though not as good as the pilot. For episode that was titled Selina Kyle, we didn't spend a lot of time with her nor learn that much about her.

JPS is just chewing through her scenes. Especially that one where she declares how she's going to take Falcone down.

Penguin really shines, though he progressed from informative lackey to murder quiet quick.

Bullock is great. Donal Logue shines in his scenes.

[Jaxom 1974]

Jada Smith might be worth a bit more if they'd let her out of her club. Two episodes in and she's gone no where but the alley. Spread her wings and show she's in control of a chunk of Gotham.

[RedEyedGhost]

Yeah, in the first episode I didn't mind Fish in a hammy sort of way but here she was terrible. I would blame JPS for at least some of it though (and I don't have anything against her in general) - her dialogue was largely ridiculous but she plays it so stiff. The scene between her and Falcone really highlights a quality gap there.

Very good point there. I might be going too easy on because I don't like her usually :lol:

They've gone a bit too far with the Michael Caine version of Alfred. He works as ex SAS but I thought the whole point of a Butler was to have some class. He seems devoid of it with all his swearing and the like. Then again, that whole conversation about him being given specific instructions by Thomas Wayne on how to raise Bruce has me wondering if they always intended Bruce to be a tough nut. Fascinating how the Butler gets to be guardian and the like - almost like Thomas had planned for such a possibility.

The problem with this episode is that it felt much more like "Arrow" in tone. This isn't necessarily a bad thing but hopefully it can find a similar groove to Arrow quicker.

The penguin is still the best thing about the show. The actor is doing a great job in being a weasly psycho yet still getting me to feel sorry for him when people pick on him.

Penguin is great, but Barbara Gordon is easily the best thing about this show. My god, that woman is just gorgeous.

The instructions from Thomas Wayne speech seemed like it was something both less and more than what we saw this episode. Alfred's character, thus far, in this incarnation feels like he's tailor made to facilitate Bruce's transformation into Batman, but at the same time it felt like Thomas had told Alfred to just stay out of Bruce's shit and let him be his own man wholly and completely (ie. Alfred not getting Bruce the help he obviously needs and that creates the cascade into Batman).

I thought the second episode was good, though not as good as the pilot. For episode that was titled Selina Kyle, we didn't spend a lot of time with her nor learn that much about her.

JPS is just chewing through her scenes. Especially that one where she declares how she's going to take Falcone down.

Penguin really shines, though he progressed from informative lackey to murder quiet quick.

Bullock is great. Donal Logue shines in his scenes.

I honestly was not planning on even watching this until he was cast.

[Crazydog7]

Your normal Batman villian is bad enough on their worst day but most would have the decency to just kill you after they riped you off or held you for randsom. For some reason the Dollmaker always freaked me out. I'm glad the kids didn't have to go through that.

[red snow]

I thought the second episode was good, though not as good as the pilot. For episode that was titled Selina Kyle, we didn't spend a lot of time with her nor learn that much about her.

JPS is just chewing through her scenes. Especially that one where she declares how she's going to take Falcone down.

Penguin really shines, though he progressed from informative lackey to murder quiet quick.

Bullock is great. Donal Logue shines in his scenes.

In fairness we saw him delight in beating the guy up with a baseball bat. He'd have probably went further if Gordon hadn't shown up, So him killing isn't a surprise. I like how he plays the victim (and he usually is on the receiving end) yet the trouble he's in is entirely of his own making. I like that in a villain.

[drawkcabi]

This episode made realize that this show should not be taken too seriously, not when they're putting so much dark comedy in it. And there is a comic book feel to it.

So much this. I got a real Tim Burton feel in this episode from the Dollmaker's lackeys - both semi-high profile actors though I haven't seen them in much recently - to Carol Cane as Mrs. Cobblepott (Cobblepote...) Only thing is, dubious dialogue writing granted, it has imo a more engaging storyline in 2 episodes than either of Burton's movies.

I think my infatuation with this show now has a lot to do with that I had very low expectations for it and it's been much more fun than I thought it would be.