Growing meat in vast vats (methane gas no longer put into the atmosphere.)

[baxus]

While you do have a point concerning people ignoring how the meat comes to their tables, suburbia is no place for butchering a cow and people having a fit over it is perfectly reasonable.

I would hazard a guess not many cows are butchered in the streets of Ho Chi Minh city either.

[Theda Baratheon]

Yep. That's one of the things that makes me so angry and frustrates me when people are arguing against veggies and they say things like "But we're CARNIVORES! Look at our TEETH! It's only NATURAL we eat meat! We're top of the food chain" and i think...no...most of you peruse supermarket aisles for your meat, it comes chopped up and wrapped in plastic for you - what the hell is natural about that? And human beings might be 'smart' but we also seem hell bent on destroying our own planet and other animals we live with so put yourself next to a lion or a bear and we'll really see how you're top of the food chain.

I would feel equally freaked out and disgusted thinking of any situation where an animal is killed. There really is a LOT of ignorance, defensiveness and plain not WANTING to know the truth around this subject but that makes me lose respect for people a bit when they refuse to even think about what they are eating.

People will say all sorts, the world is horrible enough as it is etc they dont wanna think about all the horrible things that happen in the world because it's too exhausting and depressing and i sympathise with that big time, i dont wanna constantly think about nasty things and i also feel annoyed and indignant when i feel like someone is trying to tell me im a bad person. Difference is this is one of the big horrible problems most people are actively and ignorantly taking part in and causing.

Anyway like i said would be hypocritical to tell people to stop eating meat altogether as i havent just gone vegan altogether but am actively reducing how much dairy and eggs i consume and buy. I know how horrific the dairy industry is, often worse than the meat industry in its abuse of animals and i feel very guilty a lot of the time which is not pleasant but at least i feel like im trying and not refusing to even see a problem. Just think the response of people to things like "meatless" mondays is ridiculous. "I CANT GO A DAY WITHOUT MEAT" Well...yes you can actually.

[Larry of the Lawn]

I'd happily eat artificially grown meat. In theory there should be no difference in taste or nutrition and it would solve a lot of environmental and ethical issues. Also, imagine being able to custom-order any exotic meat you wanted from anywhere in the world.

I'll have the honey badger - armadillo -narwhal combo, extra pickles, and throw some sloth bacon on there too, please. Thanks.

What, you're out of narwhal again!?! Sure, platypus is fine instead, or whatever marsupial is handy. Yeah.

I agree with Darzin and Theda that many people don't think much about where their food comes from or how it got there or what it's living conditions were like.

[Darzin]

I would hazard a guess not many cows are butchered in the streets of Ho Chi Minh city either.

Ok fair enough, maybe I got a bit carried away there, but chickens are and I don't think people would be super happy about that either. In my neighborhood which is a somewhere between suburban and rural but with most of the people having a suburban bent, people were freaked out by my friends family eating a deer that they accidentally hit with a car.

Theda I don't know your current situation, but have you thought of getting a goat or chickens? You wouldn't have any guilt at all if you knew the animals were well cared for. Chickens are easy enough to care for and you can keep them most anywhere even the city. A goat is a big commitment but if it bothers you that much it would allow you to enjoy milk and maybe even cheesing guilt free.

[Arch-MaesterPhilip]

I suppose the thought of eating roadkill freaks some people out.

[snake]

Why?

I just don't like the idea of it. I find it disturbing actually. lol

I want to eat the meat of an animal that has lived, been killed and then butchered. It's a personal preference I guess.

[lessthanluke]

I just don't like the idea of it. I find it disturbing actually. lol

I want to eat the meat of an animal that has lived, been killed and then butchered. It's a personal preference I guess.

Yeah. I find you needing meat to be killed and butchered before you can eat it pretty disturbing but YMMV.

[MercenaryChef]

i am a chef. i cook, serve and consume a lot of animals.

would i trade in my dry aged all natural beef or my ossobaw hog for some scientifically grown slab of meat with all the nutrients and qualities of these beasts?

i don't think i would. i know where my food comes from. i know the conditions the animals are raised in. i am comfortable with that. as a youth i grew up hunting and fishing with my father. the bulk of our meat was deer taken by us.

it is important to have a relationship with your food. most people do not have that.

i have no problem with other people's personal dietary choices, however.

[Lord of Oop North]

I think it is essential to our survival that we figure out how to grow meat in vast vats. What happens when we colonize the stars?

Unless we figure out how to genetically engineer moon-cows, of course.

[NestorMakhnosLovechild]

i am a chef. i cook, serve and consume a lot of animals.

would i trade in my dry aged all natural beef or my ossobaw hog for some scientifically grown slab of meat with all the nutrients and qualities of these beasts?

i don't think i would. i know where my food comes from. i know the conditions the animals are raised in. i am comfortable with that. as a youth i grew up hunting and fishing with my father. the bulk of our meat was deer taken by us.

it is important to have a relationship with your food. most people do not have that.

i have no problem with other people's personal dietary choices, however.

The power of euphemisms to obscure simple facts cannot be understated. Saying that you have a "relationship" with your food is just an obscurantist way of saying something very simple - like that you went and toured the farms where the animals you purchase for your restaurant are raised, and may have conversed with the owners or representatives of those farms. I'm sure that if lab-grown meat becomes a thing (and I think, ultimately, it will), I'm sure you'd be able to tour the facility where the vat grown meat is cultivated and speak to the proprietors. You'd then have the same type of relationship with lab grown meat that you have now with your current suppliers.

Would that satisfy your objection, or is that objection really just a cover for something else?

[MercenaryChef]

The power of euphemisms to obscure simple facts cannot be understated. Saying that you have a "relationship" with your food is just an obscurantist way of saying something very simple - like that you went and toured the farms where the animals you purchase for your restaurant are raised, and may have conversed with the owners or representatives of those farms. I'm sure that if lab-grown meat becomes a thing (and I think, ultimately, it will), I'm sure you'd be able to tour the facility where the vat grown meat is cultivated and speak to the proprietors. You'd then have the same type of relationship with lab grown meat that you have now with your current suppliers.

Would that satisfy your objection, or is that objection really just a cover for something else?

perhaps i just enjoy stroking the soft face of a cute goat knowing he will grow up to be my curry or that having a hog eat out of my hand happily as i look him over and decide his culinary fate.

proper responsible farming and agriculture is not the issue at all. it is the megafarms pushing out hundreds of thousands of pounds of meat with no concern for animal welfare.

[Wise Fool]

Vegetarians are fine in my book, the people who are weak are the people who try not to think about where their food comes from.If you can't kill and butcher an animal or at least watch then you have no business eating meat.

What? Why? That's like saying if you can't wade through raw sewage you have no business using a toilet, or if you can't invade and destabilize oil-producing regions in order to leverage a political advantage you have no business using oil-based products.

I would amend your statement thus: "If you can't kill and butcher an animal, then you have no business being a butcher or working in a slaughterhouse." That one makes sense.

[DireWolfSpirit]

Whack em and stack em.

I think it would be great if the U.S. Grew the horse slaughter business exponentially.

Love this sound, aroma and taste forever!http://youtu.be/hihoilF0kGY

[felice]

Anyway like i said would be hypocritical to tell people to stop eating meat altogether as i havent just gone vegan altogether but am actively reducing how much dairy and eggs i consume and buy.

Oat milk is my favourite milk substitute; goes great on cereal or to drink with toast, and works fine for most cooking/baking purposes. You'll pry the real ice cream from my cold dead hands, though. (Well, actually I guess it will just melt out of my hands of its own accord, unless they're really cold, in which case I probably wouldn't have been eating ice cream in the first place.)

[snake]

Yeah. I find you needing meat to be killed and butchered before you can eat it pretty disturbing but YMMV.

It is a preference as I said. I know a lot of people are put off by it. Hell, some are put off by meat eaters in general. I really don't care about the eating habits of others(unless they be cannibals or something) so nothing really bothers me. And in a perfect world I'd know where all the meat I eat is from but having limited options I don't ask and I really don't care.

[Solmyr]

Ah, again with the "are we being assholes when it comes to animals" debate.

Yes, yes we are. We're also assholes to plants and mushrooms. We're pretty much assholes to all living and non-living matter we come in contact with. But you know what the worst part is? Being assholes to your own specie. It bothers me how many people would rather be assholes to their own species, than butcher a sow for their meal. It might be a vain attempt to gain some form of validation and moral high ground to deal with other issues, but on a meta level it simply means you're putting more value on another specie, compared to your own. Which, of course, is fundamentally wrong. If you think sows, chicken or any other animal we murder and devour is superior to humans, go join their civilisation. We didn't get the Earth handed to us to exploit, we won it over millennia of painful evolution, having to fight predators and harsh conditions all the way.

P.S. Aforementioned sow gets to have a 30 minute orgasm, so she probably experienced more true joy in her lifetime than you did. Cut the moral crap and cut yourself some bacon.

P.P.S. Regarding the specific question of meat grown in vats - I don't really care, meat is food and food is a resource. If they find a way to make meat out of pure hydrogen, as long as it gives the required calories and nutritions, it should be used. Good taste is an added bonus, but while there are malnourished people it's not a priority.

[Larry of the Lawn]

Ah, again with the "are we being assholes when it comes to animals" debate.

Yes, yes we are. We're also assholes to plants and mushrooms. We're pretty much assholes to all living and non-living matter we come in contact with. But you know what the worst part is? Being assholes to your own specie. It bothers me how many people would rather be assholes to their own species, than butcher a sow for their meal. It might be a vain attempt to gain some form of validation and moral high ground to deal with other issues, but on a meta level it simply means you're putting more value on another specie, compared to your own. Which, of course, is fundamentally wrong. If you think sows, chicken or any other animal we murder and devour is superior to humans, go join their civilisation. We didn't get the Earth handed to us to exploit, we won it over millennia of painful evolution, having to fight predators and harsh conditions all the way.

P.S. Aforementioned sow gets to have a 30 minute orgasm, so she probably experienced more true joy in her lifetime than you did. Cut the moral crap and cut yourself some bacon.

P.P.S. Regarding the specific question of meat grown in vats - I don't really care, meat is food and food is a resource. If they find a way to make meat out of pure hydrogen, as long as it gives the required calories and nutritions, it should be used. Good taste is an added bonus, but while there are malnourished people it's not a priority.

Pretty sure no one is saying this. So unless your point is that all vegetarians are assholes (which is obviously an untruth and at best a stupid observation), not sure what your point is. And the truth is that a lot of humans are total jerks and deserve to be treated as such, regardless of diet.

edit: Sci's words are better than mine

[Sci-2]

Ah, again with the "are we being assholes when it comes to animals" debate.

Yes, yes we are. We're also assholes to plants and mushrooms. We're pretty much assholes to all living and non-living matter we come in contact with. But you know what the worst part is? Being assholes to your own specie. It bothers me how many people would rather be assholes to their own species, than butcher a sow for their meal. It might be a vain attempt to gain some form of validation and moral high ground to deal with other issues, but on a meta level it simply means you're putting more value on another specie, compared to your own. Which, of course, is fundamentally wrong. If you think sows, chicken or any other animal we murder and devour is superior to humans, go join their civilisation. We didn't get the Earth handed to us to exploit, we won it over millennia of painful evolution, having to fight predators and harsh conditions all the way.

I don't know if this really counts as a definitive argument. You're basically saying X is bad, but Y is also bad and Y happens to humans.

Unless there is a direct set of circumstances where being a vegetarian/vegan is actual harming humans at the expense of animals[?] I suppose you could make an argument about job losses but this would imply an immediate cessation of meat eating being the best solution.

Now all that said, I do think the advocacy for stopping X is more compelling when it presents itself with an understanding that Y, Z, Q, etc are also bad and the person doing X may in fact be doing something about those other letters. OTOH, someone working against X may also be working against the other letters as well.

[felice]

It bothers me how many people would rather be assholes to their own species, than butcher a sow for their meal.

If it comes to a choice between butchering a sow or butchering a human, sure, I'd place significantly more value on the average human life. But when nobody actually needs to be butchered, I'm not inclined to be particularly sympathetic to anyone advocating butchery.

[Davrum]

Oat milk is my favourite milk substitute; goes great on cereal or to drink with toast, and works fine for most cooking/baking purposes. You'll pry the real ice cream from my cold dead hands, though. (Well, actually I guess it will just melt out of my hands of its own accord, unless they're really cold, in which case I probably wouldn't have been eating ice cream in the first place.)

As a lifelong ice cream fiend I can testify that Little Island coconut ice cream, which is dairy-free, is the best ice cream ever created by man.