(Spoilers) HBO's True Detective Season 2

[red snow]

The real question is did he turn down the blowjob because he's a stand up guy/cop, or because he knew he wouldn't be able to perform.

I have to admit I didn't pick up on the whole viagara scene but that all makes a lot more sense now. It also makes the ambiguity of whether he didn't accept the blowjob much more interesting because of the above.

I also got the impression he was disinterested in his girlfriend for the large part. So we could also add whether he can't get it up because of a physical or mental issue.

[Nictarion]

I have to admit I didn't pick up on the whole viagara scene but that all makes a lot more sense now. It also makes the ambiguity of whether he didn't accept the blowjob much more interesting because of the above.

I also got the impression he was disinterested in his girlfriend for the large part. So we could also add whether he can't get it up because of a physical or mental issue.

His GF is gorgeous, I'm assuming it's a mental issue. Likely something to do with his childhood (the scars on his shoulders), or his time as a mercenary. Or both.

[Kalbear]

His GF is gorgeous, I'm assuming it's a mental issue. Likely something to do with his childhood (the scars on his shoulders), or his time as a mercenary. Or both.

or he's gay.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

OAR,

Anyone else think for a moment that they were going to repeat the interview/flashback framing when Colin Farrell was talking to the lawyer? I feel like that was a deliberate fake out, or at least a nod to S1 if nothing else.

I'm more excited to see where this goes after watching the first episode than I was before the season began. I wasn't crazy about the final few episodes of S1 so I wasn't expecting much, but so far this new season has differentiated itself from the first nicely while retaining some of what worked from the first- the mood feels the same and it's nice to look at, basically.

May I ask what you disliked about the final few episodes of Season 1?

[OnionAhaiReborn]

OAR,

May I ask what you disliked about the final few episodes of Season 1?

On purely an entertainment level, I think the show lost something once the entire narrative reached 'present day.' The interview/flashback framing generated a lot of the mystery and intrigue, and it reached a point where we basically knew who these two were how and how they had gotten to where they were. Then Cohle presents Hart (and the audience) with conclusive evidence about who is behind the killings, all the tension between them settles and they go about wrapping things up. The series' best 'moments'- the long tracking shot and the arrest/killing of LeDoux and associates- happened mid season and nothing approached them after.

I also think the show turned out not to be 'about' anything terribly interesting, at least when it came to what it had to say about its central characters (which, on a show like this, is a big piece). Them coming together to do their duty and get their man was not what I had in mind, I had trouble seeing that pair as points of light in the darkness. Particularly in the case of Hart, it felt like there was absolution (he gets his family's love back!) without recognition of his real flaws. The show seemingly made a point of his glaring misogyny, and signaled at a 'Yellow King'/abuse cult connection to his own family life and went nowhere with it. I wasn't expecting a literal connection, necessarily, but my read was that Hart, while on the right side of the law, shared a kind of paternalistic brutishness with the Tuttles, his protective impulse and sense of duty only a more benign version of their outright depravity. In any case, none of that. He helped Cohle, did his duty, vaguely seemed to recognize he had been kind of a heel, and that was that.

I don't know, maybe I imposed my expectations too heavily as it went along, but it fell flat for me.

[red snow]

or he's gay.

or asexual.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

OAR,

That is an interesting criticism of the close. I disagree to an extent. That Hart's family showed up while he was in the Hospital is not absolution for his many faults. It as sign that they care about him, at a minimum. I'll have to rewatch that scene sometime because I seem to remember the daughter he had difficulty with hanging back from the big hug. That suggested to me that she came but that she still wasn't in for the "Dad's awesome" moment.

I liked the fact that there was some resolution but not complete resolution. It would have been beyond the pale for these two PI's to bring down some major conspiracy within the Louisiana government. But taking out this one loose end, that seemed more believable to me. I also appreciated Chole's moments of catharsis both in the fortress and with Hart outside the Hospital.

[Weeping Sore]

I was hoping for a better intro song...

Their choice of an opening song was incredibly lame...

You are both philistines. It's Leonard Cohen. It's possible no greater writer of lyrics has ever lived.

The war was lost

The treaty signed

I was not caught

I crossed the line

I was not caught

Though many tried

I live among you

Well disguised

I had to leave

My life behind

I dug some graves

You'll never find

The story's told

With facts and lies

I have a name

But nevermind

Nevermind

Nevermind

The war was lost

The treaty signed

There's truth that lives

And truth that dies

I don't know which

So nevermind

Your victory

Was so complete

Some among you

Thought to keep

A record of

Our little lives

The clothes we wore

Our spoons, our knives

The games of luck

Our soldiers played

The stones we cut

The songs we made

Our law of peace

Which understands

A husband leads

A wife commands

And all of this

Expressions of

The sweet indifference

Some call love

The high indifference

Some call fate

But we had names

More intimate

Names so deep and

Names so true

They're blood to me

They're dust to you

There is no need

That this survive

There's truth that lives

And truth that dies

Nevermind

Nevermind

I live the life

I left behind

There's truth that lives

And truth that dies

I don't know which

So nevermind

I could not kill

The way you kill

I could not hate

I tried I failed

You turned me in

At least you tried

You side with them

Whom you despise

This was your heart

This swarm of flies

This was once your mouth

This bowl of lies

You serve them well

I'm not surprised

You're of their kin

You're of their kind

Nevermind

Nevermind

I had to leave my life behind

The story's told

With facts and lies

You own the world

So nevermind

Nevermind

Nevermind

I live the life

I left behind

I live it full

I live it wide

Through layers of time

You can't divide

My woman's here

My children too

Their graves are safe

From ghosts like you

In places deep

With roots entwined

I live the life I left behind

The war was lost

The treaty signed

I was not caught

I crossed the line

I was not caught

Though many tried

I live among you

Well disguised

My complaint was nothing after the opening song was as good. Too much throat-clearing in the first episode, but I like Colin Farrell a lot. The Rachel MacAdams family psychodrama seemed a little to early (i.e., before we care) but I hope we get more of cult-leader dad David Morse. I I was expecting to like V.V.'s performance more, but he seemed very stiff and hemmed in for some reason. Some of the dialogue was pretty deadly, and his wife was supposed to be some kind of smooth operator but she just kind of seemed listless and medicated. Definitely not great after one ep. We'll see.

[aceluby]

On purely an entertainment level, I think the show lost something once the entire narrative reached 'present day.' The interview/flashback framing generated a lot of the mystery and intrigue, and it reached a point where we basically knew who these two were how and how they had gotten to where they were. Then Cohle presents Hart (and the audience) with conclusive evidence about who is behind the killings, all the tension between them settles and they go about wrapping things up. The series' best 'moments'- the long tracking shot and the arrest/killing of LeDoux and associates- happened mid season and nothing approached them after.

I also think the show turned out not to be 'about' anything terribly interesting, at least when it came to what it had to say about its central characters (which, on a show like this, is a big piece). Them coming together to do their duty and get their man was not what I had in mind, I had trouble seeing that pair as points of light in the darkness. Particularly in the case of Hart, it felt like there was absolution (he gets his family's love back!) without recognition of his real flaws. The show seemingly made a point of his glaring misogyny, and signaled at a 'Yellow King'/abuse cult connection to his own family life and went nowhere with it. I wasn't expecting a literal connection, necessarily, but my read was that Hart, while on the right side of the law, shared a kind of paternalistic brutishness with the Tuttles, his protective impulse and sense of duty only a more benign version of their outright depravity. In any case, none of that. He helped Cohle, did his duty, vaguely seemed to recognize he had been kind of a heel, and that was that.

I don't know, maybe I imposed my expectations too heavily as it went along, but it fell flat for me.

This is exactly how I felt about it Episode 4 and part of 5 were the peak and the rest of the season really failed to deliver. I expected it to go deeper after the first 4 episodes and it just turned into another crime drama that was solved on a frankly stupid connection, plus I felt the dialogue fell quite a bit after episode 4 as well.

Will probably watch it tonight, but I don't have high expectations TBH.

[Iskaral Pust]

On purely an entertainment level, I think the show lost something once the entire narrative reached 'present day.' The interview/flashback framing generated a lot of the mystery and intrigue, and it reached a point where we basically knew who these two were how and how they had gotten to where they were. Then Cohle presents Hart (and the audience) with conclusive evidence about who is behind the killings, all the tension between them settles and they go about wrapping things up. The series' best 'moments'- the long tracking shot and the arrest/killing of LeDoux and associates- happened mid season and nothing approached them after.

I also think the show turned out not to be 'about' anything terribly interesting, at least when it came to what it had to say about its central characters (which, on a show like this, is a big piece). Them coming together to do their duty and get their man was not what I had in mind, I had trouble seeing that pair as points of light in the darkness. Particularly in the case of Hart, it felt like there was absolution (he gets his family's love back!) without recognition of his real flaws. The show seemingly made a point of his glaring misogyny, and signaled at a 'Yellow King'/abuse cult connection to his own family life and went nowhere with it. I wasn't expecting a literal connection, necessarily, but my read was that Hart, while on the right side of the law, shared a kind of paternalistic brutishness with the Tuttles, his protective impulse and sense of duty only a more benign version of their outright depravity. In any case, none of that. He helped Cohle, did his duty, vaguely seemed to recognize he had been kind of a heel, and that was that.

I don't know, maybe I imposed my expectations too heavily as it went along, but it fell flat for me.

I think that's a good critique and well articulated. Marty's flaws were swept away too easily, including his violent possessiveness of his mistress, and the abuse of power involved. Lots of parallels with the crime and the original political cover-up that ultimately seemed pointless.

[Lady Olenna]

I wasn't wild about the chase scene in season one between Childress and Cohle. Was a bit silly for me.

Loved seeing Healy (oitnb) as Garaci - he seems to play goofy sleaze well.

I didn't even recognize Brown as Dixon. I knew he was familiar and I liked him instantly - then I did a partial rewatch and the light went on - Dan D!

I like Woodrugh's character the most so far. The job is everything to him, gives him purpose and freedom. Since he's on the sideline for a bullshit bj my guess is that he will take a lot of interest in Caspere's death. And I think it says more about the little shit that reported him for trading services to get out of a ticket - I would bet that she's never been turned down and her ego got the best of her.

[Alia of the knife]

I like it so far.

Not as "gothic" as most things set in the South, but compelling in terms of "California creepy."

[Nictarion]

Already a thread for this here http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/128910-spoilers-hbos-true-detective-season-2/

I liked the 1st episode btw.

[Lovely Lyanna]

On purely an entertainment level, I think the show lost something once the entire narrative reached 'present day.' The interview/flashback framing generated a lot of the mystery and intrigue, and it reached a point where we basically knew who these two were how and how they had gotten to where they were. Then Cohle presents Hart (and the audience) with conclusive evidence about who is behind the killings, all the tension between them settles and they go about wrapping things up. The series' best 'moments'- the long tracking shot and the arrest/killing of LeDoux and associates- happened mid season and nothing approached them after.

I also think the show turned out not to be 'about' anything terribly interesting, at least when it came to what it had to say about its central characters (which, on a show like this, is a big piece). Them coming together to do their duty and get their man was not what I had in mind, I had trouble seeing that pair as points of light in the darkness. Particularly in the case of Hart, it felt like there was absolution (he gets his family's love back!) without recognition of his real flaws. The show seemingly made a point of his glaring misogyny, and signaled at a 'Yellow King'/abuse cult connection to his own family life and went nowhere with it. I wasn't expecting a literal connection, necessarily, but my read was that Hart, while on the right side of the law, shared a kind of paternalistic brutishness with the Tuttles, his protective impulse and sense of duty only a more benign version of their outright depravity. In any case, none of that. He helped Cohle, did his duty, vaguely seemed to recognize he had been kind of a heel, and that was that.

I don't know, maybe I imposed my expectations too heavily as it went along, but it fell flat for me.

i understand what you are saying about the ending. It just was not satisfying. I did not mind the present day scenes, but I did think the ending was a bit disappointing in the fact that the only criminal left to arrest was some inbred freak. I also was disappointed that the issue with Marti's daughter was never resolved. They hinted at a connection throughout the series and then just left that dangling. I loved the series and thought that Rust and Marty were a nice balance for each other. I pretty much enjoyed all of the episodes until the ending.

[Veltigar]

Already a thread for this here http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/128910-spoilers-hbos-true-detective-season-2/

I liked the 1st episode btw.

Wow, threadception :stunned:

[The Lord of Cinder]

I'm still onboard and looking forward to the season, and I actually have a feeling that the show will be stronger at the end than the beginning (the opposite of last season, I think), so we'll see how it goes.

I'm very much in the same boat. I liked the episode, didn't love it, and I only liked it to the extent I did because I have a feeling this whole setup for the characters will be worth it now that the story gets going. I kinda like the overly dark tone, but maybe that's because I view the show more as a noir cop drama with occasional supernatural elements, than a realistic, but dark TV drama. Yet, as much as I want to like this season, I can't help but miss Rust and Marty. There was one thought in my head the entire time when I watched the episode, and that was: "I want to watch season 1 again".

I was really hoping VV would surprise us all and kick it out of the park, but even to me, who's not a native english speaker and finds it somewhat harder to detect awkward acting, he seemed wooden.

[The Human Abstract]

Liked it and am definitely on board.

Felt it was a bit overdone at times. Lingering camera, constant shots of the industrial parts of the city, every single character being completely mental, etc. It's almost too much, and I was definitely rolling my eyes in a few moments.

[Howdyphillip]

I thought the first half of this episode was a confusing mess and poorly acted and directed all the way around. Vince Vaughn's performance was particularly egregious. There was a sense that he didn't know his character, but everyone seemed a bit off in the opening as well.

Somewhere around the time Colin Farrell donned his ski mask, the episode started grabbing my attention and pulled me in to the story. It really significantly changed in acting quality. Even the cinematography, which had been heavy handed at the beginning started incorporating the city of LA into a character of itself.

This is not Harrelson and McConaughey, so there is no chance that it will be as good as last year, but there are certainly things to both like and dislike, and it seems worth while to stay around and watch.

[The Human Abstract]

What's strange is that I read an early review of the first few episodes that Vaughn did an excellent job, but the performance I saw there was definitely wooden. I'm going to guess (hope) that perhaps he gets better as it goes along.

[Veltigar]

What's strange is that I read an early review of the first few episodes that Vaughn did an excellent job, but the performance I saw there was definitely wooden. I'm going to guess (hope) that perhaps he gets better as it goes along.

They are probably setting him up as the really calm one, untill in a couple of episodes he has a disturbing villain moment to show that he's actually just as unhinged as the other characters.