Covid-19 #37: Mississippi Worming

[Zorral]

I was reading a small survey of people who work in gyms, bars and restaurants regarding NYC's mandate on vaccination proof for being indoors at such venues (and others too, such as museums). I was particularly struck by one owner who was furious at such a mandate, because it had, he declared, reduced his business over half.  Of course he seems not to have noticed that the mandate wasn't in  place yet, early last week, and even now is still not being enforced and won't be until a month later.  It also never seems to have occurred to him that with Delta's incredible transmissibility that a whole lot of people may just have stopped again going to restaurants, even those of us who are fully vaccinated, and particularly to one that the neighborhood knows is run by somebody totally lax and angry about reading vaccine cards, etc.

We have stopped going anywhere, already, weeks ago due to Delta, like just about everybody else we know too, who like us are fully vaccinated. Particularly this is the case for those who got vaccinated really early -- who are now eagerly awaiting the booster.

 

[KingintheNorth4]

Update on my Uncle: While he's still on the ventilator, they've turned it down some. If he continues to show improvement over the next 48 hours, the doctors will start to wean him off the ventilator.

[Derfel Cadarn]

Cases rising in Scotland, the Scottish First Minister has fired a warning shot about possible restrictions to hopefully stop people acting like it’s all over. Half of the cases are young people, and schools went back a week or two ago (depending on the area).

[Raja]

40 minutes ago, KingintheNorth4 said:

Update on my Uncle: While he's still on the ventilator, they've turned it down some. If he continues to show improvement over the next 48 hours, the doctors will start to wean him off the ventilator.

Hope your uncle gets better. I'm sorry you're going through this rough time

Came across this thread about VE based on real world data that we have, imo, it's worth checking out as it links to a lot of the primary evidence regarding vaccine effectiveness, specifically when it comes to hospitalizations & deaths

Next month the UK is rolling out booster shots for certain select groups, including the clinically vulnerable & front line health workers ( the former is a fair call, I suppose). Which means I will likely be offered a booster dose - but based on everything that I have seen, I am not sure why I should be getting a booster dose ( late 20s, healthy, no medical issues).  In addition, I think offering booster doses to the whole population ( not just certain groups) would be a mistake when we don't have first doses in so many other countries that are seeing pretty bad outbreaks.

[Maithanet]

Ugh.  NIH director says that vaccine approval for kids 5-11 is not expected soon.

Quote

Francis Collins, director of the National Institutes of Health, suggested it could take months after receipt of that data for the regulatory agency to grant an emergency authorization to Pfizer’s vaccine for use among children under 12 "I got to be honest, I don’t see approval for kids 5 to 11 coming much before the end of 2021,” Collins told NPR in an interview.

Anthony Fauci, the nation’s top infectious disease expert and President Joe Biden’s chief medical adviser, gave a more optimistic assessment Tuesday, saying Pfizer’s shot could secure FDA authorization for younger children as early as fall of this year.

Pfizer is expected to deliver the data in the next month, and normal review takes 4-6 weeks, so if you do that math, it seems like Dr. Fauci's timeline makes a lot more sense.  It is extremely frustrating that it seems like all the urgency to get people vaccinated has disappeared when talking about vaccines for kids.

[Paladin of Ice]

14 hours ago, mcbigski said:

I went shopping today for groceries and about 75% of the customers had cloth masks on.  Though the kids mostly had them below their noses.  I felt exactly as safe as i did 2 months ago when it was more like 5%.  

Choose life not fear.

 

Get fucked.

-An overworked and underpaid medical laboratory technician

[HoodedCrow]

B.C. Is doing vaccine passports. I guess they will make a real ID out of my hand made films one. They are going to be required at all major venues. Masking is back on. I guess they have seen the stats about Delta, so I hear.

[Fragile Bird]

31 minutes ago, HoodedCrow said:

B.C. Is doing vaccine passports. I guess they will make a real ID out of my hand made films one. They are going to be required at all major venues. Masking is back on. I guess they have seen the stats about Delta, so I hear.

That’s because BC doesn’t have a Conservative government, although it sounds like Manitoba is interested in the idea, following what Quebec has done. Alberta, of course, has announced via Premier Kenney that ‘you can’t live in fear’ <snorts and giggles> just like Saskatchewan and Ontario.

[HoodedCrow]

Bonny Henry has been a rockstar. Yes, it helps that they are not cons.

[williamjm]

2 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Cases rising in Scotland, the Scottish First Minister has fired a warning shot about possible restrictions to hopefully stop people acting like it’s all over. Half of the cases are young people, and schools went back a week or two ago (depending on the area).

There may be multiple causes but I think the opening up of nightclubs for the first time in the pandemic a couple of weeks ago might be significant as well. I seem to remember something similar happening in the Netherlands after they opened up nightclubs, although it didn't seem to make a difference in England when they opened up in mid-July.

[Zorral]

What is wrong with this sentence?

https://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-covid-fauci-spring-2022-20210824-qzhyfahxmjgm7gh43omisyfrqm-story.html

Quote

He called the rapid full approval of the Pfizer vaccination a glimmer of hope as the nation seeks to claw its way out of the current COVID surge engineered by the delta variant.

 

[Clueless Northman]

Engineered by the "Delta variant"? Did they mispell "anti-vaxxers"?

[Zorral]

5 minutes ago, Clueless Northman said:

Engineered by the "Delta variant"? Did they mispell "anti-vaxxers"?

Right the first time.  

 

37 minutes ago, Zorral said:

the current COVID surge engineered by the delta variant.

Virii aren't sentient and do not engineer.  The current Covid surge is caused by homo saps who won't get vaccinated or do anything else to mitigate the contagion.

This was in the piece about Fauci announcing there is no way to expect an end to this at least until spring 2022 -- if indeed, by then a much dangerous and powerful variant hasn't emerged by then because of all the same saps, who are determined to keep us unable to travel, work the work we were born to do, or anything beyond just keeping going.

 

[Ormond]

17 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Oh good grief yourself you fuddy-duddy!

That is specifically something that one should assume comes up over the course of dating someone long enough to consider marrying them. I think it has with a majority of women I've dated for more than a few months. 

And how on earth does this come up when one is dating? It doesn't seem to be a necessarily common conversation topic to me. I think your personal experience may be unusual. 

[Ormond]

16 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

I mean, on the assumption that children might be in the mix at some point I think it is kind of a significant pre-nuptial conversation. For me personally I would certainly not be marrying anyone who was going to fight me on vaccinating our kids. That would be a deal breaker, not only because of a direct conflict on the issue of vaccinating our kids, but it would also mean a terminal loss of respect and thus a fatal blow any prospects of a marital relationship. Come to think of it, even if married I would be very seriously considering divorce if it became revealed after the fact. But that is only me. People may have a higher relationship tolerance for anti-science beliefs especially when laced with elements of conspiracy. I have no space in my life for those kinds of people.

Again, I have no idea when she developed her anti-vaccination attitudes. People's opinions on this issue can change, just as they can on many other things. 

P.S. And I suspect the % of people who think they'd divorce a spouse it they developed any one belief different from theirs after marriage who would actually do it when push comes to shove is rather low, just like the % of people who've claimed they'll quit jobs when forced to get the vaccine who actually do so. 

[Fragile Bird]

As I have repeatedly mentioned, my SiL has become an anti-vaxxer out of the blue. She certainly got all the required vaccines and more over the years, but spending time on the internet changed her. My brother is not planning on divorcing her.

[The Anti-Targ]

Really, leaders of friendly nations should STFU about decisions each other makes on COVID policies. But it seems some, like Scott Morrison, feel the need to do so in order to deflect from his part in failing to keep COVID out of Australia with it seems the NSW govt now waving the white flag and admitting they will never get rid of it. And hence the rest of Australia will go that way too, sooner rather than later.

Morrison is saying NZ is dumb for still pursuing elimination. But it appears to me he wants us to fail, because if we succeed it means Aussie could have succeeded too if it had made different decisions. We may yet fail, but it would be nice if our friends would wish us well in our attempt, and offer sympathies if it doesn't work out. That's what friends are meant to do. But with friends like the Aus govt, who needs enemies?

[Padraig]

5 hours ago, Maithanet said:

Ugh.  NIH director says that vaccine approval for kids 5-11 is not expected soon.

Pfizer is expected to deliver the data in the next month, and normal review takes 4-6 weeks, so if you do that math, it seems like Dr. Fauci's timeline makes a lot more sense.  It is extremely frustrating that it seems like all the urgency to get people vaccinated has disappeared when talking about vaccines for kids.

I wonder do these things normally take longer when they involve kids?  The risk equation has to be even more positive.

14 hours ago, RhaenysBee said:

We are stagnating around 100ish cases per day, which is still very good and very lucky. 

That corner involving Poland, Slovakia, Hungary and Czech have done very well so far.  Good luck!

[The Anti-Targ]

24 minutes ago, Padraig said:

I wonder do these things normally take longer when they involve kids?  The risk equation has to be even more positive.

 

I can't really comment with any specific knowledge, but I would say that simply by the way clinical trials work approval for use of any vaccine or drug in kids will come some timer after approval for adults. Generally speaking drugs and vaccines can only be approved for demographics that have been subject to the trials. And trials on kids will be some way down the track with just about anything. In the case of COVID vaccine, with the OG virus and even Alpha I think the view was kids didn;t catch it as easily, barely suffered and they didn't spread the disease much even when infected. So there was no urgency in getting the vaccines approved for kids. Delta has changed that, and it appears kids are now epidemiologically significant so vaccination of pretty much anyone older than infancy will be beneficial both at an individual and population level.

And on that note, it seems there is no longer any value in reporting % vaccinated in terms of the adult population, or over 16s. The higher % this presents gives people a false sense of safety. The only vaccination statistic that should be reported is total population %, with the % of population that is eligible for vaccination on the basis of the current approvals for the vaccines in parenthesis, but if you want to know how bad a wave can get then you need to know total population immunity, not just immunity of the population that can be vaccinated.

[Xray the Enforcer]

2 hours ago, Ormond said:

P.S. And I suspect the % of people who think they'd divorce a spouse it they developed any one belief different from theirs after marriage who would actually do it when push comes to shove is rather low

 

1 hour ago, L'oiseau français said:

As I have repeatedly mentioned, my SiL has become an anti-vaxxer out of the blue. She certainly got all the required vaccines and more over the years, but spending time on the internet changed her. My brother is not planning on divorcing her.

Be all of this as it may, I would ask people on both sides of this particular debate (not just the two folks quote above) to be mindful that someone who reads these threads just had to break up with their long-term live-in partner because the partner became an anti-vaxxer and being anti-vax endangers the boarder's health and life. A little compassion would go a long way, in this situation.