(Spoilers) FX The Americans v.3

[red snow]

6 hours ago, dooog said:

Thought it was a slightly disappointing finale. All in all the season was alright, but honestly, i'd say it was the weakest one, to date. I rate this show highly and expected a lot more but it all felt a little stale, it would have benefited enormously from some fresh blood, not just a couple of new small fry.

In comparison to other shows I've seen this this year I'd say it was a better season. I think the show is very consistent making it hard to judge any season against the other. I liked the second because that felt like the window where we saw Philip and Elizabeth at their best as agents. They'd resolved their relationship issues and were so great at their jobs (it was the handler putting them under pressure not the other way around). But that's just a thematic thing not an actual quality call for me.

I do think a weak finale has a tendency to have a knock on effect on the whole season though. Experience vs memory something showrunners should keep in mind. I think they do as many shows are terrible throughout but end on a high.

[Castel]

15 hours ago, red snow said:

In comparison to other shows I've seen this this year I'd say it was a better season. 

Both Peaky Blinders and Orphan Black have been disappointing this season too. 

I definitely feel like the finale has tempered my view of the season. Maybe it shouldn't, since it was fun while it was happening, but there it is. Maybe on a rewatch I'll appreciate it more. 

[red snow]

3 hours ago, Castel said:

Both Peaky Blinders and Orphan Black have been disappointed this season too. 

I definitely feel like the finale has tempered my view of the season. Maybe it shouldn't, since it was fun while it was happening, but there it is. Maybe on a rewatch I'll appreciate it more. 

Same with Black sails. I guess i can't complain when shows set such high standards. I think there's only Better Call Saul (which was as good as season 1) and "Line of duty" that have managed to at least remain at the same level as previous seasons.  Person of Interest is shaping up pretty well but it has the added pressure of ending the whole series well.

It is strange for a show to have 12 great episodes and one off-kilter one though.

[Fragile Bird]

I have been listening to an audio book by a former NYT reporter about the behind the scenes story at the Warren Commission.  Two interesting facts that have come up, one being that Mexico City had been spy central for the KGB, not Washington, at least into the 60s.  I wonder if that was still the case by 1980.

The second was the story of Yuri Nosenko, a Soviet KGB agent who had defected to the Americans in Switzerland, and brought to the USA.  There was controversy about whether or not he was a real defector or a Soviet plant.  The CIA was suspicious, the FBI accepted his claim that he had seen the file on Lee Harvey Oswald and that the KGB had rejected him as a recruit because after interviewing him determined he was too unstable to use as an agent.

The CIA had him locked up in solitary confinement for over 3 years, in a tiny, windowless cell lit by a single bare lightbulb that was never turned off.  He was denied basic necessities, even as basic as a toothbrush and toothpaste, for months at a time, and was psychologically and physically tortured.

I understand the story got out, and the Russian agents in the US would probably be familiar with it, making the idea of defecting something they would have to seriously worry about out if the defection went wrong.

There's a Wikipedia article on Nosenko, if anyone is interested.

[dooog]

On 11/6/2016 at 8:09 AM, red snow said:

 

I do think a weak finale has a tendency to have a knock on effect on the whole season though. Experience vs memory something showrunners should keep in mind. I think they do as many shows are terrible throughout but end on a high.

Not really, I said a couple times earlier in the season on this thread I thought it was a weak season. It picked up near the end, albeit with a weak finale, but i'd still say it was my least favourite season to date. Still better than most of the shite on tv but weak by it's own high standard.

[Jaxom 1974]

Finally caught up.  

I enjoyed the show immensely. I actually felt bad for Gad and Arkady.  I do still wonder why Gad was being approached though..will that come back?

I think all of the season enders for this show have all been slow boilers more about setting up the next season rather than being about the "boom".

[Martini Sigil]

My wife and I were invited to a premiere in NYC for a movie called The Eyes .... One of the main characters is Danny Flaherty (Mathew Beeman) ... It was driving me nuts trying to remember where I knew him from.... It clicked about 3/4 of the way through the flick....lol

[Fragile Bird]

The joys of spending time at the spa and reading the trashy gossip magazines...

Keri Russell and Matthew Rhys, Elizabeth and Phillip, started a relationship and Russell is now pregnant.

So those vibes between them are real.

http://www.people.com/article/keri-russell-matthews-rhys-insider-americans-costars-expectant-parents-love-story

 

 

[MisterOJ]

36 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

The joys of spending time at the spa and reading the trashy gossip magazines...

Keri Russell and Matthew Rhys, Elizabeth and Phillip, started a relationship and Russell is now pregnant.

So those vibes between them are real.

http://www.people.com/article/keri-russell-matthews-rhys-insider-americans-costars-expectant-parents-love-story

 

 

They should totally name the kid Paige, if its a girl and Henry if it's a boy.

[Spockydog]

9 minutes ago, MisterOJ said:

They should totally name the kid Paige, if its a girl and Henry if it's a boy.

[Fragile Bird]

15 minutes ago, MisterOJ said:

They should totally name the kid Paige, if its a girl and Henry if it's a boy.

I wonder if they would write the pregnancy into the script....probably not, what if she lost the baby.

But the names idea is very hilarious!

[Dr. Pepper]

She had the baby months ago.  

[Fragile Bird]

27 minutes ago, Dr. Pepper said:

She had the baby months ago.  

Ah, I did not even look at the date, since the spa I go to always has up-to-date magazines.  Someone was falling down on the job, tsk tsk!

[mcbigski]

 

Fell behind on this season, just watched 80%+ of the finale.  DVR said 1:17 length but it cut out at about 1:03.  Will was hacking up blood and about to say something portentious to Aderholt and Stan.  Can't find it On Demand, so what happened in the last several minutes of the final episode?

[RumHam]

I just binged season four, and then this thread. Some thoughts:

On 3/24/2016 at 4:18 PM, Jack Bauer 24 said:

Nina has plot armor. She isn't going anywhere.

 

On 4/28/2016 at 4:18 PM, Jack Bauer 24 said:

Yeah I agree this season is the worst so far.

http://www.metacritic.com/tv/the-americans/season-4)

(https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/the_americans/s04/)

On 5/19/2016 at 4:01 PM, Jack Bauer 24 said:

Why did Phillip visit Kimmy? Also thought it was weird she said her father is in the CIA and that was a surprise? I checked the wiki and it already had her dad listed as a CIA agent.

On 5/19/2016 at 8:17 PM, Jack Bauer 24 said:

I guarantee that's how Martha comes back into the story. She's a former American secretary, so that will suffice.

I miss him. I really do.

Anyway I liked it. Young-Hee was amazing, I assume all the posts to this effect were lost in the forum upgrade? She was the best. 

Someone earlier in the thread called the season four premier "3x14" which was right on. I would take it further and argue that season three didn't really end until the time jump in episode eight. This show just does not seem to give a fuck about aligning it's plotting with the constraints of television production. My first instinct is to say that's not a bad thing. There's nothing worse than a series killing time because they had to make X episodes this year. But still almost every other great TV drama has managed to produce individual seasons that somehow felt like self contained chapters while also being part of the larger whole. 

Of course this wont be an issue in the long run. Ultimately more people will stream this show after it's ended than ever watched it live. But for those of us who are watching it as it comes out it can be frustrating. Though this season's ending wasn't nearly as bad as last's, which left the Martha and Paige plots up in the air. 

On 6/4/2016 at 5:39 AM, red snow said:

Also, was Oleg's discussion about Challenger setting up a potential KGB sabotage of the ship? That would be a ballsy yet really interesting idea.

I dunno, it seems "too soon" for me. But then that explosion is one of my earliest memories. I suppose if they're thinking of the endgame of the show, it's practically on the same level of Don Draper inventing that Coke commercial. Except presumably seven people didn't die filming that Coke commercial. (Probably two, tops.) 

I'd prefer if Phillip and Elizibeth just started trying to get the Challenger plans or whatever. They work a NASA asset and shit goes down as it always does to complicate things. Eventually they have the challenger plans in their hands but can't hand them off. Then they finally do, after great sacrifice (why not a child, since the show is ending anyway?) only to watch in horror as the shuttle blows up. Henry is horrified because of the loss of life, while they are horrified that they sacrificed their daughter for revolutionary rocket technology that just exploded. 

 

 

 

[Annara Snow]

On 5/27/2016 at 2:07 AM, Risto said:

Yeah... The best part of Elizabeth is that you are truly never sure whether she is manipulating someone or being genuinely emotional. With Pastor Tim, I suppose there is both of those, but in comparison to Phillip's characters where you can see when he is manipulating and when he is sincere, Elizabeth is someone who never truly takes off that manipulative mask. That of course doesn't mean she is incapable of deep emotions. It is just how she lives.

I don't see the difference. Both of them are usually sincere and manipulating their targets at the same time, and you aren't sure where the difference is. They both often use parts of their real experiences and feelings as part of their lies. It's a good tactic, since the best lies always have truth in them - it makes them more convincing. We've seen Elizabeth do that, for instance, with the young soldier in season 2, when she used her real rape (which we saw in the flashback in episode 1 and which she still thinks about at times, as when she had the nightmare about Paige discovering Pastor Tim's dead body, before Tim turns into Elizabeth's dead rapist and tries to rape Paige) as a part of the fake story about Lee Tergesen's character. Philip has done the same with Annalise, Martha and Kimmy, using his real feelings and issues as a part of the lie (as when he talked to Martha about having problems at work, or when he told Annalise that it's incredibly difficult for him to make the woman he loves go and have sex with other men for the mission - he made it look like he was talking about her, when he was clearly really talking about Elizabeth).

I don't see this season as disappointing at all. The show has been strong from season 1 to season 4. I may have a slight preference for season 3, but this season had really strong arcs for Nina (one of the rare examples on recent TV where death was treated really well, and made sense for the character, rather than just using her as a plot device) and Martha. The storyline about the Koreans was pretty strong, as was William's end.

This show doesn't usually do big, spectacular finales. Except maybe for season 2, with the twist revelation about the murder mystery, and the revelation about the Center wanting Paige.

[Mladen]

28 minutes ago, Annara Snow said:

I don't see the difference. Both of them are usually sincere and manipulating their targets at the same time, and you aren't sure where the difference is. They both often use parts of their real experiences and feelings as part of their lies. It's a good tactic, since the best lies always have truth in them - it makes them more convincing. We've seen Elizabeth do that, for instance, with the young soldier in season 2, when she used her real rape (which we saw in the flashback in episode 1 and which she still thinks about at times, as when she had the nightmare about Paige discovering Pastor Tim's dead body, before Tim turns into Elizabeth's dead rapist and tries to rape Paige) as a part of the fake story about Lee Tergesen's character. Philip has done the same with Annalise, Martha and Kimmy, using his real feelings and issues as a part of the lie (as when he talked to Martha about having problems at work, or when he told Annalise that it's incredibly difficult for him to make the woman he loves go and have sex with other men for the mission - he made it look like he was talking about her, when he was clearly really talking about Elizabeth).

I think that generally Phillip is the one who is slightly better in separating manipulations from the real emotions (especially in their marriage). As has been established, both of them are very successful in their work because they are very good in understanding people and their emotions and shaping and using them accordingly. But, with Elizabeth, I sometimes get the feeling that it never ends, even with Phillip. IMO, Phillip is good in manipulating others and their emotions, while also caring for them (just as Elizabeth is), but Elizabeth also brings that in their marriage life. Most of their problems, well marriage problems, are rooted in the fact that Phillip isn't 100% sure to what extent is what they have a real thing for her, or a mission. He knows he loves her but he questions her as the obvious shadow of their work is constantly upon them. 

[red snow]

I'd say Phillip is more invested in his manipulations even though he's perfectly aware he's doing so.

Then again Elizabeth showed this season that she can get cut up when becoming attached to marks. I think the main difference is that Elizabeth's marks tend to be short term because it's often seducing men for sex whereas Phillip seems to have to make people fall in love with him .It may just be that the difference between them is that Phillip gets more of the deep level marks than Elizabeth rather than a reflection of them as people? Eg Elizabeth may tend to think Phillip is "like all the men she has to deal with" while Phillip is insecure about the fact he can't make the woman he loves fall in love with him - when he does this so often with his marks?

[HexMachina]

I'm behind you all at the moment, coming to the last few episodes of season 3 which has been my favourite so far, plenty of unexpected developments, wonderful work by Keri Russel as ever (I really was enthralled and emotional during the scene in Do Mail Robots Dream of Electric Sheep with the old lady) and some really interesting stuff with Paige. I feel so bad for Martha

My only criticisms are a lack of Nina and too much Stan. I do not like Stan or the actor portraying him, he is completely forgettable and I have trouble recalling scenes he has been in.

Oh, I was also watching the episode with Analise and the suitcase while eating. Gross.

[Mark Antony]

Rhys and Russell both got golden globes noms. Hope they win, best leads on TV imo.