UK Politics: Not even a Penny for a new Prime Minister

[DMC]

11 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

Yeah I’ll see if I can get Hilary Cass’ email for you, so you can mansplain to her the basic errors in the report you didn’t read. 

Ha!  Must have really pushed a button for you to give such an absurdly stupid response!  Good luck there snowflake!

[Ran]

Ahem. Civility, folks.

 

[Spockydog]

Let's see if this guy is pursued by the Gammon Press as vigourously as Angela Raynor.

 

 

[DMC]

BTW, Cass’ report is 388 pages long, including appendices.  Please respond if you can honestly tell me you read all 388 pages.

[Week]

52 minutes ago, DMC said:

BTW, Cass’ report is 388 pages long, including appendices.  Please respond if you can honestly tell me you read all 388 pages.

Good luck drawing out a thread of honesty or decency from JK Rowling. Tilting at windmills at this point.

[Fragile Bird]

2 hours ago, Spockydog said:

Let's see if this guy is pursued by the Gammon Press as vigourously as Angela Raynor.

 

 

What the actual hell is going on? Why would the debt be “nullified”? Who is this guy?

[Zorral]

The medications, the procedures effectiveness and outcomes increased, as in the medical world procedures and medications for everything improve over time from their first innovations.  Even, at least for a while, the costs of all this also decreased, while becoming more accessible. In case somebody doesn't know this, for quite some time to have certain procedures to transition meant very expensive surgery and / or flying to a distant country and lengthy stay.  All of this was a lot more expensive, particularly the flying parts back before the 80's.  Tickets to Rio, wherw!

In the last decades, at the same time more and more people learned that there was the ability to become what they'd always felt they were.  For this latter blame the innernezes.  

Edited April 12 by Zorral

[Maltaran]

11 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

What the actual hell is going on? Why would the debt be “nullified”? Who is this guy?

Big Tory donor and the chairman of JCB

[TrackerNeil]

7 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Yeah. It would be like saying there’s been a massive jump in gay people since 30 years ago. No, people no longer feel they have to hide it or be in denial about it.

That's one possibility, sure, but not the only one. For myself, if the number of people self-reporting as gay suddenly skyrocketed, I'd probably ask questions, too.

[Conflicting Thought]

1 minute ago, TrackerNeil said:

That's one possibility, sure, but not the only one. For myself, if the number of people self-reporting as gay suddenly skyrocketed, I'd probably ask questions, too.

why does it matter if there is more people identifying as gay or trans? how does that affect you or society in general? is it worse somehow that more people indetify as trans? is it a "contagion" like some very good people are saying? i dont understand how this affects anyone appart from the person that is gay or trans or whatever

[Zorral]

Has anyone ever run a data spreadsheet on the ratio of great, effective generals who are gay vs. those who were/are not?  And I'm thinking here only of those history has left us a record of in terms of their preferences.  Imagine ... how many gay successful warriors there have been / are who have kept their preferences to themselves.  I mean really, here is just one part of life in which sexual or gender preference makes no difference to anything.  Sheesh.

Though of course, generally, people who are happy, fulfilled and living the life they want to live aren't particularly warlike.  But then Hadrian, for example, came out of a time, a culture, a class, a family in which being a successful military fellow was what did make a lot of his ilks happy, fulfilled and was the life they wanted to live. 

Edited April 12 by Zorral

[TrackerNeil]

12 minutes ago, Conflicting Thought said:

why does it matter if there is more people identifying as gay or trans? how does that affect you or society in general? is it worse somehow that more people indetify as trans? is it a "contagion" like some very good people are saying? i dont understand how this affects anyone appart from the person that is gay or trans or whatever

I suppose it doesn't, unless the folks in question are asking for medicalization, in which case I don't think it's unreasonable to wonder what might be happening. 

[Heartofice]

 

12 minutes ago, Conflicting Thought said:

why does it matter if there is more people identifying as gay or trans? how does that affect you or society in general? is it worse somehow that more people indetify as trans? is it a "contagion" like some very good people are saying? i dont understand how this affects anyone appart from the person that is gay or trans or whatever

You are clearly missing the point. 
 

There is a large increase in the number of children reporting to gender clinics within a small time period.

It really isn’t realistic to suggest this is just a natural increase, that these are just kids who suddently feel free enough to express themselves. The rise is too large, and it went from being mostly always young biological males, as had been the pattern for decades, to suddenly being overwhelming young biological females.

So something changed. 
 

Again, it doesn’t matter too much about the numbers if the kids are correctly diagnosed and given the appropriate care. But we know that wasn’t happening. Children who were autistic, or who had mental health issues were just waved through and given life altering treatments. 
 

So please, take your ideological hat off for a second and actually engage with that is being said. That could apply to almost everyone on this thread, it’s incredible how resistant you all are to evidence if it doesn’t fit your prejudices.

[kissdbyfire]

16 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

It really isn’t realistic to suggest this is just a natural increase, that these are just kids who suddently feel free enough to express themselves.

Right. Then what do you think is behind the numbers presented? Because so far all you’ve said is that everyone who isn’t you is wrong and that there’s something behind the numbers that has nothing to do with a natural increase or any issue handling the data, or the statistics or whatever. So let’s hear it, what do you think is happening? 

[DMC]

16 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

it’s incredible how resistant you all are to evidence if it doesn’t fit your prejudices.

Please cite the evidence that autistic children were given treatment against their and/or their parents’ will.  Again, honest question.  I dunno what’s going on in the UK.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

There is a large increase if your focus is percentage. If you have a penny and I give you a quarter, that's a large increase in what you have, but it's still just a quarter. If you have $1,000 and I give you a quarter it's minimal. The value of the quarter doesn't change. I'm not going to read a study that long for fun, but from what I've seen there is a heavy focus on the change in percentage, not the raw numbers and the part linked seems pretty dismissive of societal changes because it doesn't fit the narrative being presented by the author.

[Heartofice]

2 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Right. Then what do you think is behind the numbers presented? Because so far all you’ve said is that everyone who isn’t you is wrong and that there’s something behind the numbers that has nothing to do with a natural increase or any issue handling the data, or the statistics or whatever. So let’s hear it, what do you think is happening? 

Well firstly it’s not just me who thinks that, it’s in the Cass review.

Personally I think the numbers track pretty well with increases in mental health issues, especially in young girls. And importantly, track really cleanly only the time when everyone started getting phones and access to the internet. I’d suggest the internet has caused a lot of people to become uncomfortable with their bodies and possibly sexuality. 

[Matrim Fox Cauthon]

25 minutes ago, TrackerNeil said:

I suppose it doesn't, unless the folks in question are asking for medicalization, in which case I don't think it's unreasonable to wonder what might be happening. 

Considering the various health and medical issues involved for people who identify as trans or gender non-conforming, I'm not sure why there is need to view it with such heavy level of suspicions that you seemingly do. 

[Heartofice]

14 minutes ago, DMC said:

Please cite the evidence that autistic children were given treatment against their and/or their parents’ will.  Again, honest question.  I dunno what’s going on in the UK.

Where did I say autistic children were given treatment against their or their parents will? Are you just distracted because you are trying to understand how this new fangled internet works?

[DMC]

Just now, Heartofice said:

Where did I say autistic children were given treatment against their or their parents will? Are you just distracted because you are trying to understand how this new fangled internet works?

You said:

38 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

Children who were autistic, or who had mental health issues were just waved through and given life altering treatments. 

This seems like fear rhetoric.  Why?  Because why shouldn’t those with autism or mental health issues be afforded the same health care as everyone else?  Why are you singling them out?  Why is it apparently a problem that they “were just waved through” as opposed to every other kid?

I’m trying to give you the benefit of the doubt that the reason you’re emphasizing that aspect of the population is due to some type of lack of understanding or willingness on behalf of those kids.  Otherwise, considering them in a different manner to the rest of the population is by definition bigoted.  

Further, acting as if everyone that is challenging your claims is “ideological” while you somehow aren’t is the height of comedy.