Hobbit Movie discussion II - Here be Spoilers

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

DP

[Stannis Eats No Peaches]

Orcs, Dwarves, Elves, Eagles so at the very least four.

Five. You forgot about the were-worms. :P

[HexMachina]

Five. You forgot about the were-worms. :P

And surely Legolas counts as his very own army?

[Derfel Cadarn]

Finally saw it, and it was less bad than I thought it would be reading some comments here.

-Smaug's attack on Laketown was visually amazing. The improvised elbow (har har) was a bit silly and Smaug showed Bond Villain levels of stupid, but he's a supremely arrogant dragon so I guess it works.

-The White Council battle I liked a lot. Would have liked Saruman to do something else than whack Nazguls with his staff, but it was a great action scene. Dark Galadriel looked just as silly as in FOTR however.

-Thorin's descent into madness was well done overall, but the bit where he shouts at Bilbo in slow-motion was just laughable if you ask me. The acid trip in the main hall afterwards was barely better.

-Speaking of Bilbo, Martin Freeman is a great actor who was criminally underused. I don't understand why they had screentime on Alfrid, of all people, when the titular Hobbit gets so little.

-The Tauriel-Legolas-Fili love triangle gets a resolution that actually works IMO. It doesn't make up for how much screentime this completely unrequired sub-plot took, but the conclusion was a really sad moment.

-Am I the only one who thinks Thranduil is portrayed like Denethor should have been in RotK? He's a jerk, but he's got understandable reasons to be one, and he ends up not being a complete asshole. He's probably the only grey character in a movie full of heroes and villains.

-The titular battle was hit and miss. Some parts looked really good (the dwarven shield wall) and the Thorin-Azog duel was pretty amazing. Other parts were just choke-full of bad CGI, and if you thought Legolas's rampage in RotK was bad, the one in this movie is just stupid. It's also funny how the Orcs actually used good strategy (divide and conquer your foes, surprise attacks, holding formation, siege weapons, signals to direct troops, anticipating an attack on the commander) while the heroes basically charged into the fray and won by the sheer power of plot armor.

-Dain is a cliche violent dwarf with an overdone scottish accent, and I loved every second of his screentime. That is all.

-The movie leaves several plot threads hanging. What happened to the Arkenstone? What's the ultimate fate of Laketown? Who gets to be King Under The Mountain? How is the treasure ultimately divided? I know the book resolves them, and the inevitable extended edition probably does, but there are still pretty important informations missing from the theatrical cut.

Overall I'd say it's a lot better than the second movie and slightly worse than the first. The trilogy overall is still way below the LOTR classics, but they are enjoyable enough.

Overdone scottish accent??? That's Billy Connelly's actual accent :p

[Corvinus85]

Orcs, Dwarves, Elves, Eagles so at the very least four.

Eagles were never counted in the book as being one of the armies, but I guess with the movie anything goes. I really don't know why they didn't put an army of wargs in the movie. They had wargs in the previous movies, here there were a total of 2, and used only on the march.

[Jasta11]

It was a bit, but they needed to make his voice deeper so he sounded like Smaug.

Making his voice deeper is one thing, but it looked like Thorin was trying to scare a 5 years old or something. I don't think it was required besides, they had already established the dragon sickness was tearing at him. It's a minor quibble anyway.

@Leap: Well I'd say that ''under a lot of strain'' was what Denethor should have been in the first half of RotK, like he was in the book. Instead they kinda made him a full on villain almost instantly, which was less interesting.

[Kelli Fury]

Nerds- what does beardless dwarf say to Lost girl on the beach in dwarvish? They subtitle everything else and I can't say I care about their storyline at all, but goddamnit why is this information withheld

[The BlackBear]

Nerds- what does beardless dwarf say to Lost girl on the beach in dwarvish? They subtitle everything else and I can't say I care about their storyline at all, but goddamnit why is this information withheld

Surely it was just: 'I love you.' Which is why he says she understands even if we she doesn't understand the language.

[Dofs]

Ok, so the whole point of the movie was "who gets the mountain/its treasures". Thorin wanted to have Arkenstone as a proof that he was the king, dwarves overall wanted to rebuild their kingdom, the elves wanted their treasures from the mountain, men wanted to get the payment for their help. Thorin refused both elves and men. That was the beginning of the entire conflict. So how come that the resolution to it all was cut ? The last scenes with the dwarfs were them standing over Thorin's body and then saying goodbye to Bilbo.So, who gets the Mountain, what happens with Arkenstone - you know - the entire point of the whole trilogy? And what happens with Bard and men of Laketown - one of the initiators of the whole conflict of the movie? The last scene with them was when they were still fighting orcs in Dale and then they all get forgotten. I know that everything will be in EE, but still, to cut it all from the theatrical release is just wow. Shows how much Jackson cared about the story. And makes the theatrical release version a dumb and pointless action feast.

[Raksha 2014]

Ok, so the whole point of the movie was "who gets the mountain/its treasures". Thorin wanted to have Arkenstone as a proof that he was the king, dwarves overall wanted to rebuild their kingdom, the elves wanted their treasures from the mountain, men wanted to get the payment for their help. Thorin refused both elves and men. That was the beginning of the entire conflict. So how come that the resolution to it all was cut ? The last scenes with the dwarfs were them standing over Thorin's body and then saying goodbye to Bilbo.So, who gets the Mountain, what happens with Arkenstone - you know - the entire point of the whole trilogy? And what happens with Bard and men of Laketown - one of the initiators of the whole conflict of the movie? The last scene with them was when they were still fighting orcs in Dale and then they all get forgotten. I know that everything will be in EE, but still, to cut it all from the theatrical release is just wow. Shows how much Jackson cared about the story. And makes the theatrical release version a dumb and pointless action feast.

Maybe if there had been two minutes seconds less of those unfunny Alfrid moments, we could have seen Thorin buried with the Arkenstone and Bard accepting the kingship of Dale. A minute less of Legolas' aerial maneuvers, and we could have seen Dain named King Under the Mountain, and so on.

[Howdyphillip]

Nerds- what does beardless dwarf say to Lost girl on the beach in dwarvish? They subtitle everything else and I can't say I care about their storyline at all, but goddamnit why is this information withheld

I can help...

He says that he thought that he saw a polar bear driving a 1973 VW van,,,

[Wmarshal]

Not that bad, could it include some more king crowning? Sure, but as a film it was good enough, better then the second do to boss fighting by the dwarves, the elves though...

[jobmartell]

So, the last time we see the arkinstone (sp?) In Bot5A, bard has it hostage. Then.....we never see it? So, where'd it go? Also, is it canon that a 100 or so villagers, armed with spoons and shovels decided to war aganist an army orcs because of cash owned to them?

[Wmarshal]

So, the last time we see the arkinstone (sp?) In Bot5A, bard has it hostage. Then.....we never see it? So, where'd it go? Also, is it canon that a 100 or so villagers, armed with spoons and shovels decided to war aganist an army orcs because of cash owned to them?

Yeah, that was a huge plot hole that could have been solved really easy, Jackson should have cut some of the filler so that could have been fitted in, but we had was not to terrible.

[Talleyrand]

I feel sorry for the orcs "bred for war" and getting killed by some refugees with shovels and pitchforks

[Veltigar]

I feel sorry for the orcs "bred for war" and getting killed by some refugees with shovels and pitchforks

That's what Sauron gets for producing his orcs in low-wage countries. You get what you pay for :p

[Corvinus85]

That's what Sauron gets for producing his orcs in low-wage countries. You get what you pay for :P

Gundabad clearly needs to be sued for false advertisement.

[The BlackBear]

All the badguys got nerfed though. The Nazgul were pathetic.

[Dofs]

I feel sorry for the orcs "bred for war" and getting killed by some refugees with shovels and pitchforks

As stupid, as it sounds, it doesn't even come close to the complete idiocy when Bilbo knocked out some orcs by throwing tiny stones at them.

[Tears of Lys]

I liked it... I'm a sucker for this kind of movie ... I realize that they've been milking the original LOTR trilogy ... but it's still good fun to me....

....*but* .... I'm calling Malarkey on the whole "5" armies thing.... 2 of the 5 were Orc armies... which really makes them the same army.... and the townfolk weren't an army... they were just a bunch of hobos with sticks.... So the title should have been "battle of the 3 armies, plus some angry villagers and a really cool ride-able elk"

But that might have been tough to fit on the box

I haven't seen it yet, but this is exactly how I know I'll feel.

Plus, I **have** seen the rideable elk, and I WANT ONE. Those antlers alone would clear away a crowd while I'm post-Christmas shopping. :P