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Better Call Saul -- Season 4 Better Get Emmy

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1 hour ago, Ran said:

The episode title makes me worry for Werner.

I think he's toast, it's even possible that they kill all the Germans and wait a year or two before they fully finish the lab...which could be the reason for the delay.

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So I'm finally caught up. Even though I binged the last 5 episodes, I have to say that the pacing of this season has been painfully slow. Also feel that too much time has been devoted to the lab storyline which has been a complete snoozefest imo. Did enjoy the last episode though - Kim breaking bad is something I did not see coming at all. 

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Werner lives!  ..For one more episode.  Kim just can't quit Jimmy.  Gilligan really likes filming key meetups on top of parking garages.  Anyone else think the new Salamanca nephew looks like a Latino version of Steven Ogg - Simon from Walking Dead and Rebus from Westworld?  Also, how many nephews of Hector's did Gus have to kill to take out the entire Salamanca name?

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The bell origin story!

You're always down.  Cold

Oh Mike, gonna need a full measure here.

Run Nacho Run.

Lalo, fucking bat shit insane Salamancas, I like they are all a slightly different flavor of killer.

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17 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

The bell origin story!

Have to admit, my first reaction was "really, the fucking bell needs a story?"

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Jimmy just can't get out of his own way. Practices his interview and then can't understand why it doesn't seem sincere. Kim nailed him dead to rights, you are always down Jimmy.... always in a bind, looking for the easy way out or an angle to cut. She may help him appeal this and then vanish taking the poor goldfish with her to save it.

When Mike and the red shirts were watching the cameras and listening in to the phone call I thought Mike was going to pick up on some code words in the conversation but no, instead Werner pulls a prison break. RIP Werner, we barely knew ya!

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42 minutes ago, dbunting said:

Jimmy just can't get out of his own way. Practices his interview and then can't understand why it doesn't seem sincere.

Jimmy's unwillingness to confront Chuck's death was the central conflict of the entire season.  I love how the committee simply cited "insincerity" as the reason for voting him down.  Seems strangely topical.

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I'm listening to the BCS Insider Podcast, and Vince Gilligan said this:

"It's always easier to make the characters be dumb just to get away with something. Don't ever take that shortcut. It is a terrible terrible terrible shortcut to take that you move the plot forward by a character being dumb. It's just a terrible shortcut, don't do it."

Also here's the finale preview... Will Nacho and his dad make it out alive? Kim? Werner? The goldfish?

 

Edited by Le Cygne

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On 10/2/2018 at 5:30 AM, Consigliere said:

So I'm finally caught up. Even though I binged the last 5 episodes, I have to say that the pacing of this season has been painfully slow. Also feel that too much time has been devoted to the lab storyline which has been a complete snoozefest imo. Did enjoy the last episode though - Kim breaking bad is something I did not see coming at all. 

Yeah, I'm not convinced that the show is that great without the Chuck-Jimmy conflict to drive it along. I don't care enough about Nacho for the Cartel storyline to be that interesting, particularly when we know what happens to Gus, Mike and the Salamancas. 

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Well, I still think this has been the weakest year.  It has had some great segments, but a lot of lulls.  Still think we didn't need to know about how the lab got built.  It's hard to imagine Werner could be that naive....

Homicidal Lalo very entertaining.  

Rhea better get a fucking Emmy.  

 

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Saw that final scene with Kim coming from a mile away, but it was still great. 

Looking forward to seeing full on Saul Goodman next season. 

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7 hours ago, Nictarion said:

Saw that final scene with Kim coming from a mile away, but it was still great. 

Looking forward to seeing full on Saul Goodman next season. 

The look on her face was priceless

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7 hours ago, Nictarion said:

Saw that final scene with Kim coming from a mile away, but it was still great. 

Looking forward to seeing full on Saul Goodman next season. 

I didn't even realise it was the finale until I read it here. I agree it was probably the weakest season but this demonstrates how a great show can have an "off" season and still be far better than most other shows on TV. I'm sure it'll still be very high in my year list.

The guest appearance of Chuck I think cemented what was missing this season. Him and the brotherly conflict.

I also agree I saw it coming from a mile off that his speech was a ruse. Although I'm sure he was sincere that he wished he could have written chuck a letter and that he'd do something else if he failed. What was slightly off for me was Kim believing him - she should be able to pick up on the insincerity if the viewer can. I'll give her the benefit of the doubt as she could only hear him and not see his face.

I'm not sure what's going on with Nacho. It's like they can't decide to make him a central character or not. I know he's popping up in a few films so it could be scheduling but it just seems odd how he disappears for episodes and keeps being displaced by other cartel characters.

The bunker plot at least didn't go the obvious "Kai screws it up" route but I echo others in thinking Werner was uncharacteristically naive. There's no way he couldn't have realised he was working with dangerous criminals. I also wonder if the remaining team finished the job? It still looked a bit rough in the final scene featuring it.

Lastly I feel like I've missed/forgotten the transition from Mike killing people who are dangerous/deserving to killing whoever Gus tells him to. Werner was an idiot but a "good man". I guess this could be the point where Mike sees anyone who can threaten his livelihood as a threat. That and he knows not following orders from Gus will get him killed.

Has there been any word on whether season 5 is the last one? Unless future seasons cover post breaking bad stories I feel one more season is probably enough for the show.

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10 minutes ago, red snow said:

I also agree I saw it coming from a mile off that his speech was a ruse. Although I'm sure he was sincere that he wished he could have written chuck a letter and that he'd do something else if he failed. What was slightly off for me was Kim believing him - she should be able to pick up on the insincerity if the viewer can. I'll give her the benefit of the doubt as she could only hear him and not see his face.

I was actually suckered by the speech, because he went off script and that's something only Kim (and we) knew, which would make it seem he was going to be honest. And then, no, he wasn't, which I realized from his ebullience a few seconds before Kim realized. So I had that going for me. I thought it was really well played.

10 minutes ago, red snow said:

I'm not sure what's going on with Nacho. It's like they can't decide to make him a central character or not. I know he's popping up in a few films so it could be scheduling but it just seems odd how he disappears for episodes and keeps being displaced by other cartel characters.

That's probably my only real disappointment with this season. Nacho's story started strong this season but then was stuck in a holding pattern. I do like Lalo, though -- a very charismatic performance from Tony Dalton.

10 minutes ago, red snow said:

The bunker plot at least didn't go the obvious "Kai screws it up" route but I echo others in thinking Werner was uncharacteristically naive. There's no way he couldn't have realised he was working with dangerous criminals.

I'm sure he knew. But I think he over-estimated his own importance to them, and his ability to do things in a way that would assuage their concerns. What I personally don't understand is why they didn't just agree to fly the wife over, let him have a weekend get-away in some rented luxury cabin in the mountains with some of Mike's men watching him, and be done with it. Their failure to bend has likely left the project dead in the water for months, I'd think, as they'll have to assemble a new team under a new lead engineer -- unless they plan to go with the French guy? I'm doubtful.

10 minutes ago, red snow said:

I also wonder if the remaining team finished the job? It still looked a bit rough in the final scene featuring it.

From what Mike said, they were cutting their losses and sending them all back to Germany. 

10 minutes ago, red snow said:

Lastly I feel like I've missed/forgotten the transition from Mike killing people who are dangerous/deserving to killing whoever Gus tells him to. Werner was an idiot but a "good man". I guess this could be the point where Mike sees anyone who can threaten his livelihood as a threat. That and he knows not following orders from Gus will get him killed.

I think it has more to do with the fact that it was Mike's fault that this happened, and it was his mess to clean up. He didn't handle Werner correctly, leading to his escape, and then he failed to cover his tracks in pursuit of him,, which led to Lalo getting information from Werner. That leak, the fact that it revealed something was going on to the Salamancas (even if, as Mike [falsely] claimed Lalo got no other information), is what signed Werner's death warrant -- before Fring heard about that, he seemed willing to let Mike deal with it entirely.

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10 hours ago, Cas Stark said:

Well, I still think this has been the weakest year.  It has had some great segments, but a lot of lulls.  Still think we didn't need to know about how the lab got built.  It's hard to imagine Werner could be that naive....

Homicidal Lalo very entertaining.  

Rhea better get a fucking Emmy. 

I agree, it was hard to suspend disbelief that Werner could be that naive. He was blindfolded to get in there, they are obviously breaking the law in a huge way, but hey, just run off. I also think Mike would have warned him more strongly before.

I thought it was a good season, but I have a similar problem with Kim getting teary eyed over Jimmy's I hope I can be as good as Chuck bit. He was laying it on so thick, and she knows better than anyone how Chuck screwed Jimmy over.

Maybe she could just see what it did to him, and it was hard to see that. I like the overall arc of the story, though. That he realized they'd never give him a chance, and he'd have to play it another way. And that he broke down when he realized this.

Also three cheers for the goldfish...

Edited by Le Cygne

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A terrific finale to the show's worst season (still great though). Like others who wrote here, I wish they'd give more screentime to Nachos; a tremendously fascinating character.

That shot with Mike shooting Werner gotta be the more gorgeous the show's ever had.

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The Werner thing, while heartbreaking, it didn't really ring true to me.  You arrive and have a bag put over your head, you're building a top secret lab for 1) guy who is equal parts assassin/cop 2) everyone else has distinct cartel vibe  3) money is no object....and yet he thinks he can leave and go to a resort for the weekend?  The fuck.  Mike definitely should have let him see his wife, which I'm sure he realizes and that makes it that much more awful...but it seemed a little bit of a false note and not enough pay off for ALL the time spent on it.

I was surprised that Kim believed his spiel, but then she loves him and wants him to succeed.

I can't see the show going more than 1 year though.

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7 hours ago, Le Cygne said:

I agree, it was hard to suspend disbelief that Werner could be that naive. He was blindfolded to get in there, they are obviously breaking the law in a huge way, but hey, just run off. I also think Mike would have warned him more strongly before.

I thought it was a good season, but I have a similar problem with Kim getting teary eyed over Jimmy's I hope I can be as good as Chuck bit. He was laying it on so thick, and she knows better than anyone how Chuck screwed Jimmy over.

Maybe she could just see what it did to him, and it was hard to see that. I like the overall arc of the story, though. That he realized they'd never give him a chance, and he'd have to play it another way. And that he broke down when he realized this.

Also three cheers for the goldfish...

Still alive!  I hope Kim leaves and takes goldfish w/her.

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