Watch, Watched, Watching: From Scott Civil Wars to Christmas Movie Wars

[Annara Snow]

Finished Beef, and it's definitely one of my favorite shows of the year, right up there with the final seasons of (fellow dark tragicomedy-dramas) Succession and Barry.

The story didn't go quite as I first expected it, in the best way. The soundtrack was perfect - you can see it was chosen by people who really used to listen to the 1990s alt rock, because it's not just the most obvious or famous songs or artists. I was reminded of some of the songs I used to love I hadn't heard in many years. That made the show very relatable... that, and the Sacramento Kings references Steven Yeun's character kept making (being a Kings fan, now that's early 2000s pain ).

Gotta hand it to Steven Yeun, the three roles I've seen him in have all been completely different and he was great in all of them: good guy zombie killer in TWD, slick psycho rich guy in Burning, messy loser who can't do his construction work right in Beef.

[Mexal]

4 minutes ago, Annara Snow said:

Finished Beef, and it's definitely one of my favorite shows of the year, right up there with the final seasons of (fellow dark tragicomedy-dramas) Succession and Barry.

The story didn't go quite as I first expected it, in the best way. The soundtrack was perfect - you can see it was chosen by people who really used to listen to the 1990s alt rock, because it's not just the most obvious or famous songs or artists. I was reminded of some of the songs I used to love I hadn't heard in many years. That made the show very relatable... that, and the Sacramento Kings references Steven Yeun's character kept making (being a Kings fan, now that's early 2000s pain ).

Gotta hand it to Steven Yeun, the three roles I've seen him in have all been completely different and he was great in all of them: good guy zombie killer in TWD, slick psycho rich guy in Burning, messy loser who can't do his construction work right in Beef.

Should add Minari to the mix. Immigrant who moves his family to Arkansas and proceeds to have issues. Great movie and Yuen was fantastic (and different hence the rec). 

[Annara Snow]

23 minutes ago, Mexal said:

Should add Minari to the mix. Immigrant who moves his family to Arkansas and proceeds to have issues. Great movie and Yuen was fantastic (and different hence the rec). 

I haven't seen it but it's on my watchlist.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

The Creator

I thought it was a little messy in parts. A couple of things didn’t make sense.** I can’t say I was blown away by it but yeah, it was pretty good. It’s like someone took the first chapter of The Second Renaissance from The Animatrix and adapted it into a feature film.
 

Edwards definitely knows how to shoot an amazing looking sci-fi movie on a budget. 

** the thing I don’t get:

Spoiler

At the end when the general brings Joshua to the facility to deactivate Alphie with the EMP, he says “She won’t let us do it. The alternative would be unimaginably painful.”

What the fuck does he care? These guys have been shooting and bombing AI’s throughout the entire movie. They don’t even see them as sentient, much less entitled to humane treatment. And this one is an existential threat by their reckoning. Put a slug in her dome and be done with it.

… OhMyGawd! Rise of Skywalker is on the TeeVee! They just got to that insane scene with the dagger on the Death Star planet. Christmas came twice this year, you bastards. 

Edited December 26, 2023 by Deadlines? What Deadlines?

[Gigei]

Someone recommended For All Mankind to me, and I liked Joel Kinnaman in Altered carbon so I'm giving it a try. The first episode was strong, but the others, not so much. I guess I'll continue watching it, but it's not my favorite. Something about it isn't quite gelling for me. I'm at episode 6.

Love the look of it though! The actors are also really good!

[Ser Rodrigo Belmonte II]

13 minutes ago, Gigei said:

Someone recommended For All Mankind to me, and I liked Joel Kinnaman in Altered carbon so I'm giving it a try. The first episode was strong, but the others, not so much. I guess I'll continue watching it, but it's not my favorite. Something about it isn't quite gelling for me. I'm at episode 6.

Love the look of it though! The actors are also really good!

It only goes downhill from Season 1 btw….

[Gigei]

2 hours ago, Ser Rodrigo Belmonte II said:

It only goes downhill from Season 1 btw….

Oh no.

Well, I think it might be because it's really super heavy and dramatic? I mean, it lacks that element of fun, joy, and cozy that would balance out all the doom and gloom.

[Ser Rodrigo Belmonte II]

4 minutes ago, Gigei said:

Oh no.

Well, I think it might be because it's really super heavy and dramatic? I mean, it lacks that element of fun, joy, and cozy that would balance out all the doom and gloom.

Nope , it’s because it becomes stupid, illogical, abandons any form of scientific realism and has obnoxious characters.

[kissdbyfire]

I tried watching The Withcher: Blood Origin. I couldn't. It's easily one of the worst things ever seen on TV. 

[KingAerys_II]

Interstellar : Visionary , it makes me think that artificial intelligence is important for the space and it's useful for the mankind to survive.
Then the use of hybernation is interesting too, anyway , the movie is famous for the legendary soundtrack , but it's contradictory the fact humans were able to manipulate gravity but they were unable to reverse the situation in Earth.
The manipulation of gravity makes humans fourth dimensional beings that are able to influence the past, time is not linear , the humans of the future helped humans to survive 
 

[KingAerys_II]

Hans Zimmer soundtracks are awesome

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

Wet Hot American Summer is not a great film, but the constant increasing absurdity is amazing. I've always loved this scene:
 

 

[Veltigar]

Watched the South Park (Not Suitable for Children) special and I liked it a lot. I'm very happy that we still get South Park and that the creative team gets to explore different formats. I don't think they are anywhere near their best level, but it's still reliable enjoyment. This special felt like a good step forward from the previous specials, with a good coherent plot and a use for the runtime. I hope they can build further on this for future specials.

I watched The Sound of Music on Christmas Eve. This film is wild, and I was struck not only by the fact that I didn't care much for some of the songs, but also the societal message included in them. Particularly the song of the eldest (clearly twentysomething actress pretending to be a teenager) daughter and her beau was quite cringy. Glad to have seen it and the IMDB trivia for the film is quite funny, but not something I think I'll want to watch every holiday.

I also kept on going with Reacher. Finished season 1 and I'm now in season 2. This series is definitely lit, but my earlier review has basically not changed. My fears became true, but there was enough action and narrative drive to offset the unfortunate anthology feeling that I do kind of feel hovering around the edges of my screen whenever I watch it.

Season two so far has managed to introduce a bunch of good new supporting characters, but I do agree that it is leaning into the tropes a bit more. I also wonder what they'll pull out of their hat for a third season, because I do think these type of stories are enhanced when something feels more personal to the inscrutable protagonist. I'm not entirely sure whether this will still be as engrossing as it is currently if they introduce a random mystery that doesn't really tie into Reacher's life. 

On 12/23/2023 at 8:32 PM, Zorral said:

Second season still eminently watchable, partially due to pace, partially because the actors who play Reacher and his gang are eminently watchable -- one does love looking at them.  But second season got a bit softer, liking itself and the tropes just a bit too much.

Also, for Reacher novel readers, putting him in a group of old friends/colleagues so soon, is just not Our Reacher, who travels alone, and makes friends along the way as the white knight errant rights wrongs and saves the weak, helpless and innocent.

Yet, as stated above -- I still like it -- just wish it wasn't quite that bit more 'soft.'   Of course, the second season isn't finished yet.

 

I agree with your take so far. I still have not seen all episodes that are out of the second season, but they did manage to get a good bunch of actors together to portray some interesting characters.

I do wonder how they'll handle a third season. Like I wrote above, it feels like they plundered the well dry with significant characters from his past (unless his French grandfather rises from the grave to reclaim his medal). If he now goes and does adventures with rando's I don't think it will feel as engaging. Hopefully @Mexal's take on it is more correct and they'll be able to get a model that works out of this, but we'll see this down the road.

 

On 12/24/2023 at 9:42 AM, polishgenius said:

Also the fact that it cost 15 million says Hollywood studios really need to have a think about how they use their budgets.

Since it's also been mentioned at length in the last two pages of this thread, I'd also throw The Creator some love on that front. It's not quite as big a discrepancy as with Godzilla Minus One, but The Creator is probably the best looking blockbuster I have seen all year and the budget was 80 million USD if I recall correctly.

Not sure what the average Hollywood blockbuster costs to produce, but I think it's probably about double. The execs really should call Edwards and Toho Studios to get some tips.

 

 

[Ran]

9 minutes ago, Veltigar said:

Not sure what the average Hollywood blockbuster costs to produce, but I think it's probably about double. The execs really should call Edwards and Toho Studios to get some tips.

Per The Numbers, 27 films were released this year with a budget of $100 million or higher. The average budget was $172 million. The highest budget was Fast X at a whopping $340 million.

31 films were released with a budget of $80 million (The Creator's reported budget) or higher, so just four films in that $80 to $100 million range (the others were Renfield, Ferrari, and Trolls Band Together.)

So, yeah, about double is right. Edwards is very, very good at figuring out pipelines to get incredible results within a tight budget. He's done it again and again. I remember years ago suggesting HBO talk to Edwards and hire him as a VFX lead, he was so good at stretching a dollar. Obviously, he went on to bigger and better things than VFX... but I'm hoping we'll see more from him. I really think CDPR should be talking to him about their live action Cyberpunk 2077 TV project.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

On 12/24/2023 at 1:42 AM, polishgenius said:

Also the fact that it cost 15 million says Hollywood studios really need to have a think about how they use their budgets.

 

16 minutes ago, Veltigar said:

Since it's also been mentioned at length in the last two pages of this thread, I'd also throw The Creator some love on that front. It's not quite as big a discrepancy as with Godzilla Minus One, but The Creator is probably the best looking blockbuster I have seen all year and the budget was 80 million USD if I recall correctly.

Not sure what the average Hollywood blockbuster costs to produce, but I think it's probably about double. The execs really should call Edwards and Toho Studios to get some tips.

Regarding the budget, has anyone done an analysis of how that was done? For example, does the Japanese government provide material assistance or subsidy for productions like this? Did they subcontract the VFX work to some sweatshop economy? Did the actors get paid? Does the exchange rate to the yen factor in at all?

[Ran]

1 minute ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

For example, does the Japanese government provide material assistance or subsidy for productions like this? Did they subcontract the VFX work to some sweatshop economy? Did the actors get paid? Does the exchange rate to the yen factor in at all?

Severe wage stagnation in Japan is one factor, and people involved in things like VFX and animation in Japan are paid shockingly low wages compared to what Western peers get. Someone cited a Japanese VFX company offering an entry-level VFX position for $1670 monthly salary... and that's with 50 hours of overtime already being factored in to the wage. And that's for a job with a listed working hours of 10 AM to 7PM.

Rent is very cheap in Tokyo, the housing market is actually quite great there for a number of reasons, but still. Japanese work culture is insane.

[polishgenius]

1 hour ago, Veltigar said:

Since it's also been mentioned at length in the last two pages of this thread, I'd also throw The Creator some love on that front. It's not quite as big a discrepancy as with Godzilla Minus One,

 

I'd say it is, to be fair. GZ-1 looks insane, but you can also see how it was a very trim production with the fx money aimed at a few specific moments. A pretty solid portion of it is either just in a single room in a house or on the little wooden boat they have, and even the attack on Tokyo shows one scene of destruction then implies the rest. Whereas I'm not sure there's a second of The Creator where the money isn't on screen. 
 

[Conflicting Thought]

35 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

 

Regarding the budget, has anyone done an analysis of how that was done? For example, does the Japanese government provide material assistance or subsidy for productions like this? Did they subcontract the VFX work to some sweatshop economy? Did the actors get paid? Does the exchange rate to the yen factor in at all?

about the vfx subcontraction, i dont know if that is a huge factor in cost reduction,for example  i know the  mayority of holywood movies that have costs superior to 100 mill have so ugly vfx cuz they subcontract and demand  of the workers that they do the vfx in very short times

[Padraig]

The early 1990s may have been peak film.  Original, well crafted material that was also popular with a broader audience.  You can definitively debate these things but it arguably has the definitive gangster movie (Goodfellas), the definitive western (the Unforgiven), the definitive serial killer movie (the Silence of the Lambs), the definitive movie about the Holocaust (Schindler's List, always relevant but seems even more timely currently) and the definitive whatever type of movie Pulp Fiction is (just calling it a Tarantino movie seems limiting but it is his magnus opus).

[dbunting]

4 hours ago, Veltigar said:

Season two so far has managed to introduce a bunch of good new supporting characters, but I do agree that it is leaning into the tropes a bit more. I also wonder what they'll pull out of their hat for a third season, because I do think these type of stories are enhanced when something feels more personal to the inscrutable protagonist. I'm not entirely sure whether this will still be as engrossing as it is currently if they introduce a random mystery that doesn't really tie into Reacher's life. 

 

Not sure how familiar you are with Reacher but that is exactly what the vast majority of the books are. He steps off a bus, helps a stranger and it turns out to be a big thing.  For a series it is good and bad. Each season is new characters except for Reacher, so salaries are low, but bad because you aren't as invested in them.

The Creator,  I just watched it over the weekend and wasn't blown away. I think I would have enjoyed it more in the theater on a very large screen. IDK I just didn't get into it.

Edited December 27, 2023 by dbunting
Format