[Spoilers] Episode 105 Discussion

[miyuki]

I continue to appreciate the rats.

[Sand11751]

Very disappointing about Criston Cole. I had so hoped, as the showrunners have done a decent job of fleshing out why broodmare and reluctant bedmate Alicent Hightower does as she does eventually, for a bit of fleshing out of Ser Criston's future motivations for being a turncloak. But we can't have everything. Instead, we got, "Come away with me and live poor and have cinnamon and orange-spiced married sex" immediately followed by, "I soiled my white cloak for you!" Later he BEATS THE FUTURE KING CONSORT. Ah, that's no big deal. Kills a man at a feast. Ah, no biggie. All so Alicent can have a pawn in her pocket? WTAF. 

And damned Viserys. Easily, the weakest Westerosi king ever. As Tywin Lannister said, "You really think a crown gives you power?"

Edited September 19, 2022 by Sand11751

[Takiedevushkikakzvezdy]

31 minutes ago, sifth said:

So Daemon killed is wife? I don't recall that being the book.

I think it's left ambiguous in the book?

[Mark Antony]

9 minutes ago, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

I think it's left ambiguous in the book?

Well Daemon was in the Stepstones when she fell from her horse so he definitely didn’t kill her himself according to the book. But he could have hired someone I suppose. 

[The hairy bear]

2 hours ago, Ran said:

It actually is. George introduced the idea in The World of Ice and Fire, specifically in "The Sons of the Dragon" material where it's stated that the Hightower's flame burned a "baleful green" as Lord Hightower gathered his banners.

Wow, that's cool.

48 minutes ago, sifth said:

So Daemon killed is wife? I don't recall that being the book.

Fire and Blood only says: "fell from her horse whilst hawking and cracked her skull upon a stone. She lingered for nine days before finally feeling well enough to leave her bed… only to collapse and die within an hour of rising."

We are specifically told that Daemon was at the Stepstones at the time, and of course, if Rhea had been attacked or had noticed anything weird, she would have stated while at bed. And most importantily, nor Septon Eustace (who is as anti-Daemon as anyone can be) nor Mushroom (who enjoys spreading the most baseless rumors and aggravating accusations) suggest that Daemon may have been the culprit.

[DMC]

Apparently Laenor and Rhaenyra's was a Dothraki wedding.

[miyuki]

10 hours ago, Corvinus85 said:

A great episode which really started the game of the thrones but was unfortunately nearly ruined by the rushed ending. 

Does anyone else wonder.... that they have cut too much in the post production? I recently saw images of Alicent in his wedding dress and apparently they filmed the Viserys-Alicent wedding but cut it out later. This episode was under 60 minutes long so maybe they cut something from here as well?

[Takiedevushkikakzvezdy]

20 minutes ago, DMC said:

Apparently Laenor and Rhaenyra's was a Dothraki wedding.

That requires at least three deaths, no?

[DMC]

3 minutes ago, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

That requires at least three deaths, no?

It was a joke.

[nara]

1 hour ago, miyuki said:

I continue to appreciate the rats.

Paving the way for Cheese’s grand entrance into the story

[miyuki]

9 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

This episode also reinforced my perception that HOTD is trying to be artistic and profound, which I think is a lot more admirable that GOT, which was just trying to make headlines. That said, sometimes people try a bit too hard to be profound and it turns a bit silly and self-serious, and that happens a lot on this show. 

Every episode seems to be about something rather than just checking up different locations and ending the episode with a twist that makes you want to see the next episode, which was the Game of Thrones formula. I've read online that some people mislike the time jumps or the fact that we're in the same place all the time but I feel it gives the show better cohesion, even if it often has scenes that overdo themselves to make a point a la the juxtaposition with the birthing scene and the overly violent tourney. But I really appreciate the show for at least trying to always make some point abut the stories it tells, because even though if doesn't always succeed 100%, it creates discussion about spicy topics such as women's agency, sex, reproductive rights and so on. Like a good fantasy story should be, it uses fictional world to tell us things about our real world, just like ASOIAF does. In it's 8 seasons, Game of Thrones never managed to do that despite GRRM's books giving them everything on a silver platter.

[Back in Black-Snow]

Did I see a bearded Mushroom banging on some drums?

[Ran]

12 minutes ago, Back in Black-Snow said:

Did I see a bearded Mushroom banging on some drums?

Yep.

[Caligula_K3]

1 hour ago, DMC said:

Apparently Laenor and Rhaenyra's was a Dothraki wedding.

A dull one, though! Only one death?

About House of Dragons vs. Game of Thrones and artistic intent - I think this is unfair to Game of Thrones. It's true that in the first two seasons of Game of Thrones (especially the second), episodes often felt just like a collection of scenes smashed together. From season 3 onwards, though, D&D became much better at making decisions about what storylines to include in each episode so that they'd have thematic, plot, or character resonance. Although season 5 gets a lot of flak, some of it deserved (hello Dorne), to me it remains a better season of TV than Season 2 for that reason.

House of the Dragons is shot in an artistic way and is more blatant about its themes ("NO WOMAN HAS EVER SAT THE IRON THRONE" - we get it, show, thanks). But I also don't think it's exploring much new ground. Game of Thrones certainly created lots of discussion about women's agency and power through characters like Cersei, Dany, Brienne, and Sansa - it just didn't need to announce it was doing it every time it did. I don't think House of Dragon's lack of subtlety is one of its virtues (see also: rat symbolism). Especially since it only has one plotline to focus on, vs. Game of Thrones' 10-15 at any given moment.

Edited September 19, 2022 by Caligula_K3

[Sandy Clegg]

Can anyone clear something up about the final scenes? 
 

Could just be weird editing, but how does Allicent manage to be in the godswood with Cristin Cole, yet also by the kings side during the wedding?

[EggBlue]

13 minutes ago, Sandy Clegg said:

Can anyone clear something up about the final scenes? 
 

Could just be weird editing, but how does Allicent manage to be in the godswood with Cristin Cole, yet also by the kings side during the wedding?

editing

[The Bard of Banefort]

14 minutes ago, Sandy Clegg said:

Can anyone clear something up about the final scenes? 
 

Could just be weird editing, but how does Allicent manage to be in the godswood with Cristin Cole, yet also by the kings side during the wedding?

The scene with Cole happened afterwards. It was just cut that way for dramatic effect.

[The Bard of Banefort]

Really wish they’d done something better with Rhaenyra’s hair. It ruined the whole look.

[Caligula_K3]

15 minutes ago, Sandy Clegg said:

Can anyone clear something up about the final scenes? 
 

Could just be weird editing, but how does Allicent manage to be in the godswood with Cristin Cole, yet also by the kings side during the wedding?

She's a wizard... And a thumping good one too, I'd say, once she's been trained up a little.

(But yeah, probably editing).

[miyuki]

44 minutes ago, Back in Black-Snow said:

Did I see a bearded Mushroom banging on some drums?

I fear it's more of a "I wished I saw a bearded Mushroom on some drums".

The show won't have Mushroom, because he is too similar to Tyrion. Shame, because his presence would make the entire show very very different. And the show's Saint Tyrion was nothing like Mushroom/Book Tyrion anyway, so even more shame.